Medics want ban on vaccine exports, legal experts warn against it

[Thaiger]

As the Covid-19 pandemic rages on in Thailand with growing numbers of infections and deaths, more and more medical experts are pushing for the government to intervene to stop Siam Bioscience from exporting AstraZeneca vaccines as the country experiences a shortage of vaccines to fight Covid-19 domestically. But legal experts are warning that this is a bad idea. A member of the Council of State took to his Facebook page to explain that stopping AstraZeneca vaccine exports would come with significant backlash in the court of law as well as the court of public opinion. The council member, Borwornsak Uwanno, […]

The post Medics want ban on vaccine exports, legal experts warn against it appeared first on Thaiger News.

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[AdvocatusDiaboli]

So let’s just let medics have all the Sinovac and everyone else have the Pfizer. As soon as Thailand bans exports, what happens to all the good vaccines being donated to Thailand by countries other than Sinovac manufacturers? 

[Paco]

Government ignores everybody in Thailand they just do what they want like a chicken without talking head... it is a circus

Edited August 14, 2021 by Paco

[Graham]

Government incompetence in the highest.

TIT.

[King Cotton]

25 minutes ago, Paco said:

Government ignores everybody in Thailand they just do what they want like a chicken without talking head... it is a circus

A circus? Couldn't agree more, along with about 30 million others . . . or more maybe.

[Nicharnan]

It didn’t stop the uk stopping exports , take care of your own first. 
so all the countries who so kindly donate to help this country , Thailand use them and then make their own to sell.
World class idea !!

ps if they are sold to farang don’t forget to charge double 

Edited August 14, 2021 by Nicharnan

[Jannot]

Its a catch22. The obvious solution would be to increase production and purchase more vaccine from outside Thailand.. Costs money but Thailand is not poor,, only the people are.. 

[Jason]

There are a few realities to come to terms with. And there's nothing like a pandemic to give you the time to come to terms with reality. Although it seems there's a minority (a very vocal minority) who want to take the stage and spruke their conspiracy theories, the reality is that the Delta variant is spreading fast and is leading to the deaths of people of all ages.   

There is no shame in Thailand giving vaccines to their own people before helping other countries. Thailand never envisaged that the country would be in such dire circumstances. At that time, the thought of helping other countries, when case numbers were so slow, was the right thing to do. But now, with cases topping 20,000 plus per day, the emergency is now in Thailand.

So the wise course of action is to vaccinate Thailand and then to send vaccines to other neighbouring countries, once the emergency is over in Thailand. No other country would think badly of Thailand for that. 

 

[Jason]

PS...The cynicism of comments I see, is just "hot air". No substance...no solutions....just "hot air". And I think the ordinary people of the world are sick to death of hot air... 

[palooka]

EU didn't have a problem stopping exports, suggest they export the Chinese ones and keep the local made AZ.

[Jackson]

India is also producing the AstraZeneca vaccine locally. They breached their contracts by suspending exports in the spring of 2021 when their cases of COVID-19 were rising out of control. They have improved the situation of rising cases, but they still haven't resumed exports yet. So there is a precedent for doing this. I wonder how much blowback they're getting breaching their contracts. Does anybody know?

[MrStretch]

If Thailand allows Siam Bioscience to abrogate its contractual obligations to provide AZ vaccines to other countries, it puts Thailand outside of international law and will open the door to so many kinds of reprisal from those nations who are denied their promised vaccines.

The Philippines, Tawain and Malaysia, at least have contractual agreements with BS that aren't being met.  Hell, Thailand had to import vaccines made in South Korea to begin its vaccine rollout in June.

Failure by the company to provide the agreed-to vaccines will be a black eye on Thailand's international face.

The government made two errors that are proving fatal to the Thai population.  The first was not being foresighted enough to procure vaccines in time, but additionally to put all of their eggs in the basket of a company that had never produced a vaccine before this.

Contemplating the stoppage of vaccine exportation is just another indication of how badly they have handled the entire situation.

It underlines the incompetence of those "in charge".

Edited August 14, 2021 by MrStretch

[King Cotton]

50 minutes ago, Nicharnan said:

It didn’t stop the uk stopping exports , take care of your own first. 
so all the countries who so kindly donate to help this country , Thailand use them and then make their own to sell.
World class idea !!

ps if they are sold to farang don’t forget to charge double 

Fair points, for sure and apols for missing your debut post, earlier . . . secretary on her tea-break, probably.

Hello, Nicharnan and welcome to Thaiger Talk

Please feel free to tell us a bit about yourself in 'Introductions'. It's good to pick-up on those sometimes differing regional or geographical perspectives.

And check-out the Guidelines, too, when you get a free minute. They're there to help us all enjoy our time here.

Happy posting

King Cotton

[Mike]

Most contracts have a Force Majeure clause that could be invoked to distribute vaccines locally in Thailand before exporting.  This will depend on the language of the contracts.  If the attorneys for Siam Bioscience did their job competently, that clause would have been written broadly enough to allow for this situation.

[Bart]

1 hour ago, palooka said:

EU didn't have a problem stopping exports, suggest they export the Chinese ones and keep the local made AZ.

In the end the EU didn't stop exports, also because the UK threatened blocking exports of supplies for Astra production.

I believe the EU had a much stronger reason to block exports than Thailand has. If I remember correctly, Astra prioritized exports to the UK over their obligations to the EU. After a while production caught up, though deliveries were quite haphazard.

Thailand on the other hand simply didn't order enough, and negotiated an insufficient delivery rhythm.

Edited August 14, 2021 by Bart
typo

[Alavan]

4 hours ago, palooka said:

EU didn't have a problem stopping exports, suggest they export the Chinese ones and keep the local made AZ.

EU didn't stop exports, certainly not from Pfizer to UK, US Irael and other countries.
The only thing they stopped was export from AZ to the UK as AZ didn't honour the contract they had with the EU.
Since then, the EU didn't agree on new contracts with AZ and orders from the other companies.

[claudiah]

Emergency.  Public health crisis.  Those words will permit the Thai government to circumvent "international criticism" so worried about by the legal experts.  I don't know who will clean that man's windows & mop his floors when all the maids have died.  He, personally, should be more concerned with what is happening to Thailand.

[Soidog]

8 hours ago, Nicharnan said:

It didn’t stop the uk stopping exports , take care of your own first. 

I don’t believe it’s true the U.K. stopped vaccine exports. The U.K. has exported vaccines to Australia. It has also exported materials required for Pfizer vaccine production in the EU. In addition is Jaa donated over £500m to Covax. If there is a contractual requirement to export a vaccine manufactured in the U.K. then it will meet that contractual obligation 

[Soidog]

7 hours ago, Mike said:

Most contracts have a Force Majeure clause that could be invoked to distribute vaccines locally in Thailand before exporting.

@Mike I think you’ll agree with the following definition of contracts which contain force majeure:

included in contracts to remove liability for natural and unavoidable catastrophes that interrupt the expected course of events and prevent participants from fulfilling obligations

It’s certainly not unavoidable and it’s not unexpected events which would stop it fulfilling its obligations. 
 

If Thailand was to block contractual exports it would totally destroy any possibility of it growing a pharma industry 

[HiuMak]

Now i understand why the activists are increasing their protest for change. Too little done, too late, poor planning up there. 

[Anhlam78]

I agree with both your statements, a contract is a contract in binding to deliver. Having said that, all legal contracts have a clause statement that if any of the following condition occur or can occur, the contract holder has the right to delay or cancel.. ie- FM.! Now, the Thai legal experts say that ramifications are abound if Thailand stops the exports and looks after it people first! Bullocks! What's in store is the Legal Eagles would loose faith to enforce the law, the government generals would loose their income from vaccine exports and the country would finally survive. 

Its a money thing and not a moral concern. 

Let the people rule and get rid of the HI-So Society. 

[gummy]

14 minutes ago, Anhlam78 said:

I agree with both your statements, a contract is a contract in binding to deliver. Having said that, all legal contracts have a clause statement that if any of the following condition occur or can occur, the contract holder has the right to delay or cancel.. ie- FM.! Now, the Thai legal experts say that ramifications are abound if Thailand stops the exports and looks after it people first! Bullocks! What's in store is the Legal Eagles would loose faith to enforce the law, the government generals would loose their income from vaccine exports and the country would finally survive. 

Its a money thing and not a moral concern. 

Let the people rule and get rid of the HI-So Society. 

And others who allow it 

[Grumpyoldman]

I wonder what the owner of Siam Bioscience would think if contractual obligations were not met?

 

The company was given the production rights on the basis of export contracts and domestic supply contracts with AZ. It was given in good faith with the highest connections. Breaking those contracts would not serve the reputation of the country well and for all the panic displayed here, this covid is not a widespread killer like some sort of zombie movie.

 

Get a grip people and recognise the statistical realities and also the other medical options available but ignored.

[Mike]

@Soidog your definition of “Force Majeure” is generally correct…  However, we need to keep in mind that the language of the Force Majeure clause dictates 1) when and under what circumstances the clause may apply, 2) what constitutes an inability to perform under the contract, and 3) anything else the drafter is creative enough to include.

Siam Bioscience clearly could have provided for this (the need under a national emergency for domestic distribution) had they had the forethought to do so… and in doing so, would have allowed for domestic distribution of the vaccine without breaking their contractual obligation.

[Soidog]

3 hours ago, Mike said:

@Soidog your definition of “Force Majeure” is generally correct…  However, we need to keep in mind that the language of the Force Majeure clause dictates 1) when and under what circumstances the clause may apply, 2) what constitutes an inability to perform under the contract, and 3) anything else the drafter is creative enough to include.

Siam Bioscience clearly could have provided for this (the need under a national emergency for domestic distribution) had they had the forethought to do so… and in doing so, would have allowed for domestic distribution of the vaccine without breaking their contractual obligation.

I agree with what you are saying in principle @Mike. But would you have accepted a clause like that if you were buying vaccines from them? It’s like signing a contract to buy umbrellas from an Indian supplier in the monsoon season who stipulates they will not export if there is heavy rain in India !! 
Clearly Thailand was going to have a need for vaccines just like every other country in the world. I know I wouldn’t be accepting such terms. It would be negligent and odd that any country would accept terms like that.