News Forum - Phuket hopes to attract Saudi and Australian tourists

[Soidog]

43 minutes ago, astro said:

Which planet would that be on?  It's simply untrue.

Norther Ireland, Sri Lanka, Basque region, east Ukraine... just a few examples.

But don't let reality get in the way of demonising the entirety of all Muslims....

The ones you quote are all political unrest. They are not unrest relating to cultural or religious difference. It’s true that politics in places like Northern Ireland and Sri Lanka were split along religious lines, but that follows the core subject of how a country is governed and where national boundaries are drawn. Conflict will happen all over the world that doesn’t include Muslims. However, the only large scale terrorism I’m aware of right now causing actions along religious lines are Muslim. I’ve no doubt there are minor issues in the Middle East and Africa, but these are not affecting global terrorism alert levels. 
 

Why do we have all the additional security checks at airports inconveniencing thousands, if not millions each day is as a result of Muslim backed terorrism. 

[TheDirtyDurian]

3 hours ago, Viggen840 said:

And THAT, my friend, is the failing in your argument. If the majority of Saudis want a peaceful life, it is up to them to ensure the feral rags are brought in line. This happens absolutely NOWHERE in the world they have infested.

And they are doing that. Over the past 20 years the Saudi government has arrested and imprisoned many people inside KSA on terrorism related charges. 

Saudi security services have worked closely with UK and USA security services, sharing information etc. Pakistani military, and especially USA military work together with KSA military in training, joint programs etc. 

"Infestation" would imply large numbers. Where in the world have large numbers of Saudi militants "infested" in the last 20 years or so?

How can your average Saudi affect what happens in other countries?

The London bombers, radicalised in the UK, were of Pakistani heritage, born in the UK. How can your average Saudi man or woman in the street change any of that?

 

 

[TheDirtyDurian]

3 hours ago, vlad said:

Are these the same Arabs that don't allow their wives to walk hand in hand with them in public, Or once they pile out of Swampy airport they flounce out to their waiting limo with their wive's behind them humping all their cases out?

Seriously??

Is that the best you could come up with?

[TheDirtyDurian]

3 hours ago, Manu said:

I guess what he does not realise for some reason is that the country he was in the army for is an ally of Saudi Arabia, the ones in power that is, the ones who are making those horrible laws and commit atrocities like in Yemen etc.., and not the common Saudi citizens that are saudis cause they were born there and simply wish to have a normal life as every common human being on this planet. I guess that is what you tried to explain, right?

Well he alleges he was in the army, I've got my doubts. Definitely not officer material anyway having read the nonsense he spouts. 

A Pattaya war hero more likely!

He's on a mission....

[TheDirtyDurian]

2 hours ago, Soidog said:

This is a great example of a polarised debate. It’s a topic which draws emotions from both sides of the debate or divide.
 

Like everyone else, I know I have some bias to my thinking and I’m sure some of that bias I’m unaware of. The only point I wish to make, is when it comes to the question of the actions of a country or it’s leadership and the people. I tend not to ask - “Are the people responsible for the actions of a minority few in a country?”  I tend to ask - “If not the people of that country, then who?”  Who are the people best places to bring about change? Who are the people with the highest chance of success? Who are the people best placed to show support by lack of action against those doing wrong? Who are the people best placed to understand the nuances of the situation within the country? Who are the people, on balance, most likely to be held responsible by the rest of the world for the actions of their leaders? 
 

I have to conclude that the answer to all of the above questions are the citizens of that country. Not the single individual who runs the corner shop. Not the guy who cuts your hair. Not your neighbour who invited you to his daughters wedding. But the collective whole of the people. It simply can not be anyone else in my opinion. 
 

This is why I hold the Russian people responsible for the actions of Putin. It’s why I hold Saudi Arabia responsible for the actions of 9/11 and the killing of Jamal Khashoggi. It’s why I hold the people in Myanmar responsible for the Rohingya massacres. If not the people of the country then who? None of the above actions were carried out by one crazed gunman. The people, over time, with an attitude of ignorance, selfishness and laziness have allowed these tyrants to grow and develop and get to the positions they are in to create these problems. 
 

Are all Muslims terrorists? No, but it seems all terrorists are Muslims. 

I get your point and it's an interesting idea, but if the people have no power, how are they responsible?

You're asking a lot of people to face imprisonment, death etc, and then say it's all your fault if you don't risk that. 

Plenty of countries where people face just that for going against the grain. 

Are they all responsible?

Because, I don't want to get hurt, die, go to jail, I'm responsible for my government. 

It's an interesting concept. Ask the Burmese, Iranians, Ugandans, South Africans etc how they feel or felt about that?

 

[astro]

36 minutes ago, Soidog said:

The ones you quote are all political unrest.

Yes, so what? The comment I replied to says "Well you cant deny that where ever 2 groups have problem one of them is always muslim..."

36 minutes ago, Soidog said:

They are not unrest relating to cultural or religious difference.

No religious differences in Northern Ireland?

No cultural identity the driving factor in the Basque region?

Where to draw the line?

The unrest in Southern Thailand and South Philippines are political/territorial as well as cultural/religious.

Edited June 6, 2022 by astro

[TheDirtyDurian]

20 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

OK so why are a few individuals from a Christian, Buddhist, Hindu, Sheikh of indeed any other religion NOT carrying out terrorist atrocities?   

It is not bigoted to point out facts. ONLY one religion appears to hate everyone else to the extent they will kill them for no reason other than they are from a different cast.

This isn't about terrorism. It's about the bigoted idea that the majority of Saudis believe in this extreme ideology, which is blatantly a load of b@LL@x.

[TheDirtyDurian]

18 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

It is the point. Not all Muslims are terrorists but it seems all terrorists are Muslim. 

If other religious groups were behaving the same way then their religious leaders would be condemning it but for some reason very few Imams do so.

Tell me something. Where does the funding for these groups come from?

Another untruth. I can't comment on other countries because I don't live there, but presuming we're talking about Saudi here, there are often opinion pieces in the local newspapers, media etc with clerics denouncing extremist ideology, and refuting it step by step with correct interpretations from the Qur'an. 

I'm guessing you wouldn't know that though because you're not familiar with Saudi media. 

[Rookiescot]

39 minutes ago, TheDirtyDurian said:

This isn't about terrorism. It's about the bigoted idea that the majority of Saudis believe in this extreme ideology, which is blatantly a load of b@LL@x.

My post was about terrorism. Why do some Muslims believe killing anyone not Muslim is OK?

[Rookiescot]

36 minutes ago, TheDirtyDurian said:

Another untruth. I can't comment on other countries because I don't live there, but presuming we're talking about Saudi here, there are often opinion pieces in the local newspapers, media etc with clerics denouncing extremist ideology, and refuting it step by step with correct interpretations from the Qur'an. 

I'm guessing you wouldn't know that though because you're not familiar with Saudi media. 

Thats good then but where does the funding for these extremists come from?

[Smithydog]

Hey members,

We are getting a bit off track here. The thread is about tourism and regardless of what you may feel about their religion, not all Muslims are terrorists.

Every society has bad people. Let's perhaps try and concentrate on the good ones for a change.

Thanks

Moderator

[Soidog]

2 hours ago, TheDirtyDurian said:

I get your point and it's an interesting idea, but if the people have no power, how are they responsible?

You're asking a lot of people to face imprisonment, death etc, and then say it's all your fault if you don't risk that. 

Plenty of countries where people face just that for going against the grain. 

Are they all responsible?

Because, I don't want to get hurt, die, go to jail, I'm responsible for my government. 

It's an interesting concept. Ask the Burmese, Iranians, Ugandans, South Africans etc how they feel or felt about that?

Yes and I totally get your point about individuals not wanting to risk their life. However, ultimately, most countries and its people have had to fight for liberty and freedom. It’s one reason why it disappoints me to see people who live in free societies complain and moan so much about it. It’s totally disrespectful for the thousands who did fight and die for the freedoms they enjoy. 
 

It isn’t an easy thing for people to do and I certainly don’t blame them if they choose not to. However, this still means the balance of “Blame”, “Accountability” or “Responsibility” in these places must rest with its people. It certainly doesn’t rest with outsiders. 
 

My thinking on this is why I also find it disappointing that many people choose to ignore politics and don’t vote. It’s this very laziness and attitude of can’t be bothered to have a voice which is what allows extremism to grow and prosper.  

[Soidog]

2 hours ago, astro said:

No religious differences in Northern Ireland?

No not really. It became split along religious lines only because the loyalists are predominately Protestant and the Republicans are predominately Catholic. It’s a war of a divided Ireland, not a religious war. 
 

2 hours ago, astro said:

No cultural identity the driving factor in the Basque region?

Yes, but this is a tiny minority in a small population. The same cultural identity issues exist with Catalonia, Wales and even Cornwall. These people are a minor inconvenience to the local area. They are not international terrorists exporting terror from Bali to New York. 

[astro]

"Well you cant deny that where ever 2 groups have problem one of them is always muslim..."

- that's what I took issue with and have proven to be false.

 

Since this thread is about tourism in Phuket:

Has there been any international terrorist act from those evil Muslims yet, will probability increase when the Whababists from Saudi arrive?

Should the forum membership arm up to defend themselves?

[whyuthinktoomut]

Soidog wrote: ".... with an attitude of ignorance, selfishness and laziness have allowed these tyrants to grow and develop and get to the positions they are in to create these problems. "

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Change "tyrants" to "those who have been "in charge" of countries". ( which the ones you see on TV, are are not in charge, ultimately)

Sounds like 98% of  the politicians of every major western country for the past 90 years.   

You know, because they really listen to "all you peoples" in our western "brand" countries.   And the regular, middle class  cohort has grown , right?  

Who here would prefer to have, or have had the choice, to be able to  have their family live well enough on  1 salary?   Some "velly bad " countries can manage that.  

There must be some sliver of "good".

Edited June 6, 2022 by whyuthinktoomut

[astro]

There's a tiny difference: polititians are elected every few years, tyrants aren't.

[vlad]

5 hours ago, TheDirtyDurian said:

Seriously??

Is that the best you could come up with?

Wrong or right. Is this way to treat females in Saudi ?

[whyuthinktoomut]

20 minutes ago, astro said:

There's a tiny difference: polititians are elected every few years, tyrants aren't.

Certainly.  That's what I am saying.

Everyone enjoys the (voting) sideshow for a day or two until  they realise most are two sides of the same coin and the ones who could effect REAL change are shown the Zapruder film.. then, are courteously asked " Any questions..."

[TheDirtyDurian]

3 hours ago, Soidog said:

Yes and I totally get your point about individuals not wanting to risk their life. However, ultimately, most countries and its people have had to fight for liberty and freedom. It’s one reason why it disappoints me to see people who live in free societies complain and moan so much about it. It’s totally disrespectful for the thousands who did fight and die for the freedoms they enjoy. 
 

It isn’t an easy thing for people to do and I certainly don’t blame them if they choose not to. However, this still means the balance of “Blame”, “Accountability” or “Responsibility” in these places must rest with its people. It certainly doesn’t rest with outsiders. 
 

My thinking on this is why I also find it disappointing that many people choose to ignore politics and don’t vote. It’s this very laziness and attitude of can’t be bothered to have a voice which is what allows extremism to grow and prosper.  

Think we'll have to agree to disagree. The mods have spoken..

Hopefully a mass influx of Saudis into Thailand will go some way to dispel some of the myths and hearsay, and utter rubbish that some people have come out with on this thread.

[TheDirtyDurian]

1 hour ago, vlad said:

Wrong or right. Is this way to treat females in Saudi ?

It only happened in your imagination, but anyways....

Hopefully a mass influx of Saudis will be coming your way soon. 

Thailand should be happy about that. 

[vlad]

So you don't want to answer that Durian ok.

[Soidog]

2 hours ago, TheDirtyDurian said:

Think we'll have to agree to disagree. The mods have spoken..

Hopefully a mass influx of Saudis into Thailand will go some way to dispel some of the myths and hearsay, and utter rubbish that some people have come out with on this thread.

I missed the Mods input. 
 

Yes it’s fine to agree to disagree. I also know many lovely people who follow the Muslin faith. They are utterly disgusted by the behaviour of the people who carry out such atrocities in the name of their religion. But I’m afraid that still misses the point for me. It has to be someone’s responsibility to sort this nonsense out, and it’s not me

 

Take care and appreciate the civilised debate

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