News Forum - Vietnamese man gets 5 years in jail for spreading Covid

[dmacarelli]

3 hours ago, Bob20 said:

Thanks AB and SD for that exchange. I've only been here about 3 weeks and it took no more than a matter of days to recognise those members. What I find especially disturbing here though, is that when you do get through to them and disprove some of their arguments, they pop-up in another thread again, with exactly the same argument that they now know to be invalid.

Your religious comparison is pretty good. They are like Jehova's that keep ringing your bell at any time of the day, whatever you're doing, regardless of whether you are interested, pushing their message even when it's been shown to be incorrect. And if you don't open the door, they move next-door, where they've been before as well.

Here they interject in just about every thread to hijack the subject and are deliberate poisoning the forum (why is that allowed?), which is why I block them.

Slightly off topic, but in regard to organized religion, I love the Rusty Cole line from True Detective season one. 

I think human consciousness is a tragic misstep in evolution. We became too self-aware. Nature created an aspect of nature separate from itself. We are creatures that should not exist by natural law. We are things that labor under the illusion of having a self: an accretion of sensory experience and felling programmed with total assurance that we are each somebody when in fact everybody is nobody.

Transference of fear and self-loathing to an authoritarian vessel. It's catharsis. He absorbs their dread with his narrative. Because of this, he's effective in proportion to the amount of certainty he can project. Certain linguistic anthropologists think that religion is a language virus that rewrites pathways in the brain. Dulls critical thinking. I think the honorable thing for our species to do is deny our programming. Stop reproducing. Walk hand in hand into extinction, one last midnight. Brothers and sisters opting out of a raw deal.

When I am approached by someone trying to push their religion on me, I ask: tell me about your own realizations. What kind of wisdom have you been able to glean, from the countless hours you are spending in prayer, talking to God, contemplation and deep meditation? What universal knowledge do you have, that you can share with me? Often they will quote scripture. I tell them a parrot can do that. I am asking for some personal realization. It really shuts them up. It never fails to cause them to excuse themselves, and walk away. A truly foolproof technique!

 

 

[Bob20]

30 minutes ago, dmacarelli said:

Slightly off topic, but in regard to organized religion, I love the Rusty Cole line from True Detective season one. 

I think human consciousness is a tragic misstep in evolution. We became too self-aware. Nature created an aspect of nature separate from itself. We are creatures that should not exist by natural law. We are things that labor under the illusion of having a self: an accretion of sensory experience and felling programmed with total assurance that we are each somebody when in fact everybody is nobody.

Transference of fear and self-loathing to an authoritarian vessel. It's catharsis. He absorbs their dread with his narrative. Because of this, he's effective in proportion to the amount of certainty he can project. Certain linguistic anthropologists think that religion is a language virus that rewrites pathways in the brain. Dulls critical thinking. I think the honorable thing for our species to do is deny our programming. Stop reproducing. Walk hand in hand into extinction, one last midnight. Brothers and sisters opting out of a raw deal.

When I am approached by someone trying to push their religion on me, I ask: tell me about your own realizations. What kind of wisdom have you been able to glean, from the countless hours you are spending in prayer, talking to God, contemplation and deep meditation? What universal knowledge do you have, that you can share with me? Often they will quote scripture. I tell them a parrot can do that. I am asking for some personal realization. It really shuts them up. It never fails to cause them to excuse themselves, and walk away. A truly foolproof technique!

Have you read Christopher Hitchens?

"Religious arguments and wars are about whose imaginary friend is more powerful..."

[Smithydog]

Hi Members,

Lets close this side conversation off with a comment from me as the Moderator who made the decision being discussed and get back on track with the topics.

As per the Forum Rules and Guidelines - "Every comment is valued for its content. This discussion forum allows everyone to have a say and it brings out many different ideas and viewpoints". The decision to change the topic was instigated by a report from Bob20 but solely made by myself and to stimulate proper debate on the subject which is also the job of a Moderator.

Moderators are not allowed to impose their personal opinion on topics. Anyone that thinks any social media platform can simply get rid of misinformation or disinformation easily, without bias, needs to really experience what it is like. 

A Moderator on this Forum can't simply say something is misinformation. They have to be able to show and prove it! That takes time, usually far more research than a member does before posting comments and an unbiased focus to judge solely against the rules.

So, let's move on and get back onto the topic before this conversation goes into areas where I am forced to act. If you have questions or suggestions, then you can PM me. 

Smithydog (Moderator)

 

[SnapDragon]

1 minute ago, Bob20 said:

Different Bob here

Each and every one of your points is an assumption against consensus. Let's talk when you have evidence rather an example, suspicion or disbelief.

With respect Mr Bob. It should be the requirement of the person promoting the assumption to provide the evidence. Where is the evidence for C-19? None surfaced as yet.

Like the vicar asking the non-believer; "prove there is no god".

The evidence is out there for all to see. It's not always simple to find as the authorities have almost absolute control. Fortunately there are a few that look behind the fasad/facade. But it can be dangerous. In the US especially; Brandy Vaughan, Kary Mullis and Bill Cooper spring to mind. In the UK; David Kelly and Jill Dando.

[Bob20]

13 minutes ago, snapdragon said:

With respect Mr Bob. It should be the requirement of the person promoting the assumption to provide the evidence. Where is the evidence for C-19? None surfaced as yet.

Like the vicar asking the non-believer; "prove there is no god".

The evidence is out there for all to see. It's not always simple to find as the authorities have almost absolute control. Fortunately there are a few that look behind the fasad/facade. But it can be dangerous. In the US especially; Brandy Vaughan, Kary Mullis and Bill Cooper spring to mind. In the UK; David Kelly and Jill Dando.

I'm not going down that road as it would be a repetition. You can't get further than examples, that have been either simply countered or at worst been exposed as faked.

I've seen all the arguments that the virus hasn't been isolated etc. which is complete nonsense. We know what it is, have clinical evidence of what it does and have isolated it and gene sequenced it, allowing us to try to combat it. Why do you dispute its existence anyway, when elsewhere you discuss it being developed in labs for warfare? You can't have it both ways.

If with all the EVIDENCE you don't believe C19 exists, who am I to convince you? Then enjoy your time without protecting yourself, until nature convinces you of the opposite. We see YouTube video of similarly ignorant people after the fact and changing their mind. Somehow I think that even then you would not admit it exists.

Enjoy your day.

 

 

Apologies, I saw the mods comment only after I posted. Topic is closed for me anyway

[palooka]

18 hours ago, dmacarelli said:

Imagine such a thing happening here? Thousands spread Covid from Bangkok to the provinces, while the authorities did nothing to stop the flow or spread. 

Sometimes, it is convenient to have a few adults in the room. 

All with the Governments blessing, Song krong etc

[SnapDragon]

43 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

I've seen all the arguments that the virus hasn't been isolated etc. which is complete nonsense. We know what it is, have clinical evidence of what it does and have isolated it and gene sequenced it, allowing us to try to combat it. Why do you dispute its existence anyway, when elsewhere you discuss it being developed in labs for warfare? You can't have it both ways.

With Respect Mr  Bob; the virus - in fact any corona-virus - has not been isolated; and indeed cannot be.

If you really believe the virus has been clinically isolated, please point me to the evidence. My group (AFLD) would love to see it. If it genuinely had been; it would be headline news around the world. To say that it's been gene-sequenced is just pure fantasy. Think computer generated would be more accurate.

A virus is a cell and tissue particle. I'm not suggesting that viruses do not exist. I am saying that they are 'dead' and cannot cause sickness, illness or disease. There are trillions of them. We have them in the billion. They are constantly being created and expelled from the body.

""Why do you dispute its existence anyway, when elsewhere you discuss it being developed in labs for warfare? You can't have it both ways.""

Perhaps the word 'virus' is not fully understood by many. The original meaning of the word is 'poison'. It is the end result of a fight. A fight between a diseased cell and 'globulins'. The cell is chomped up, and - through natural means - eliminated from the body.

A bio-weapon is an non-natural, 'made-in-a-petri-dish' entity that might be used to attach itself to a virus. Then; as it it expelled from the body - in the natural way that viruses are - it can do non-natural things; like infect others, with whatever it was intended.

 

Edited September 8, 2021 by snapdragon

[Stonker]

3 hours ago, BraveNewFahrenheit said:

How many people did you spread the flu to in years past that ended up dyeing?

None.

And had I done so knowing that I was not only breaking the law but doing so deliberately and for purely selfish reasons then I would fully expect and deserve to be treated in the same way.

[Stonker]

11 hours ago, Freeduhdumb said:

Are we going incarcerate everyone for spreading all of the different strains of the deadly flu virus? Or anyone of the other viruses? This is absurd... and anyone supporting this is truly sick in the head. 

If they knowingly and deliberately break the law doing so, yes.

[Chaimai]

1 minute ago, Stonker said:

If they knowingly and deliberately break the law doing so, yes.

 

 

+1 this is not about Covid, it is about respecting the law.

 

The fact someone doesn't like, or agree with, the law matters not.

Edited September 8, 2021 by Chaimai

[AussieBob]

2 hours ago, BlueSphinx said:

A little bit off-topic but continuing on the dis-information topic.  Where on the gliding scale from honest-but-incorrect over overly-optimistic-misguided to deliberate dis-information would you place Vaccine-Pope Fauci? 

Here a chronological overview of some of the public statements he made addressing the vaccine-solution for the covid-crisis from Nov 2020 till just recently. 

Moving target The end of Covid is nigh, thanks to the miracle of vaccines. Just ask Dr. Anthony Fauci. Then ask him again. And again. And... Alex Berenson Sep 7 Hedge fund managers sometimes joke the stock market has predicted nine of the last five recessions. And then there’s Anthony Fauci. Here he is on Nov. 12, 2020 - just after Pfizer released the first data showing its vaccines were 90-plus percent effective (don’t ask at what): Can you be more specific, doc? He sure could. A month later: If America’s Doctor (TM) says it, you can believe it! Maybe. Three months later - in March 2021, about when we were supposed to be hitting herd immunity - we were a mere four to six months away! Woke math is the best. And here we are, in late summer, heading for early fall. Pandemic’s gotta be over, right? Let’s partaaaay! Hot Vaxxed Fall! Yeah, about that… It’s almost as if the vaccines aren’t helping at all. Almost. But that can’t be right.

I would place Fauci in both the 'honest-but-incorrect' and the 'overly-optimistic-misguided' categories - and occasionally in the 'valid-correct' too - depending on where in the process he was involved.  I dont rate Fauci at all really.  His inability to throw a baseball is one thing - but to accept that role and go and make a fool of yourself in public trying to throw a baseball, means his self awareness is extremely low.

 

[Stonker]

11 hours ago, Freeduhdumb said:

We now know the millions of dead projected by the "experts" like Neil Ferguson were demonstrably wrong

Actually "we" (at least the "we" who bother to read what we comment on before commenting) know the complete opposite.

That particular projection was one of a number of possibilities, and was a worst case scenario  based on an 'r' rate of 2.4 and taking no precautions.

The projection didn't happen not because he was "demonstrably wrong" but because the 'r' rate wasn't 2.4 and precautions were taken.

Your entire post and line of argument is based on a complete fallacy.

[AussieBob]

2 hours ago, Bob20 said:

We disagree here. The nazi's imposed their views and at the same time would enforce compliance. That's not what I'm advocating at all.

Example:

On the CCC section, there was an article: "Ivermectin now available to all Covid-19 patients in Japan". I thought that was highly suspicious, verified it with the Japanese Medical Association and was told that a small number of doctors In Tokyo of a subdivision of the medical association have been allowed to do a clinical study amongst strictly selected patients and only if they give their express consent.

They have subsequently changed the title of the topic, formulating it as a question: "Should Ivermectin be made available to all Covid-19 patients in Japan?", telling me that it's not because of my input (surprise, as if they would admit to that), but because the content is better served with a different title.

They should have recognised that before choosing the deliberately misleading and verifiably false initial title, and it is my opinion that that wasn't chosen accidentally. The content would be even better served by for example "Ivermectin available to a few selected patients in a trial in part of Tokyo". But that doesn't serve their agenda!

This is the type of thing I'm talking about. And it shouldn't be you or me fighting for this. Why else do they have rule 16 in the FG's?

Fair enough - and it was right you got that changed.  But I would say that the last 2-3 decades has shown everyone that most media organisations have never let the truth get in the way of a good headline/story, and most of them cannot be trusted. 

Getting back to the Nazis - what you said is true - but is not so much my point.  The Nazis were the first to massively use media and other such external manipulation to enforce a 'desired' public opinion (the one they espoused).  There are many such things happening today in this world - especially around pandemics. Try to google (or yahoo, or bing or duck etc.) 'past pandemics' and what you will find that history has been rewritten to remove terms like 'spanish flu' or 'hong kong flu' etc etc - this is done in compliance with liberal views to not associate past events with any country's people, especially China which is where the vast majority of pandemics originated in the past. 

[AussieBob]

1 hour ago, snapdragon said:

Interesting post Mr Bob.

If I could Sir: One point at a time.

There are many that do believe that the "Earth is flat,,". The augments of the proponents are fascinating; mostly based of the curvature of the earth.

"Moon landings,,"; a great topic for debate. Millions believe that the scenes where the guys are walking about on the moon were shot underwater. Can see tiny bubbles in one of the shots. Just six weeks before the first launch there was a trial landing with the same craft in Nevada. It was a complete and catastrophic failure. Don't think they would risk it so soon afterwards.

"5G,,"!? First trialed by the US military back in the 1970s. It has a devastating effect on the negativity of red blood cells. Can cause clotting and inhibit the transfer of oxygen around the blood-vascular system. "Mind control"; for sure, too much electromagnetic disturbance of the body can lead to brain dysfunction; and worse.

"Spiritual Entity,,"! God perhaps! There are a few believers in he/she. Quite a few!

The evidence is out there on "9/11". For all to see. Need to say more? Only that it's the 20th anniversary this coming Saturday.

"Princes Diana was murdered." Mr Mohamed Al Fayed (Dodi's* father), said on UK radio, more than once, that it was Prince Philip and the secret services of France and MI6 behind the deed.

"JFK was killed by the CIA,,". The guy that actually shot one of the rounds that killed the president, was on the radio quite recently telling the whole story. Massively suppressed by the authorities; naturally.

"Area 51," is quite secret. The X-files suggest that there are funny things going on there. But who knows?

"Big Pharma created C-19 to make money." The evidence now points towards DARPA, and specifically Fort Detrick; and Porton Down - UK's research facility - is also involved. But involved in what? Gain-of-function? Developing bio-weapons! To what end? To crash the Chinese economy and rescue the US dollar? The C-19 fraud was simply an opportunist step for the string-pullers of this world.

Instead of just a blanket acceptance of these occurrences - as promoted by authorities Mr Bob - I suggest you research the topics individually. Each would be a great debate for TT. Could I throw in the 'suicide' of Dr David Kelly and the 'Skripals' mystery?

Fresh threads await. Let's get to it!!!!!!

* Princess Di's lover.

And Jeffery Epstein did not commit suicide !!

*Ghislaine Maxwell

 

[AussieBob]

3 hours ago, Bob20 said:

I would say, once it's been exposed and their use is repeated time after time regardless of knowing better, it's not accidental anymore.

Yeh - maybe. Or just very convinced and determined.

[Stardust]

1 hour ago, snapdragon said:

Interesting post Mr Bob.

If I could Sir: One point at a time.

There are many that do believe that the "Earth is flat,,". The augments of the proponents are fascinating; mostly based of the curvature of the earth.

"Moon landings,,"; a great topic for debate. Millions believe that the scenes where the guys are walking about on the moon were shot underwater. Can see tiny bubbles in one of the shots. Just six weeks before the first launch there was a trial landing with the same craft in Nevada. It was a complete and catastrophic failure. Don't think they would risk it so soon afterwards.

"5G,,"!? First trialed by the US military back in the 1970s. It has a devastating effect on the negativity of red blood cells. Can cause clotting and inhibit the transfer of oxygen around the blood-vascular system. "Mind control"; for sure, too much electromagnetic disturbance of the body can lead to brain dysfunction; and worse.

"Spiritual Entity,,"! God perhaps! There are a few believers in he/she. Quite a few!

The evidence is out there on "9/11". For all to see. Need to say more? Only that it's the 20th anniversary this coming Saturday.

"Princes Diana was murdered." Mr Mohamed Al Fayed (Dodi's* father), said on UK radio, more than once, that it was Prince Philip and the secret services of France and MI6 behind the deed.

"JFK was killed by the CIA,,". The guy that actually shot one of the rounds that killed the president, was on the radio quite recently telling the whole story. Massively suppressed by the authorities; naturally.

"Area 51," is quite secret. The X-files suggest that there are funny things going on there. But who knows?

"Big Pharma created C-19 to make money." The evidence now points towards DARPA, and specifically Fort Detrick; and Porton Down - UK's research facility - is also involved. But involved in what? Gain-of-function? Developing bio-weapons! To what end? To crash the Chinese economy and rescue the US dollar? The C-19 fraud was simply an opportunist step for the string-pullers of this world.

Instead of just a blanket acceptance of these occurrences - as promoted by authorities Mr Bob - I suggest you research the topics individually. Each would be a great debate for TT. Could I throw in the 'suicide' of Dr David Kelly and the 'Skripals' mystery?

Fresh threads await. Let's get to it!!!!!!

* Princess Di's lover.

Some you can discuss and is not clear I agree but the earth is defently not flat or do you live in a 2 dimensional world? We have 3 dimension and more and there is no doubt about. If you put all in one pot then maybe you see everything in 2 dimension but then be able to see both side of the coin. When there is something not clearly don't think it for all cases because then you lost the ground and living in your own bubble. This we can see with the actual government they lost completly the connection to the reality thats why they cznnot reflect themself and have to blame others for their complete failure and incompetence!

[AussieBob]

3 hours ago, Yinn said:

Ppfffft

Block member talk on internet is over sensitive.

Really?

why care what somebody on the internet say? 
 

Be strong!!! Only words. 

Some call Yinn prostitute, dumb, hairy bum, have penis etc. 

I laugh the idiot. I am adult.

"prostitute, dumb, hairy bum, have penis etc. " maybe - but u r definitely not a conspiracy nutter.

[AussieBob]

1 hour ago, dmacarelli said:

Well, the commies tend to be a bit extreme. Five years seems a bit draconian. But, some sort of punishment, or consequences, yes. Something. I am not a big advocate of crowding up the prison system. There are far more creative solutions, many of which I cannot discuss on this forum. 

Thai Police extracting information in the 12th century ??

[dmacarelli]

1 hour ago, Bob20 said:

I'm not going down that road as it would be a repetition. You can't get further than examples, that have been either simply countered or at worst been exposed as faked.

I've seen all the arguments that the virus hasn't been isolated etc. which is complete nonsense. We know what it is, have clinical evidence of what it does and have isolated it and gene sequenced it, allowing us to try to combat it. Why do you dispute its existence anyway, when elsewhere you discuss it being developed in labs for warfare? You can't have it both ways.

If with all the EVIDENCE you don't believe C19 exists, who am I to convince you? Then enjoy your time without protecting yourself, until nature convinces you of the opposite. We see YouTube video of similarly ignorant people after the fact and changing their mind. Somehow I think that even then you would not admit it exists.

Enjoy your day.

Apologies, I saw the mods comment only after I posted. Topic is closed for me anyway

There are now alot of Americans in positions of influence, who said do not get a vaccine, and do not wear a mask, who are now either dead, or in intensive care, speaking out about just how wrong they were. 

Draping yourself in a flag of fake patriotism, and ranting about freedom and liberty provides no protection from Covid. It simply demonstrates timidity, and fear of the unknown. 

[Bob20]

1 minute ago, AussieBob said:

Fair enough - and it was right you got that changed.  But I would say that the last 2-3 decades has shown everyone that most media organisations have never let the truth get in the way of a good headline/story, and most of them cannot be trusted. 

Getting back to the Nazis - what you said is true - but is not so much my point.  The Nazis were the first to massively use media and other such external manipulation to enforce a 'desired' public opinion (the one they espoused).  There are many such things happening today in this world - especially around pandemics. Try to google (or yahoo, or bing or duck etc.) 'past pandemics' and what you will find that history has been rewritten to remove terms like 'spanish flu' or 'hong kong flu' etc etc - this is done in compliance with liberal views to not associate past events with any country's people, especially China which is where the vast majority of pandemics originated in the past. 

Yes, I think our viewpoints are not that different. And we don't have to go back far to see attempts to rewrite history with statues being torn down etc.

Yet, reporting as it is, I hope we will get back to receiving informative news that we don't have to check for an hour before we know it's actual value. And with technology in our hands, I hope "newsoutlets" will report on the world's relevant news and will have a separate section for their neighbours friends dog who sounds like a duck when he barks.

I'm really not out to censor. But I think self-respecting newsoutlets should ban proven intentional disinformation. Else we get into the topic of regulation that the media don't want (and which I don't want either) which means they have to be a little more critical in what they throw out there.

The freedom of speech comes with responsibilities.

[SnapDragon]

7 minutes ago, AussieBob said:

And Jeffery Epstein did not commit suicide !!

*Ghislaine Maxwell

Indeed Mr Bob. Clean left my mind. Thanks! Far too much 5G confusing me.

Could start a thread on called Alternative - non-main-stream - reasons for world events.

Should be fascinating to get posters views on Mr Epstein (for instance).

[AussieBob]

1 hour ago, dmacarelli said:

Slightly off topic, but in regard to organized religion, I love the Rusty Cole line from True Detective season one. 

I think human consciousness is a tragic misstep in evolution. We became too self-aware. Nature created an aspect of nature separate from itself. We are creatures that should not exist by natural law. We are things that labor under the illusion of having a self: an accretion of sensory experience and felling programmed with total assurance that we are each somebody when in fact everybody is nobody.

Transference of fear and self-loathing to an authoritarian vessel. It's catharsis. He absorbs their dread with his narrative. Because of this, he's effective in proportion to the amount of certainty he can project. Certain linguistic anthropologists think that religion is a language virus that rewrites pathways in the brain. Dulls critical thinking. I think the honorable thing for our species to do is deny our programming. Stop reproducing. Walk hand in hand into extinction, one last midnight. Brothers and sisters opting out of a raw deal.

When I am approached by someone trying to push their religion on me, I ask: tell me about your own realizations. What kind of wisdom have you been able to glean, from the countless hours you are spending in prayer, talking to God, contemplation and deep meditation? What universal knowledge do you have, that you can share with me? Often they will quote scripture. I tell them a parrot can do that. I am asking for some personal realization. It really shuts them up. It never fails to cause them to excuse themselves, and walk away. A truly foolproof technique!

I hear you on all that - but I am happy to continue to exist with and within my own beliefs, while being happy to change those views when circumstances and/or evidence shows that they are wrong or invalid. Whether God or some 'higher entity' exists is not an issue that I believe humans can understand - no more than a fly can understand glass (I am Agnostic).  I have no problem as such with people who believe in a God, but to believe that a God is actively involved in every single person's life and all the things that happen in it, is classic false logic founded within the CB of every religion. I remember one Jehovah Witness having a 'logic gap' when asked why over 1 billion Chinese were going to Hell because they have never even heard of Jesus.  However, as I said before, if God/Jesus appears to me and 'speaks of things' then I am prepared to change that Agnostic belief. 

[SnapDragon]

21 minutes ago, Stardust said:

We have 3 dimension and more

Indeed Mr Stardust.

I believe in our universe we have four. Four can easily be proved; but more than that!? Show me the money; as they say. Although in saying that, I did read an essay many moons ago, that put the case for six dimentions. Interesting stuff.

But just to reflect on that poor sod who got banged up. If I were a believer I'd pray for him. Hope he will not be too badly treated in the monkey. And I wish him well until this nonsense has passed, and he can once again walk as a free man.

Edited September 8, 2021 by snapdragon

[AussieBob]

6 minutes ago, snapdragon said:

Indeed Mr Bob. Clean left my mind. Thanks! Far too much 5G confusing me.

Could start a thread on called Alternative - non-main-stream - reasons for world events.

Should be fascinating to get posters views on Mr Epstein (for instance).

And dont forget Crop Circles and the claim that The Holocaust never happened.

[AussieBob]

18 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

Yet, reporting as it is, I hope we will get back to receiving informative news that we don't have to check for an hour before we know it's actual value. And with technology in our hands, I hope "newsoutlets" will report on the world's relevant news and will have a separate section for their neighbours friends dog who sounds like a duck when he barks.

Nice one - but I think they are beyond redemption and will not be 'fixed'.  Their audiences are shrinking daily, and like newspapers and magazines, they will one day be a thing of the past - still there, but irrelevant.