News Forum - New York TAT says US travellers look for trips without quarantine

[Zool]

  On 8/28/2021 at 2:32 AM, BlueSphinx said:

...It hasn't dawned yet on the majority of people (and the main-stream media will not tell them) that it are actually the vaccinated that pose a far greater threat to spread covid-19 than the unvaccinated...

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You're not suggesting that the mainstream media would lie or twist the truth, are you?

[NCC1701A]

"Thailand, along with several other South East Asian countries, have made Bloomberg’s list of worst places to be for the current phase of the pandemic which has been fueled by the spread of the Delta variant."

"Adding insult to injury, Bloomberg has put Thailand on its list of most poorly performing countries during the current phase of the pandemic."

<TE links not approved>

Edited August 28, 2021 by KaptainRob
Please, no TEnq links.

[AdamX]

  On 8/27/2021 at 8:11 PM, Zool said:

That's a great question. I don't have a reference but I believe the asymptomatic spreaders is a myth.

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I also believe this, for what are being called asymptomatic are—I believe— actually false positives due to  unreasonable PCR CT settings for a test that is not designed to diagnose Covid.

There really is no other reason for such huge number of cases, with so few that show symptoms, even after 14 day isolation.

Anecdotally, I personally know several dozens of people who were isolated and released after 14 days symptom free.

When asked "why don't you test for the Virus after release", the answer being given was "your covid is dead, no need to retest". (cue Homer Simpson face palm)

Can any of the forever-lockdown-endless-vaxers provide an explanation?

Edited August 28, 2021 by AdamX

[dmacarelli]

Require double vaccination, with a quality vax, unlike the very low end Sinovax being used here. And require a covid negative test. And restrict only the nations that are at the top of the covid list. That is all. NO OTHER restrictions. Get some adults in the room, please. So much timidity by the weak, feeble, useless army appointees. 

And remember, with the daily count rising here, international tourists are taking a far greater risk by being here, and being exposed to the Thais, than the Thai people are taking by being exposed to them. Lastly, Thailand needs the world right now, 20X more than the world needs Thailand. This is not the COTKU (Center of the known universe). The locals are in a world of hurt, economically. And it may last a very, very long time. I predict five years, and the fallout will be worse than 1997. And most of it appears to be sabotage. Willful or not.

It they do a re-opening many ex-pats will return. Only a small number of tourists. My guess would be if they re-opened with NO restrictions at all next year, they might see a million tourists. Maybe. Two million by 2023-2025. Possibly as many as 5 million, five years from now. Getting the tourists to come back here is going to be infinitely harder than they think.

First and foremost, the lower to middle income crowd from China, India and Malaysia have been hard hit by all of this Covid crap, and it will take a long time before most of them are ready to spend alot of money on vacations.

Second, the longer Thailand waits, the harder it is going to be. Thailand is already being forgotten, and is the laughing stock of the planet at this time, for the ridiculous number of restrictions imposed on anyone who wants to come here, even though it is them taking the risk, NOT the Thais, and the locals here are the real zombies now, and the real threat to the health of an incoming tourist. 

Third, they never even considered addressing any of the issues plaguing the industry, long before Covid. And they continue to use Covid as a cover story, for any and all issues pertaining to tourism. The industry is basically finished here. Five years from now it will be a pale shadow of it's former self. Tourism here is essentially finished.

[kmc]

israel has vaccinated 80% of population.  covid infection/hospitalization are almost the same as before the vaccine.  so does the vaccine work?

[EdwardV]

  On 8/28/2021 at 12:11 AM, Paco said:

lol only americans?

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Of course not. However it does seem to be the only TAT office to ask the locals what they are willing to put up with for a vacation. Personally I’m headed to Europe next month instead of Thailand for just those reasons. 

[Zool]

delete

Edited August 28, 2021 by Zool

[NCC1701A]

  On 8/28/2021 at 2:58 AM, NCC1701A said:

<TE links not approved>

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i did not know that. sorry.

here is the link to the original Bloomberg story. 

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/covid-resilience-ranking/?srnd=premium-asia&sref=Yg3sQEZ2&utm_source=twitter&cmpid=socialflow-twitter-business&utm_content=business&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=socialflow-organic

[Guevara]

  On 8/27/2021 at 6:02 PM, PhayakPeter said:

It's not just Americans, its a no given that any tourist would choose a country with restrictions and expense over a FREE country. But not Spain, Jay said it's more expensive.

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When did Jay become a self appointed travel guru?

[Guevara]

  On 8/28/2021 at 3:31 AM, kmc said:

israel has vaccinated 80% of population.  covid infection/hospitalization are almost the same as before the vaccine.  so does the vaccine work?

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You might be wise to check hospitalisation figures.

[Griff1315]

  On 8/27/2021 at 7:41 PM, Tim said:

People of Phuket are vaccinated and tourists coming to Phuket are also vaccinated, so for christ sake why this crazy game of PCR testing and all that insanity !? It's time to let people live their life and earn money.

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Unfortunately the majority of the Phuket population has been vaccinated with Sinovac which as we are all aware has very little if any efficacy against the Indian variant that's now starting to sweep across Thailand and Phuket.

1046 cases in a week 

Just a little over the 90 a week that was the original cut off point.

[Stardust]

  On 8/27/2021 at 9:43 PM, PapayaBokBok said:

I'll be first in Line...been waiting for this to happen....tho doubtful due to thai logic

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Logic? In the bubble of them who  are in charge, logic and common sense is unknown.

[Soidog]

  On 8/27/2021 at 11:47 PM, Mopi said:

The longer I live as a fully vaccinated person in a covid recovering continent (Europe) the less inclined I am to entertain the excessive entry requirements put in place by Thailand. When Thailand had near zero case numbers it could claim some sort of safe haven exclusive status but those days are long gone and they ain't coming back. Drop the CoE, drop all PCR tests, drop special Thai insurance, for now I'd suggest an antigen test before arrival, some regular form of travel insurance, a 7 day sandbox (Phuket, Bangkok, Pattaya) to reassure rural Thais that dirty foreigners aren't killing everyone. By November 2021 I doubt fully vaccinated western tourists will be prepared to put up with any restrictions so Thailand will need to decide what it's priorities are and how many of its people it is willing to drive into destitution.

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That’s a great answer @Mopi   This half hearted opening is doing nothing at all. The Thais have assumed they can open as they have and then over the months slowly reduce restriction on tourists. I can understand it from a safety point of view when they had zero Covid and incoming people were unvaccinated, but it literally makes no sense when they claim Phuket are highly vaccinated residents and incoming tourists are all fully vaccinated. If you follow that logic, then these restriction will remain in place for ever. They are clearly not going to keep it going for ever, so now is the time to return to normal or stop the whole thing until they have a better and more relaxed approach to Covid. 
 

Currently they are about to allow unvaccinated and potentially infected people to travel from Bangkok to other provinces. No checks and very little restrictions other than masks etc. Yet they won’t allow fully vaccinated and tested people travel to Phuket without the pain of a COE, expensive insurance and having three further expensive PCR tests. 

[Woifal]

  On 8/27/2021 at 6:33 PM, Zool said:

'Vaccinated' people can still get infected and can still get other people infected. I'm not sure I would want a bunch of infected people travelling all over the world, not showing symptoms, so they wouldn't even know that they are infected and need to isolate. I would much rather see the unvaccinated travelling. When they get sick, they are aware, and can quarantine properly. I think the vaccinated should be on quarantine until the vaccine loses its effectiveness, which is a few months I believe.

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However, new studies have already shown that vaccinated people are less contagious and for a shorter period of time.

[BIGGLES]

  On 8/27/2021 at 7:41 PM, Tim said:

People of Phuket are vaccinated and tourists coming to Phuket are also vaccinated, so for christ sake why this crazy game of PCR testing and all that insanity !? It's time to let people live their life and earn money.

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Problem is, the Thai people are not fully vaccinated.  At best most have had one shot not two. Even those who have managed to get two shots have had the Sinovac jab. That is completely useless  against the Delta variant ( the one sweeping Thailand).

The fully vaccinated tourist ( two shots of AZ or Pfizer), are not the problem, the Thai's are the problem.

[Guest1]

  On 8/28/2021 at 2:41 PM, BIGGLES said:

[...]

Even those who have managed to get two shots have had the Sinovac jab. That is completely useless  against the Delta variant ( the one sweeping Thailand).

[...]

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It is of course little helpful against  getting infected.

But still it seems to help to lower sick cases, really hospitalized cases, ICU cases!

Most infected people are in "field hospitals" for quarantaene, just b/c they know their own: 

Quarantaene at home, ok, oh, I just have to go to 7, oh, and I need to refill my phone. 

Interesting, however, now the "troops" for procative screenings, who where vaccinating staff before, are getting quarantaened after the screenings (500 or so found, if I remember right), just to not infect the people at vaccination appointments. 

So I see that, a little bit, as a "oopsi, our sinovac vacinated staff is not really getting sick, but can infect others.  Symtomless is assumingly more in vaccinated people, as in unvaccinated.

And both can transmit!

[PapayaBokBok]

  On 8/28/2021 at 12:05 AM, Disenfranchised said:

A governments first responsibility is to its citizens not to overpriviliged white folk. Go to Florida!

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Could not pay me all the money in the world to return there..did 4 months and thats was enough- pre covid!

[PapayaBokBok]

  On 8/28/2021 at 12:00 AM, Disenfranchised said:

Never heard of tyhoid Mary?

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last seen on soi 6 in Patts..

[bushav8r]

  On 8/28/2021 at 6:47 AM, Guevara said:

When did Jay become a self appointed travel guru?

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He is just offering his opinion and I think he has good insight and experience.

I don't think he is pretending to be a guru.  He is a snappy dresser too!   555

[Rain]

  On 8/28/2021 at 3:31 AM, kmc said:

israel has vaccinated 80% of population.  covid infection/hospitalization are almost the same as before the vaccine.  so does the vaccine work?

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Might be an interesting research project as to why this is occurring. I'm sure one can find similar situations in the world where a healthy percentage of the population is vaccinated, yet continue to see rising infections and deaths.

[farang]

ive been waiting on thai to open with out all those restrictions.as of now you have to get a visa for long stay,a  coe,a covid test 3 days before flight,go back and forth with the embassy in usa which dont respond to your questions,take more test there,pay for 7 days looking at walls,and buy  2 insurance policies!! one for $100,000 usa and must cover covid and you must have your covid shot card. i love thailand and would come back today if  those restrictions were removed. i understand having the shot card record and visa but all those other hoops to jump thru is  crazy.so i do wish thai the best on getting  thai people  vaccines and lifting those many rules.thanks dave

[King Cotton]

  On 8/29/2021 at 2:33 AM, farang said:

i love thailand and would come back today if  those restrictions were removed. i understand having the shot card record and visa but all those other hoops to jump thru is  crazy.so i do wish thai the best on getting  thai people  vaccines and lifting those many rules.thanks dave

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Your comments sum things up perfectly . . . a sad scenario, for sure. And your debut post, too, so thanks for that!

Hello, farang and welcome to Thaiger Talk

Please feel free to tell us a bit about yourself in 'Introductions'. It's good to pick-up on those sometimes differing regional or geographical perspectives.

And check-out the Guidelines, too, when you get a free minute. They're there to help us all enjoy our time here.

Happy posting

King Cotton

[Bob20]

  On 8/28/2021 at 2:16 PM, Woifal said:

However, new studies have already shown that vaccinated people are less contagious and for a shorter period of time.

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So?

Shall we visibly tag the vaccinated? Then you can recognise when they were vaccinated and with which vaccine, to know the degree of infectiousness, so you can decide if you keep 50, 100 or 150cm distance?

There are lots of crazy quotes around, yet this is the one that counts:

Nobody is safe until everybody is safe.

[AdamX]

  On 8/29/2021 at 3:31 AM, Bob20 said:

So?

Shall we visibly tag the vaccinated? Then you can recognise when they were vaccinated and with which vaccine, to know the degree of infectiousness, so you can decide if you keep 50, 100 or 150cm distance?

There are lots of crazy quotes around, yet this is the one that counts:

Nobody is safe until everybody is safe.

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Do you mean that this is the craziest quote?

Please clarify

[Bob20]

  On 8/29/2021 at 2:33 AM, farang said:

ive been waiting on thai to open with out all those restrictions.as of now you have to get a visa for long stay,a  coe,a covid test 3 days before flight,go back and forth with the embassy in usa which dont respond to your questions,take more test there,pay for 7 days looking at walls,and buy  2 insurance policies!! one for $100,000 usa and must cover covid and you must have your covid shot card. i love thailand and would come back today if  those restrictions were removed. i understand having the shot card record and visa but all those other hoops to jump thru is  crazy.so i do wish thai the best on getting  thai people  vaccines and lifting those many rules.thanks dave

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Friend, you shouldn't want to come here because the restrictions are lifted, because that changes with the wind.

Come when it's safe!

Safety here is unrelated to the rules that are time after time changed  to make a few baht. That can be the only reason to ignore the high number of infections and deaths and will be followed by new restrictions until they finally ramp up vaccination.

And once it's safe again, consider this:

For a long time this will be not be the Thailand that you know and love from previous holidays. The streets are empty, the shops are closed, most fun things have shut or are banned for now. Forget socialising. 

Enjoy...