News Forum - Russia attacks Ukraine from three fronts, explosions in major cities

[butterfly]

9 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

So yes I can make that claim.

you still can't,

and the behind closed doors is real, you will have to be beyond naive to think it didn't happen. We had precedents before, and that's the playbook of EU and NATO officials.

You are perfectly entitled to ignore those things and ignore reality, that doesn't make those things any less true or real.

Edited February 25, 2022 by butterfly

[Rookiescot]

2 minutes ago, butterfly said:

you still can't,

and the behind closed doors is real, you will have to be beyond naive to think it didn't happen. We had precedents before, and that's the playbook of EU and NATO officials.

You are perfectly entitled to ignore those things and ignore reality, that doesn't make those things any less true or real.

The reality is the Ukraine is not a member of NATO. Deal with that.

It had no interest in becoming a member until Russia invaded and stole the Crimea. Deal with that.

It is you who is ignoring reality. 

Stop posting utter lies to try and defend the actions of a power crazed lunatic. 

[butterfly]

Just now, Rookiescot said:

The reality is the Ukraine is not a member of NATO. Deal with that.

It had no interest in becoming a member until Russia invaded and stole the Crimea. Deal with that.

It is you who is ignoring reality. 

Stop posting utter lies to try and defend the actions of a power crazed lunatic. 

they might be lies to you because you live in lala land,

but for us in the real world dealing with realPolitik, they are concrete and tangible

deal with that 

[Rookiescot]

10 minutes ago, butterfly said:

they might be lies to you because you live in lala land,

but for us in the real world dealing with realPolitik, they are concrete and tangible

deal with that 

You are a Putin Bot. Simple as that. You are posting factual inaccuracies simply to try and excuse the actions of a power crazed lunatic. 

[Faraday]

Further off topic posts & there replies have been removed.

Please remain on topic.

Moderator

[Freeduhdumb]

For those of you who need a quick history lesson... 

https://off-guardian.org/2022/02/24/timeline-euromaidan-the-original-ukraine-crisis/

[butterfly]

58 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

You are a Putin Bot.

like I said, lala land

[butterfly]

1 hour ago, Rookiescot said:

Ukraine only became interested in joining NATO after Russia invaded and stole the Crimea from it.

rewriting history again and definitely living in lala land

[Pinetree]

3 hours ago, Poolie said:

Where would they run to?

Russia? 

[Poolie]

Just now, Pinetree said:

Russia? 

About 60k from Donbass/Lugansk already did.

[PBS]

3 hours ago, vlad said:

Ukraine is not running away they are engaging Russian military. Missiles are being intercepted and taken out over Kiev and it appears now a fighter jet was shot down so its not all a walk over like putin would like to think. 

Ukraine has confirmed Russian forces have reached a northern suburb of Kiev. Likely Ukraine will fall in the near future. The trechery of Putin is unforgivable, together with the weakness of some EU governments declining to remove Russian from the SWIFT network.

Poland has advised, so far, approx 67,000 Ukranian refugees have entered their country. So sad so many have to suffer from Putin's egoistic ultra nationlism.

[Alavan]

9 hours ago, AussieBob said:

In 2014 the elected President of Ukraine was overthrown in a violent coup - that started the war and Crimea leaving. Eastern Ukraine did not participate in those elections - there was a war going on. Learn the history before making such silly comments. 

Thinking the participation of Donbas Russians would have altered the result of the election is silly.

you can’t win an election if you don’t participate. Donbas is 4 million habitants on a total of 40.

[Alavan]

2 hours ago, butterfly said:

indeed, the west lost their moral high ground 20 years ago after 911

and they will get no support from the rest of the world for their anti-Russian sanctions

it will be perceived again as one set of rules for them (aka the elite), and another one for the rest of the world (aka the populace)

The countries that set sanctions have nearly 2/3 rd of the world economy at hand. Russia is a military giant but an economic dwarf, economically smaller than Italy. The West, including Japan, Australia and some others will put the tone. If you think economical support from Myanmar, some African and Asian countries, Venezuela and Nicaragua plus China is a big help for Russia…

The only thing the West should have done is ban them from swift.

[Chatogaster]

1 hour ago, Freeduhdumb said:

For those of you who need a quick history lesson... 

https://off-guardian.org/2022/02/24/timeline-euromaidan-the-original-ukraine-crisis/

 

Here's an interview with M. Gorbachev in a newspaper that was (at the time) published by the government of Russia. It contradicts the very first point of your history lesson: 

https://www.rbth.com/international/2014/10/16/mikhail_gorbachev_i_am_against_all_walls_40673.html

That isn't meant to imply that NATO or Ukraine are innocent victims that did everything right (they didn't by any means), but it does show that history is a biased interpretation of the past that can get people killed in the present. It's better to live peacefully. The stakes (or egos) must be incredibly high to go against that core principle.

 

[Benroon]

21 hours ago, whitesnake said:

And, of course, this puts the kye-wash on Russian Tourists being welcomed into Thailand!

One more thing ... watch a litre of petrol soon hit in excess of 50 Baht!! (maybe higher!!) Brent crude the highest it's been today since 2014: $105 per barrel and set to rise higher!!

Thais soon won't be able to fill up their trucks at a cost of 70 litres x 50 THB...3,500 Baht to fill your tank!!!??OMFG!  Something Thais have never experienced, along with huge rises in food and other consumer goods!! The "Thai Good-life" is vanishing... for GOOD! Wake up everyone... trouble ahead. 

There must be medication somewhere that can help this guy ? 

However I am refusing to take sides until I know what Stonkers opinion is 

But Putin is a nut job and I would love to see him come a cropper, but have the west pushed him into this by back-pedalling on their promises ? 100% absolutely. 

[Rookiescot]

This is not the easy win Putin envisioned. Yes the Russian military has pushed the Ukraines forces back but now Russia is faced with putting its troops into the meatgrinder that is urban warfare.

FIBUA (fighting in built up areas, although its colloquially known as FISH, fighting in someones house) is a daunting prospect for soldiers. Huge casualties as you literally fight from room to room. Building to building. Street to street. Tanks become far less effective and a lot more vulnerable. Artillery is also less effective. Areas which you think you have cleared suddenly flare up again.

In short its a nightmare. 

The Ukrainian soldiers will be far more motivated. The Russian troops very apprehensive. 

How many casualties is Russia prepared to take? 

[Tim_Melb]

I have something for all the people calling for NATO forces to enter the Ukraine and engage the Russians to think about. Do you think that Russia has re-tasked their nuclear missiles since the days of the cold war? If not think about where these older ICBMs are going to if launched... Major cities in the US and Europe, but also targets in the Pacific, Guam, Pearl Harbour, Angeles City and Subic Bay in the Philippines, Pine Gap in Outback Australia, Melbourne Australia, and Okinawa Japan amongst several other potential targets around the world. If Putin is losing do you think he will pick and chose targets or just hit them all? Just give that some thought. And think about places that no longer have target US bases anymore like the Philippines and the innocent people that live in those places. 

[Tim_Melb]

12 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

This is not the easy win Putin envisioned. Yes the Russian military has pushed the Ukraines forces back but now Russia is faced with putting its troops into the meatgrinder that is urban warfare.

FIBUA (fighting in built up areas, although its colloquially known as FISH, fighting in someones house) is a daunting prospect for soldiers. Huge casualties as you literally fight from room to room. Building to building. Street to street. Tanks become far less effective and a lot more vulnerable. Artillery is also less effective. Areas which you think you have cleared suddenly flare up again.

In short its a nightmare. 

The Ukrainian soldiers will be far more motivated. The Russian troops very apprehensive. 

How many casualties is Russia prepared to take? 

And firearms sales in the last three months in the Ukraine have been at record highs. I just heard that most gun dealers in Ukraine have sold out of rifles in the last 48 hours. 

[Mudshark]

28 minutes ago, Tim_Melb said:

I have something for all the people calling for NATO forces to enter the Ukraine and engage the Russians to think about.

Throwing down the gauntlet to straw horses?! I have yet to read one article from six western countries, or more,  saying anything remotely like they would enter the Ukraine. 

 

 

[Tim_Melb]

6 minutes ago, Mudshark said:

Throwing down the gauntlet to straw horses?! I have yet to read one article from six western countries, or more,  saying anything remotely like they would enter the Ukraine. 

 

 

I don't disagree, NATO will not engage militarily unless Putin does something ridiculously stupid and forces them by crossing a NATO border. I just wanted to point out to the  Biden is gutless, and NATO needs to attack brigade what Putins endgame will be if NATO tries do destroy his Army.

Edited February 25, 2022 by Tim_Melb
Typo

[KRLMRX]

18 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Ukraine only became interested in joining NATO after Russia invaded and stole the Crimea from it.

Or was the theft of Crimea also caused by western powers?

So yes I can make that claim. Just because you want to make up foolish theories about secret talks behind closed doors does not mean the rest of us do.

 

this is not true.  

Ukraine's aspirations for NATO began long before Crimeans refused to live in pro-Nazi Ukraine Tuesday,

<unverified quote removed>

 

Edited February 26, 2022 by KaptainRob
Refer Forum Guidelines

[KRLMRX]

2 hours ago, PBS said:

The trechery of Putin is unforgivable, together with the weakness of some EU governments declining to remove Russian from the SWIFT network.

disconnecting from Swift will not change anything - only 10% of Russians travel the world, the country has its own settlement system.

[Benroon]

6 minutes ago, Mudshark said:

Throwing down the gauntlet to straw horses?! I have yet to read one article from six western countries, or more,  saying anything remotely like they would enter the Ukraine. 

 

 

They've all said they won't !  Once that announcement was made the green light went on for Putin. He's got all the time in the world to achieve his objectives whilst uber lightweights such as Liz Truss are busy establishing where the Ukraine actually is.

So far the west have not shown any stomach for the fight - you think sanctions will have come as a surprise ? They will all have been costed and assessed prior to this invasion. Putin is laughing all the way. If he gets his way, (likely) he's a hero, if it all goes pear shaped he disappears into the sunset on his giant yacht with his billions and bikini clad stunners. 

However if you want a little light relief - check out Trumps interview where he believed the US were launching an amphibious invasion of Ukraine - comedy gold !

[Rookiescot]

13 hours ago, KRLMRX said:

this is not true.  

Ukraine's aspirations for NATO began long before Crimeans refused to live in pro-Nazi Ukraine Tuesday,

 

It was illegal under the Ukrainian constitution for it to join ANY military block back then.

And thats a fake link. I googled all of that and it does not exist.

 

Edited February 26, 2022 by KaptainRob
Part Quote deleted

[Benroon]

4 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

The reality is the Ukraine is not a member of NATO. Deal with that.

It had no interest in becoming a member until Russia invaded and stole the Crimea. Deal with that.

It is you who is ignoring reality. 

Stop posting utter lies to try and defend the actions of a power crazed lunatic. 

wow and I'm the angry one ? 

Of course they looked for support after Crimea, wouldn't you have ?