News Forum - UKRAINE UPDATES

[Marble-eye]

9 minutes ago, Alavan said:

I am glad Western gouvernments are more level headed than some posters here on the forum. Listening to them we’d have WWIII before midnight

Of course nobody wants WW3, but on the other hand do we want Putin to have a free rein on how many countries he invaded and how many innocent people he murders.

If the reason is that we are allowing him to be doing all this slaughtering and invading other countries is because he has got nuclear weapons we may all as well just hide under the kitchen table and cower.

Can I put the question back to you, if Putin didn't have these nuclear missiles would you have a different take on the criminal act he has started.

I think it's a case of damned if we do and damned if we don't.

But if your next door neighbour kept attacking your wife and the reason you don't do anything is because he may set his vicious rottweiler on you, I think you would do something?

[Fluke]

6 minutes ago, Marble-eye said:

Of course nobody wants WW3, but on the other hand do we want Putin to have a free rein on how many countries he invaded and how many innocent people he murders.

If the reason is that we are allowing him to be doing all this slaughtering and invading other countries is because he has got nuclear weapons we may all as well just hide under the kitchen table and cower.

Can I put the question back to you, if Putin didn't have these nuclear missiles would you have a different take on the criminal act he has started.

I think it's a case of damned if we do and damned if we don't.

But if your next door neighbour kept attacking your wife and the reason you don't do anything is because he may set his vicious rottweiler on you, I think you would do something?

But this isnt a situation where anyone's next door neighbour with a Rottweiler  is attacking anyone's Wife and its rather irrelevant what peoples reaction would be IF Putin didnt have nuclear weapons . 

   He DOES have nuclear weapons and that fact needs to be taken into consideration when thinking about how to deal with the situation 

[Rookiescot]

45 minutes ago, KRLMRX said:

yes, the Russian Foreign Ministry reported that there are suspicions.  It remains to wait for evidence.  

But in general, this is not something unbelievable - politicians of the highest rank in Ukraine have repeatedly called for abandoning the nuclear-free status.  

At the last Munich Security Conference, Zelensky also hinted at this, threatening to refuse to implement the Budapest Memorandum (Ukraine's renunciation of nuclear weapons in exchange for security guarantees)

https://www.rebelnews.com/zelensky_suggests_ukraine_may_pursue_nuclear_weapons

Rebel news?

Why not just post a link to the National socialist German workers party?

 

[KRLMRX]

12 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Rebel news?

Why not just post a link to the National socialist German workers party?

what is worse than BBC?

https://youtu.be/kALDpYgcrx0

[vlad]

1 hour ago, KRLMRX said:

yes, the Russian Foreign Ministry reported that there are suspicions.  It remains to wait for evidence.  

But in general, this is not something unbelievable - politicians of the highest rank in Ukraine have repeatedly called for abandoning the nuclear-free status.  

At the last Munich Security Conference, Zelensky also hinted at this, threatening to refuse to implement the Budapest Memorandum (Ukraine's renunciation of nuclear weapons in exchange for security guarantees)

https://www.rebelnews.com/zelensky_suggests_ukraine_may_pursue_nuclear_weapons

Im not interested in what he said in Munich I've asked you if you believe all the BS and lies. Also have the Russian media filmed the body bags returning to Russia.

[vlad]

2 hours ago, Poolie said:

So it says.

Says were from ?

[vlad]

1 hour ago, Fluke said:

But this isnt a situation where anyone's next door neighbour with a Rottweiler  is attacking anyone's Wife and its rather irrelevant what peoples reaction would be IF Putin didnt have nuclear weapons . 

   He DOES have nuclear weapons and that fact needs to be taken into consideration when thinking about how to deal with the situation 

We in Europe also have a Nuclear Arsenal so he doesn't scare us.

[vlad]

55 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Rebel news?

Why not just post a link to the National socialist German workers party?

There is no evidence Rookie just silly playground banter. They're now saying the Maternity hospital bombing is fake news. A question to our Comrade " why has Chernobyl had its power cut? are there Ukranian Air to Air missiles parked in the car park.

[Marble-eye]

1 hour ago, vlad said:

Im not interested in what he said in Munich I've asked you if you believe all the BS and lies. Also have the Russian media filmed the body bags returning to Russia.

As far as that can be ascertained there appears to be mobile crematoriums following their troops into the conflict and disposing of the fallen as and when.

Putin doesn't want the body bags to be seen returning.

"If I was a soldier and knew that my generals had so little faith in me that they followed me around the battlefield with a mobile crematorium, or I was the mother or father of a son, potentially deployed into a combat zone, and my government thought that the way to cover up loss was mobile crematorium, I'd be deeply, deeply worried."

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/russia-deploys-mobile-crematoriums-follow-26314565

[Alavan]

1 hour ago, vlad said:

We in Europe also have a Nuclear Arsenal so he doesn't scare us.

Your logic is that you don’t care if he kills you and your hometown because you can retaliate. 
At the end the result is death for everybody on both sides.
Who wins?

[Rookiescot]

2 hours ago, KRLMRX said:

what is worse than BBC?

https://youtu.be/kALDpYgcrx0

Does the Ukraine think it was a mistake to give up their nukes given they have now been invaded by Russia?

Of course it does. If they still had them there would have been no invasion.

Of course the reason they gave them up is because they were given guarantees by Russia it wouldn't invade.

How did that work out?

 

[Rookiescot]

8 minutes ago, Alavan said:

Your logic is that you don’t care if he kills you and your hometown because you can retaliate. 
At the end the result is death for everybody on both sides.
Who wins?

So lets get nuked but not retaliate? 

Good luck convincing people thats a good idea.

[KRLMRX]

2 hours ago, vlad said:

Im not interested in what he said in Munich I've asked you if you believe all the BS and lies. Also have the Russian media filmed the body bags returning to Russia.

yes, I believe Zelensky and the Ukrainian "elite" when they say they want to get nuclear weapons.  They believe that with nuclear weapons they will be safer.  There is logic in this.  Why not believe them?

[KRLMRX]

43 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Does the Ukraine think it was a mistake to give up their nukes given they have now been invaded by Russia?

Of course it does. If they still had them there would have been no invasion.

Of course the reason they gave them up is because they were given guarantees by Russia it wouldn't invade.

How did that work out?

yes, that's how it works. The modern leadership of Ukraine regrets that it has lost nuclear weapons earlier.

And, given the statements of officials, I see no reason not to believe in their desire to reacquire nuclear weapons.

[Poolie]

2 hours ago, vlad said:

Says were from ?

In your quote. I've highlighted it, I'm not putting a marching band round it as well.

[EdwardV]

3 hours ago, KRLMRX said:

At the last Munich Security Conference, Zelensky also hinted at this, threatening to refuse to implement the Budapest Memorandum (Ukraine's renunciation of nuclear weapons in exchange for security guarantees)

A hint? Wow that a reach at best for justifying a war. Ukraine already gave up it’s nuclear weapons in exchange for a Russia promise to respect its sovereignty. We saw how that worked out . There is absolutely no evidence of Ukraine trying to get or create  nuclear weapons. Of course if you park 200K in troops and armor at my front door, it’s perfectly understandable to think your past action might have been a mistake.

I thought the war was started over Nazis? Or was it NATO? Or was it anthrax? Regardless it was the wests fault right? I still say the CIA got a guy into the Kremlin and put a gun to Putin’s head and said: “ we know you said you wouldn’t invade, but we want you too, or you will have a really bad headache “. 

[KRLMRX]

1 hour ago, EdwardV said:

A hint? Wow that a reach at best for justifying a war. Ukraine already gave up it’s nuclear weapons in exchange for a Russia promise to respect its sovereignty. We saw how that worked out . There is absolutely no evidence of Ukraine trying to get or create  nuclear weapons. Of course if you park 200K in troops and armor at my front door, it’s perfectly understandable to think your past action might have been a mistake.

I thought the war was started over Nazis? Or was it NATO? Or was it anthrax? Regardless it was the wests fault right? I still say the CIA got a guy into the Kremlin and put a gun to Putin’s head and said: “ we know you said you wouldn’t invade, but we want you too, or you will have a really bad headache “. 

fact 1 - Zelensky and Ukrainian officials talked about the possibility of returning nuclear status.

Fact 2 - The "West" has been supporting Ukraine's fully official authorities since at least 2004.

Fact 3 - NATO officials have regularly stated that Ukraine will one day get into it.

Fact 4 - there were US biolaboratories on the territory of Ukraine, US officials admitted this (what they were doing is an open question).

If you sat down to play this card game, then why did you give all the trump cards to your opponent?

[EdwardV]

1 hour ago, KRLMRX said:

fact 1 - Zelensky and Ukrainian officials talked about the possibility of returning nuclear status.

Fact 2 - The "West" has been supporting Ukraine's fully official authorities since at least 2004.

Fact 3 - NATO officials have regularly stated that Ukraine will one day get into it.

Fact 4 - there were US biolaboratories on the territory of Ukraine, US officials admitted this (what they were doing is an open question).

If you sat down to play this card game, then why did you give all the trump cards to your opponent?

Fact 1 - Was this "talk" being done before of after Russian troops started to mass on Ukraine's borders? Makes a difference. Never the less, just talk isn't justification for an invasion. Not when it would make Ukraine a pariah state, and destroy any chance of joining the EU and NATO. Certainly not when no action was taken behind this talk and it would take at least a decade to create a weapon.

Fact 2 - Supporting what? Creating nuclear weapons or joining NATO? The first would be absurd and unnecessary, the second was never going to happen as long as Russia occupied Crimea. It's a non-point. 

Fact 3 - See fact 2

Fact 4 - A so called fact that's been debunked.  Russian, Chinese Media Seize on Theory About US Bio-Labs in Ukraine (businessinsider.com) 

I see a lot of speculation, theory and claims, but no actual facts and certainly no proof. 

[Alavan]

3 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

So lets get nuked but not retaliate? 

Good luck convincing people thats a good idea.

Maybe you better read all the posts before posting this.

This is not at all what I posted.

My question was: do you want to start a nuclear war with mass anhilation on both sides

[Rookiescot]

2 hours ago, KRLMRX said:

yes, that's how it works. The modern leadership of Ukraine regrets that it has lost nuclear weapons earlier.

And, given the statements of officials, I see no reason not to believe in their desire to reacquire nuclear weapons.

Are you somehow surprised by this development given Russia's actions? After all they did guarantee the Ukrains safety before invading them twice.

Its just another example of how you simply cannot trust the word of Czar Putin or his minions.

[Rookiescot]

4 minutes ago, Alavan said:

Maybe you better read all the posts before posting this.

This is not at all what I posted.

My question was: do you want to start a nuclear war with mass anhilation on both sides

No I dont but then again I didnt start a war in the Ukraine. Czar Putin did. Even after he had given guarantees about Ukrainian safety. However I am not prepared to have Czar Putin killing thousands of innocent civilians every day in his failed war.

Its time he was stopped. Any attempt to launch the missiles will result in sane people within Russia removing this power crazed lunatic.

How often does he need to lie before you actually stop defending him?

[vlad]

4 hours ago, Alavan said:

Your logic is that you don’t care if he kills you and your hometown because you can retaliate. 
At the end the result is death for everybody on both sides.
Who wins?

Wrong Alavan he will only get 1 chance unless he launches muliple war heads but he will realise Russia will be obliterated in a counter strike, thats why his generals will turn on him if he tells them to launch they know Russia will be flattened and everyone in it.

[vlad]

3 hours ago, KRLMRX said:

yes, I believe Zelensky and the Ukrainian "elite" when they say they want to get nuclear weapons.  They believe that with nuclear weapons they will be safer.  There is logic in this.  Why not believe them?

Its called a deferent Comrade look up what it means. 

[JohnC]

2 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

No I dont but then again I didnt start a war in the Ukraine. Czar Putin did. Even after he had given guarantees about Ukrainian safety. However I am not prepared to have Czar Putin killing thousands of innocent civilians every day in his failed war.

Its time he was stopped. Any attempt to launch the missiles will result in sane people within Russia removing this power crazed lunatic.

How often does he need to lie before you actually stop defending him?

Agree but how are you going to do that?

Where was all this outrage and sanctions when he invaded crimea? Maybe if there had of been Putin would have thought twice before invading the rest of Ukraine. 

Instead he thinks NATO are weak and haven't got the balls to take him on. NATO aren't doing anything to make him change his mind either. 

Putin will only be stopped by force, he gets assassinated or a deal is made to keep him happy. 

Force is out the question because he's got 6k nuclear missiles he's crazy enough to use so either of the other two options will do me as long as its done quickly to end the fighting

[Rookiescot]

1 hour ago, KRLMRX said:

fact 1 - Zelensky and Ukrainian officials talked about the possibility of returning nuclear status.

Fact 2 - The "West" has been supporting Ukraine's fully official authorities since at least 2004.

Fact 3 - NATO officials have regularly stated that Ukraine will one day get into it.

Fact 4 - there were US biolaboratories on the territory of Ukraine, US officials admitted this (what they were doing is an open question).

If you sat down to play this card game, then why did you give all the trump cards to your opponent?

Fact1. A possibility in order to secure their own safety given the record of invasion from Czarist Russia and its lies about protecting the Ukraine nation. It has now invaded twice since the Ukraine gave up its nukes.

Fact2. Since 2004? Back then there was a puppet Russian supporting government in the Ukraine. The country only got democracy in 2014 after being subjected to the usual terror tactics and killings we can all associate with despotic regimes. 

Fact3. No they have not. They have said that they may one day welcome the Ukraine into NATO but back then neither side considered this a reality. After Russia invaded the Crimea it was never even a possibility.

Until now that is. Your mighty midget has coalesced support from the west in a way that no-one thought possible. Russia is now the most despised country on the planet. The war is going very badly for Russia. The thing was supposed to be over and done with within 24 hours. Then Czar Putin could have presented it as a velvet revolution freeing the people. But the people have not welcomed you have they? They now hate Russia with a passion. Even cities within close reach of the Russian border are still holding out and some of them are in predominately Russian speaking regions. The war has failed. Even if you eventually manage to install a puppet regime it will be impossible to control it. 

Fact4. That is simply a lie. We can see what you are doing here. The whole world can. You guys did the same in Syria. Bomb somewhere and then claim the the chemical weapons released were from a stockpile which was hit. Its total and utter lies. Pathetically predictable.