News Forum - Business and government leaders meet to reopen Pattaya bars

[Thaiger]

A high-level meeting is the latest in the non-stop attempts by businesses in Pattaya to reopen bars and entertainment venues, with business leaders and government officials meeting at Pattaya City Hall yesterday to discuss the issue. The conference was run by the president of the Pattaya Business and Tourism Association, the Bang Lamung District Chief, the mayor of Pattaya, and a representative of the Jomtien Bar and Restaurant Owner’s Association. Provincial and health officials from Chon Buri were also in attendance as well as the new Pattaya Police Chief and several senior law enforcement officials from Pattaya and Chon Buri. […]

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[LoongFred]

3 hours ago, Thaiger said:

A high-level meeting is the latest in the non-stop attempts by businesses in Pattaya to reopen bars and entertainment venues, with business leaders and government officials meeting at Pattaya City Hall yesterday to discuss the issue. The conference was run by the president of the Pattaya Business and Tourism Association, the Bang Lamung District Chief, the mayor of Pattaya, and a representative of the Jomtien Bar and Restaurant Owner’s Association. Provincial and health officials from Chon Buri were also in attendance as well as the new Pattaya Police Chief and several senior law enforcement officials from Pattaya and Chon Buri. […]

The story Business and government leaders meet to reopen Pattaya bars as seen on Thaiger News.

Read the full story

It’s not about the bars per say. It’s about what goes on there and Thailand’s reputation. 

[MrNovax]

More talk from people with protected paychecks about whether the peasants are allowed to feed their family's.  I do give credit to the author of the article for pointing out that those who can least afford the shut down are the greatest affected by these "decisions" but doubt the masters care.  

[ace035]

Just a waste of time from Pattaya city officials who attended the meeting, all the CCSA did just talk..talk..talk..& nothing happen and no progress. It's a same thing over and over again for the last 21 months. It's all about panic mode about the Omicron variant & ruin everybody lives. They need to fight the virus instead of giving up coz it will never stop.

[Stonker]

3 hours ago, MrNovax said:

More talk from people with protected paychecks about whether the peasants are allowed to feed their family's.  I do give credit to the author of the article for pointing out that those who can least afford the shut down are the greatest affected by these "decisions" but doubt the masters care.  

Do you honestly think any of those "people with protected paychecks" in attendance actually live on those paychecks?

Seriously? ?

[pascal]

decision might not be that easy to take, as it was said, night venue draw a lot of tourists. I can t imagine the result of waves of peoples coming from Europe, with potential infectious conditions. In the present situation it can't be as it was, are local tourists likely going to bars or clubs? Night venues survival rely on foreigners. with 50000 cases a days in most of European country how can we think reopening the borders to them ????? Hence with the omicron it might be even worse for Thailand. So far the curve is going down i guess the government wants to keep it that way. They are not that stupid, they perfectly know the impacts of the night life on the economy. However i think Thai peoples safety first is to take in consideration. These hit hard all night life business and so much peoples and families are involve .............. what is the worse ? let these peoples without incomes? or let them face the covid and maybe die from it? ............. well if someone can reply to this, i suggest him or her to apply for a government position asap.

[HiuMak]

8 hours ago, ace035 said:

all the CCSA did just talk..talk..talk..& nothing happen and no progress. 

Talk & Talk is TAT, CCSA is Chit Chat Small Action.

same same but different

[MrNovax]

21 hours ago, Stonker said:

Do you honestly think any of those "people with protected paychecks" in attendance actually live on those paychecks?

Seriously? ?

I believe that no rules that are issued with negatively affect their own income.  

[MrNovax]

15 hours ago, pascal said:

decision might not be that easy to take, as it was said, night venue draw a lot of tourists. I can t imagine the result of waves of peoples coming from Europe, with potential infectious conditions. In the present situation it can't be as it was, are local tourists likely going to bars or clubs? Night venues survival rely on foreigners. with 50000 cases a days in most of European country how can we think reopening the borders to them ????? Hence with the omicron it might be even worse for Thailand. So far the curve is going down i guess the government wants to keep it that way. They are not that stupid, they perfectly know the impacts of the night life on the economy. However i think Thai peoples safety first is to take in consideration. These hit hard all night life business and so much peoples and families are involve .............. what is the worse ? let these peoples without incomes? or let them face the covid and maybe die from it? ............. well if someone can reply to this, i suggest him or her to apply for a government position asap.

Do you really think this will ever end?  There will always be "cases".   waiting for Covid to go away before opening up is like waiting for the flu to disappear or cancer to be cured.  everyone is now aware of the risks and just like 5 years ago, 10, years ago, or 50 years ago, let individuals determine the risk they are willing to take.  its not my decision what is best for you and it isnt your decision what is best for me.  

[Stonker]

2 hours ago, MrNovax said:

I believe that no rules that are issued with negatively affect their own income.  

Of course they won't, but if you think their "income" comes from their "protected paychecks" you're dreaming.

[Stonker]

2 hours ago, MrNovax said:

Do you really think this will ever end?  There will always be "cases".   waiting for Covid to go away before opening up is like waiting for the flu to disappear or cancer to be cured.  everyone is now aware of the risks and just like 5 years ago, 10, years ago, or 50 years ago, let individuals determine the risk they are willing to take.  its not my decision what is best for you and it isnt your decision what is best for me.  

Delaying opening isn't to wait for Covid to "go away"  but to allow time for precautions to be taken, vaccines rolled out, etc.

Nobody's interested in taking decisions that are based on what's best for you (or me), but on what's best for the country.

[MrNovax]

3 hours ago, Stonker said:

Nobody's interested in taking decisions that are based on what's best for you (or me), but on what's best for the country.

What's best for the country?  What does that mean?  If a decision negatively impacts one person but positively impacts another does that make "the country" better off?  And before you say "majority", 1) nobody can say what is best for "the majority", 2) that is mob rule, 3) if i adversely affect a few people by a lot to positively impact many by a little, is the collective better off?  If so, feel free to divide up your possessions and pass them out equally to the people in your community.  you would then be helping the many at the sacrifice of the few. 

you should be making decisions that are best for you and i should be making decisions that are best for me.  

Edited December 16, 2021 by MrNovax

[Stonker]

7 hours ago, MrNovax said:

 you should be making decisions that are best for you and i should be making decisions that are best for me

Fortunately not everyone shares that view, and most of us are fortunate to live in a world where people consider the effect of their decisions on others rather than just themselves.

That, supposedly, is what sets humanity apart.

[LoongFred]

I don't think the government wants the return of the freewheeling and everything goes that Pattaya represented in the past. A lot of this was represented in the entertainment and bar industries.  The leaders want to attract a different type of tourist that's not compatible with the old.

Covid adds to this and officials know that these industries are a danger to the rest of the country.

 

 

Go ahead 

[MrNovax]

9 hours ago, Stonker said:

Fortunately not everyone shares that view, and most of us are fortunate to live in a world where people consider the effect of their decisions on others rather than just themselves.

That, supposedly, is what sets humanity apart.

No, we live in a world where people enforce their will on others with the threat of being locked in a cage or down the barrel of a gun.  Because some have be propagandized into hysteria others are suffering.  You are essentially saying  think that allowing millions of poor people to starve, millions more to suffer is "humane" because you dont physically see the suffering.  All these restrictions you support to help you sleep at night are preventing those in much more need than yourself from surviving.  

You're not considering others, you're more selfish than me.  

[Stonker]

2 hours ago, MrNovax said:

No, we live in a world where people enforce their will on others with the threat of being locked in a cage or down the barrel of a gun.  Because some have be propagandized into hysteria others are suffering.  You are essentially saying  think that allowing millions of poor people to starve, millions more to suffer is "humane" because you dont physically see the suffering.  All these restrictions you support to help you sleep at night are preventing those in much more need than yourself from surviving.  

You're not considering others, you're more selfish than me.  

So my objecting to your view that "you should  be making decisions that are best for you and i should be making decisions that are best for me", somehow means that I'm

"essentially saying  think that allowing millions of poor people to starve, millions more to suffer is "humane" because you dont physically see the suffering" and that I'm "not considering others" and am "more selfish" than you?

 

[JohninDublin]

On 12/15/2021 at 1:43 PM, LoongFred said:

It’s not about the bars per say. It’s about what goes on there and Thailand’s reputation. 

I don't see that those getting rich on "what goes on there" are too worried about Thailand's reputation. Far more consideration is given to "how will we replace the revenue" that sex tourism brings in if we actually have to do something about it?

As for reputation itself, I can remember a time when rightly or wrongly, TH had a reputation for AIDS and paedos. There are still many who think in those terms. Even if the gov banned it tomorrow, we would still be hearing about TH being a haven for sex tourism many years from now.

[JohninDublin]

21 hours ago, MrNovax said:

What's best for the country?  What does that mean?  If a decision negatively impacts one person but positively impacts another does that make "the country" better off?  And before you say "majority", 1) nobody can say what is best for "the majority", 2) that is mob rule, 3) if i adversely affect a few people by a lot to positively impact many by a little, is the collective better off?  If so, feel free to divide up your possessions and pass them out equally to the people in your community.  you would then be helping the many at the sacrifice of the few. 

you should be making decisions that are best for you and i should be making decisions that are best for me.  

And what if what is best for you. is worst for me? Can I say "What is best for me, is to stop Mr Novax doing what hurts me"?

I really think that idea has not been very well thought through.

[JohninDublin]

11 hours ago, LoongFred said:

I don't think the government wants the return of the freewheeling and everything goes that Pattaya represented in the past. A lot of this was represented in the entertainment and bar industries.  The leaders want to attract a different type of tourist that's not compatible with the old.

Covid adds to this and officials know that these industries are a danger to the rest of the country.

Go ahead 

Come on Fred! Give it up!. They ain't gonna get rid of sex tourism until they can find something to replace the revenues this will lose. And if and when they do find something, someone will say "Instead of getting rid of sex tourism in favour of the new project, why can't we have both"?

[JohninDublin]

4 hours ago, MrNovax said:

No, we live in a world where people enforce their will on others with the threat of being locked in a cage or down the barrel of a gun.  Because some have be propagandized into hysteria others are suffering.  You are essentially saying  think that allowing millions of poor people to starve, millions more to suffer is "humane" because you dont physically see the suffering.  All these restrictions you support to help you sleep at night are preventing those in much more need than yourself from surviving.  

You're not considering others, you're more selfish than me.  

You are being disingenuous here. It is not that "people enforce their will on others with the threat of being locked in a cage or down the barrel of a gun". Where this happens, it is governments who do it. with or without the approval of the people.

 

[MrNovax]

2 hours ago, Stonker said:

So my objecting to your view that "you should  be making decisions that are best for you and i should be making decisions that are best for me", somehow means that I'm

"essentially saying  think that allowing millions of poor people to starve, millions more to suffer is "humane" because you dont physically see the suffering" and that I'm "not considering others" and am "more selfish" than you?

its not your objection to my view, its believing you know what is best for others and fail to take into account the unintended consequences.   its easy to feel morally superior when you simply disregard the needs of others.  lockdowns are a luxury of the rich, there are many on the planet that would die if imposed.  your previous statements insinuate you have zero regard for these people and their lives.  

[MrNovax]

50 minutes ago, JohninDublin said:

What is best for me, is to stop Mr Novax doing what hurts me"?

You absolutely have the right to stop me from hurting you.  And i should be able to stop you from hurting me.  That doesnt mean you can lock me in my home or require i wear certain attire, it means you have every right to avoid me and take whatever precautions you choose short of infringing on my free movement/speech etc.  

 

41 minutes ago, JohninDublin said:

Where this happens, it is governments who do it. with or without the approval of the people.

True, but those who cheer it on are still to blame.  if we all stood against this together it would end in a day.  

[JohninDublin]

16 minutes ago, MrNovax said:

You absolutely have the right to stop me from hurting you.  And i should be able to stop you from hurting me.  That doesnt mean you can lock me in my home or require i wear certain attire, it means you have every right to avoid me and take whatever precautions you choose short of infringing on my free movement/speech etc.  

True, but those who cheer it on are still to blame.  if we all stood against this together it would end in a day.  

It seems to me that you live under a very strange gov. I've yet to witness what you talk about.

It therefore follows that I do not know anybody who cheers on such a gov. But I think your ideas border on anarchy. People cannot have unrestricted freedom, because there are far too many people, though one is too many, who will use their freedom to impinge on others freedoms. 

Where you have any anarchy, you will invariably have a population that will call for the restoration of order by any means possible. You may have noticed that I did not say "Law and Order". That's how we end up with monsters like Duterte.

I have no idea where you are from, though I do have my suspicions. Maybe it's one of those countries that has more than it's fair share of people to whom the word "freedom" means a different thing to each of them.

[Stonker]

7 hours ago, MrNovax said:

its not your objection to my view, its believing you know what is best for others and fail to take into account the unintended consequences.   its easy to feel morally superior when you simply disregard the needs of others.  lockdowns are a luxury of the rich, there are many on the planet that would die if imposed.  your previous statements insinuate you have zero regard for these people and their lives.  

Sorry, but there's no point in responding to this unashamed and unadulterated hypocrisy.

[Pinetree]

On 12/15/2021 at 8:43 PM, LoongFred said:

It’s not about the bars per say. It’s about what goes on there and Thailand’s reputation. 

exactly right