News Forum - Pattaya bar owner goes on hunger strike over government diddling and re-opening fiasco

[Thaiger]

“Yesterday, I made a post about fasting (water + coconut water) until the bars open.” Things are tough in the Pattaya bar scene. So much so that one of the town’s leading bar entrepreneurs, Bryan Flowers, who heads up the Night Wish Group, has decided to go on a hunger strike until the situation is resolved. ‘Resolved’ means the bars are open and serving alcohol. Bryan’s Group started off their pandemic by rolling their sleeves up and getting involved in any number of local initiatives to help out-of-work staff get themselves sorted, or at least fed. But things went from […]

The story Pattaya bar owner goes on hunger strike over government diddling and re-opening fiasco as seen on Thaiger News.

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[HolyCowCm]

I think it is these type of bars they are trying to see not open. And using the word protest is not actually an acceptable word for a foreigner to use against this government. 

[Benroon]

Errrr I applaud the guy, but what's the point of a hunger strike that carries no risk ie 'he knows what he's doing' - its only the risk of death that would wake someone up with the bad publicity - it just sounds like this guy is going to be a bit hungry !

Why are people so slow to cotton on that this government want rid of the bar scene entirely. They show it every time they open their mouths, every idea they come up with and every action they take.

[JohninDublin]

8 minutes ago, Benroon said:

Why are people so slow to cotton on that this government want rid of the bar scene entirely. They show it every time they open their mouths, every idea they come up with and every action they take.

I am not so sure they do want the bar scene gone. But even if they do, I think they are a bit like arms dealers who would like to see peace, but not until they can switch to an equally lucrative trade to replace the revenues that selling weapons brings.

[Bob20]

Not surprising. It's what many have been saying for ages. 

Businesses need a clear plan!

Much better to firmly say 1 January and vaccinate like mad before then, rather than to say a little bit on 1 October, a little bit on 1 November and a little bit on 1 December, each time with restrictions, shocks from clusters, no real opening, no alcohol, complete areas closed, and businesses re-stocking each time for only few customers. 

The ones that lasted this long despite of Covid may still go bust purely because of the government's handling of the matter.

[Benroon]

4 minutes ago, JohninDubin said:

I am not so sure they do want the bar scene gone. But even if they do, I think they are a bit like arms dealers who would like to see peace, but not until they can switch to an equally lucrative trade to replace the revenues that selling weapons brings.

Oh for sure don't get me wrong, another money spinner needs to be in place, but they show absolute disdain for the nightlife scene.

[JohninDublin]

I can sympathise with your post, but we have been hearing pretty much the same from many countries. 

How can you plan with any certainty if govs keep moving the goal posts? By the same token, how can govs plan with any certainty if CV keeps moving the goalposts.

I am not here to advocate for any gov, let alone TH, but I'd rather see a plan being put forward along the lines of "If we can achieve A, B, C and D by Q day, we we do W, X, Y and Z. But please remember, we are often at the whims of the Virus and those who refuse to play their part".

Regarding Mr Flowers in particular, I have a certain problem sympathising with him in particular, because as best as I can tell, Nightwish is bar or group of bars centred on Soi 6. 

Edit: My apologies. I don't know what happened here, but this post was in response to @Bob20 commencing: Not surprising. It's what many have been saying for ages. 

[Soidog]

16 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

The ones that lasted this long despite of Covid may still go bust purely because of the government's handling of the matter.

That’s correct. Many will have deferred loans and new ones on top of that to repay. Many will also try the sophisticated business trick I often see in Thailand, which is to increase prices when you don’t have many customers. A sure way to collapse a business. 

[Soidog]

16 minutes ago, Benroon said:

Oh for sure don't get me wrong, another money spinner needs to be in place, but they show absolute disdain for the nightlife scene.

I think some of the disdain is what you see in many countries when it comes to hedonistic nightlife. You can see the same thing in parts of Spain and Greece. I’m not sure if it’s a form of virtue signalling or trying to show they, as upstanding people, would never approve of such entertainment and certainly never enjoy such a place. We get enough of it on this forum, so why not politicians. 

[gummy]

3 hours ago, JohninDubin said:

I can sympathise with your post, but we have been hearing pretty much the same from many countries. 

How can you plan with any certainty if govs keep moving the goal posts? By the same token, how can govs plan with any certainty if CV keeps moving the goalposts.

I am not here to advocate for any gov, let alone TH, but I'd rather see a plan being put forward along the lines of "If we can achieve A, B, C and D by Q day, we we do W, X, Y and Z. But please remember, we are often at the whims of the Virus and those who refuse to play their part".

Regarding Mr Flowers in particular, I have a certain problem sympathising with him in particular, because as best as I can tell, Nightwish is bar or group of bars centred on Soi 6. 

Well I understand your sentiments or otherwise. However in the last few years this group did undergo rapid expansion with their business model in the main having bars open to the street, mainly soi 6.  The issue is that they were not just a magnet to the customers, they were also a magnet to the RTP mafia who employ their own low lifes to snitch inorder to maximise their extortion rackets which I suspect, but don't now, this gentlemen's businesses paid.  

Prior to all that and the many years before, the bars were mainly closed of from the street hence a higher degree of customer privacy for owners and customers alike. I have no idea how much the business group now run in bar numbers in soi 6 but I suspect a significant number. 

To announce he is going on hunger strike would possible be as effective as the hole that is left when you take your hands out of a bucket of water, and honestly who would care ?

Edited November 7, 2021 by Andrew Reeve
commemt within the quote removed

[JohninDublin]

4 minutes ago, Soidog said:

That’s correct. Many will have deferred loans and new ones on top of that to repay. Many will also try the sophisticated business trick I often see in Thailand, which is to increase prices when you don’t have many customers. A sure way to collapse a business. 

Old habits die hard.

[JohninDublin]

1 minute ago, gummy said:

Well I understand your sentiments or otherwise. However in the last few years this group did undergo rapid expansion with their business model in the main having bars open to the street, mainly soi 6.  The issue is that they were not just a magnet to the customers, they were also a magnet to the RTP mafia who employ their own low lifes to snitch inorder to maximise their extortion rackets which I suspect, but don't now, this gentlemen's businesses paid.  

Prior to all that and the many years before, the bars were mainly closed of from the street hence a higher degree of customer privacy for owners and customers alike. I have no idea how much the business group now run in bar numbers in soi 6 but I suspect a significant number. 

To announce he is going on hunger strike would possible be as effective as the hole that is left when you take your hands out of a bucket of water, and honestly who would care ?

I was in two minds whether to give that post a thumbs up or a laugh.

[Soidog]

3 minutes ago, gummy said:

Well I understand your sentiments or otherwise. However in the last few years this group did undergo rapid expansion with their business model in the main having bars open to the street, mainly soi 6.  The issue is that they were not just a magnet to the customers, they were also a magnet to the RTP mafia who employ their own low lifes to snitch inorder to maximise their extortion rackets which I suspect, but don't now, this gentlemen's businesses paid.  

Prior to all that and the many years before, the bars were mainly closed of from the street hence a higher degree of customer privacy for owners and customers alike. I have no idea how much the business group now run in bar numbers in soi 6 but I suspect a significant number. 

To announce he is going on hunger strike would possible be as effective as the hole that is left when you take your hands out of a bucket of water, and honestly who would care ?

I don’t know how this guy and the many foreigners he employs to run the bars get away with the things they do. The Nightwish group is obviously a proper registered business with all of the right documents, but they seem to employ foreigners at short notice to run the bars. I assume it’s all in the price with the RTP? How else? 

[JohninDublin]

5 minutes ago, Soidog said:

The Nightwish group is obviously a proper registered business with all of the right documents, but they seem to employ foreigners at short notice to run the bars.  

It looks like the old colonial model. Natives have very little chance of upward mobility.

[gummy]

Just now, JohninDubin said:

It looks like the old colonial model. Natives have very little chance of upward mobility.

What, come on you have been here and know that many of the natives are mostly extremely lithe and mobile either upward or any other chosen position   

[Stardust]

54 minutes ago, HolyCowCm said:

I think it is these type of bars they are trying to see not open. And using the word protest is not actually an acceptable word for a foreigner to use against this government. 

But it hits all entertainment business not just this group and a resort city without entertainment, clubs etc would not be workable all over the world. In all tourist destinatinatiins they have it because the tourists want to enjoy their holidays and thats why you have everywhere beachbars and one with live music or djs. I think is not wise to put all that entertainment now in one pot and it would not be fair for all the entertainment aces with live music and the musicians. If they wanted to stop any prostitutions they could do it already long time ago without destroying all the entertainment industry. There are a majority who not went to the soi 6  and enjoyed other areas or places with live music.

[Bob20]

20 minutes ago, JohninDubin said:

I can sympathise with your post, but we have been hearing pretty much the same from many countries. 

How can you plan with any certainty if govs keep moving the goal posts? By the same token, how can govs plan with any certainty if CV keeps moving the goalposts.

I am not here to advocate for any gov, let alone TH, but I'd rather see a plan being put forward along the lines of "If we can achieve A, B, C and D by Q day, we we do W, X, Y and Z. But please remember, we are often at the whims of the Virus and those who refuse to play their part".

Regarding Mr Flowers in particular, I have a certain problem sympathising with him in particular, because as best as I can tell, Nightwish is bar or group of bars centred on Soi 6. That being the case, I have to wonder if he is a pimp, in which case, my sympathies will not be wasted on him.

Edit: My apologies. I don't know what happened here, but this post was in response to @Bob20 commencing: Not surprising. It's what many have been saying for ages. 

My comment was in regards to businesses in general as you can see. And it's an opinion, so I'm not going to endlessly discuss it.

Most businesses can't open for a couple of customers and we have not been surprised by the virus since we know about Delta, but have been lumbered with slow response by the government with countless overstated promises and truly dumb decisions that some here predicted the dire outcome of.

This government has no plan. It has people that open their mouths and then want to follow through to save face, even though they know full well that they are doing the wrong thing. Besides, they base their decisions on numbers that are hardly ever substantiated and differ by the day and by the person who quotes them.

On this forum most are in the comfortable situation not to run a business here. But I am sure that if you had been sitting at home for months on end and the government told you that the country is opening up and TAT paints a great picture with overstated figures, you'd be sorely disappointed when you open your business and still hardly anyone turns up after you've spent more money preparing for what is not yet coming.

Other countries have made mistakes too. And for that reason, Thailand being behind the curve, should have learned from them.

First vaccinate! Not the meager 30% (if even that, when taking Sinovac into account).

After most are properly protected, then open up. And still don't abandon all preventative measures, or you'll have new bad-news messages to give later on as we see in Europe now.

Then everything can open up and customers will be around too.

[JohninDublin]

Just now, Soidog said:

Not at all. 

Just thought you might be alluding to my hypocrisy insofar as I might avail of their services. The only thing I will say in their favour, is that I am aware of 2 or 3 occasions where a B/g has robbed a customer, and the bar owner has recovered the property, or fired the girl. 

I am not aware that your local friendly neighbourhood pimp back home can compete with that level of service. (hahaha)

[divrg]

59 minutes ago, JohninDubin said:

I am not so sure they do want the bar scene gone. But even if they do, I think they are a bit like arms dealers who would like to see peace, but not until they can switch to an equally lucrative trade to replace the revenues that selling weapons brings.

And that simply is not going to happen.

[JohninDublin]

5 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

My comment was in regards to businesses in general as you can see. And it's an opinion, so I'm not going to endlessly discuss it.

Most businesses can't open for a couple of customers and we have not been surprised by the virus since we know about Delta, but have been lumbered with slow response by the government with countless overstated promises and truly dumb decisions that some here predicted the dire outcome of.

This government has no plan. It has people that open their mouths and then want to follow through to save face, even though they know full well that they are doing the wrong thing. Besides, they base their decisions on numbers that are hardly ever substantiated and differ by the day and by the person who quotes them.

On this forum most are in the comfortable situation not to run a business here. But I am sure that if you had been sitting at home for months on end and the government told you that the country is opening up and TAT paints a great picture with overstated figures, you'd be sorely disappointed when you open your business and still hardly anyone turns up after you've spent more money preparing for what is not yet coming.

Other countries have made mistakes too. And for that reason, Thailand being behind the curve, should have learned from them.

First vaccinate! Not the meager 30% (if even that, when taking Sinovac into account).

After most are properly protected, then open up. And still don't abandon all preventative measures, or you'll have new bad-news messages to give later on as we see in Europe now.

Then everything can open up and customers will be around too.

I wasn't being critical. Just making an observation how so many people are expecting certainty in such an uncertain environment.

[Soidog]

20 minutes ago, gummy said:

Definitely all over Thailand and always was way before any foreigners arrived in their numbers. It always amused me the way it was justified. Yes we know it was pimping, the bar getting a cut of the girls services to the customer yet it was justified to save face by saying " to cover for the loss of drink sales whilst the lady is off the premises".   They couldn't understand the argument that if the girls weren't there in the first place the customers would not have come..

Exactly right. I’ve heard that line many times of justifying through loss of the girl being available to serve or get lady drink from customers. 
 

As a funny aside: A few years back I met a colleague of mine in Bangkok on a stop over on his return from Australia. He had never been to Bangkok and of course wanted to see the famous nightlife! So I took him on the usual tour of Cowboy, Nana etc. In several bars he paid the bill and refused to let me pay my half, telling me “it was all on expenses”!  A couple of weeks later he called me to tell me he had had a difficult conversation with finance over his expenses claim. They wanted to know “what was the 450 baht for something called “Ladydrinks” on the receipt. He had only gone and got a itemised receipt without noticing what was listed. I’m not sure on what paper the receipt was written, but if it was headed paper with a name like G-Spot or Spankys I’d have thought that was a big enough problem to submit expenses. What a idiot

[JohninDublin]

5 minutes ago, divrg said:

And that simply is not going to happen.

I certainly don't see it happening anytime soon. It's not as if there was no P4P in TH before the Yanks started visiting Pattaya. The only difference between then and now, is the whole world knows about it now.

[Soidog]

9 minutes ago, JohninDubin said:

Just thought you might be alluding to my hypocrisy insofar as I might avail of their services. The only thing I will say in their favour, is that I am aware of 2 or 3 occasions where a B/g has robbed a customer, and the bar owner has recovered the property, or fired the girl. 

I am not aware that your local friendly neighbourhood pimp back home can compete with that level of service. (hahaha)

I totally agree. If had had been alluding to any alleged hypocrisy, then I would have been struck down with a bolt of lightening .

The issue with theft is a very good reason to avoid freelancers. Not so much ones who are regulars at a particular bar, but certainly the beach road type. Especially the 6’6” ones

[JohninDublin]

12 minutes ago, Soidog said:

Exactly right. I’ve heard that line many times of justifying through loss of the girl being available to serve or get lady drink from customers. 
 

As a funny aside: A few years back I met a colleague of mine in Bangkok on a stop over on his return from Australia. He had never been to Bangkok and of course wanted to see the famous nightlife! So I took him on the usual tour of Cowboy, Nana etc. In several bars he paid the bill and refused to let me pay my half, telling me “it was all on expenses”!  A couple of weeks later he called me to tell me he had had a difficult conversation with finance over his expenses claim. They wanted to know “what was the 450 baht for something called “Ladydrinks” on the receipt. He had only gone and got a itemised receipt without noticing what was listed. I’m not sure on what paper the receipt was written, but if it was headed paper with a name like G-Spot or Spankys I’d have thought that was a big enough problem to submit expenses. What a idiot

That's priceless.

[gummy]

14 minutes ago, Soidog said:

Exactly right. I’ve heard that line many times of justifying through loss of the girl being available to serve or get lady drink from customers. 
 

As a funny aside: A few years back I met a colleague of mine in Bangkok on a stop over on his return from Australia. He had never been to Bangkok and of course wanted to see the famous nightlife! So I took him on the usual tour of Cowboy, Nana etc. In several bars he paid the bill and refused to let me pay my half, telling me “it was all on expenses”!  A couple of weeks later he called me to tell me he had had a difficult conversation with finance over his expenses claim. They wanted to know “what was the 450 baht for something called “Ladydrinks” on the receipt. He had only gone and got a itemised receipt without noticing what was listed. I’m not sure on what paper the receipt was written, but if it was headed paper with a name like G-Spot or Spankys I’d have thought that was a big enough problem to submit expenses. What a idiot

There is always one born every minute.