BREAKING: Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha has signed a new order revoking his ban on fake news and fearmongering

[palooka]

He had to back down as he was in trouble with this law himself. "Be all over 2-3 weeks 4 at most" this was in clear breach of that law.

[HappyExpat]

3 hours ago, Poolie said:

Frank Sinatra couldn't sing.

And Neil Pert couldn't play the drums.

[AussieBob]

17 hours ago, HolyCowCm said:

Yes I see a lot of it all around. Are you referring to moles with hair protruding out? Hahahaha. You mean a Chinese look in appearance? Maybe a type of jade style ring that some of them also wear? In any case for most are easy to tell where their family tree is lined up to. Big P I am not sure of though, but Toad Boy absolutely.

Yes - the hairy moles is a dead give away   Big P is, Toad Boy definitely, and the majority of Thai billionaires are too. The Monarchy are not. 

[Soidog]

19 hours ago, HolyCowCm said:

So, I do take an interest in this, not only because of my living here and married and have invested a boat load of money, but it is mainly because I have 3 kids here and it is their future I worry about as I would hate to see them sucked under by that of like a com m i e or dic - tator-ship re - gime. 

I hope you don’t mind me saying this, but if I had 3 kids in Thailand, I would be doing all I could to get them out and in a better country for their long term future. Not a great option if you like living in Thailand, but I’d certainly be making solid plans to move out with my family at very short notice. The Chinese are experts and if advising the Thai government, they will surely become far more hardline. 

[AussieBob]

17 hours ago, Poolie said:

Frank Sinatra couldn't sing.

Wow - that is news to me.   But I am sure you are fully qualified expert to say such a thing.  Or maybe you just didnt like his signing and therefore, like all things that you dont like, they are bad and no good - and everyone else who does like them is an idiot ??

Francis Albert Sinatra; December 12, 1915 – May 14, 1998) was an American singer and actor who is generally perceived as one of the greatest musical artists of the 20th century. He is one of the best-selling music artists of all time, having sold an estimated 150 million records worldwide. 

Frank Sinatra - Wikipedia

 

[AussieBob]

9 minutes ago, Soidog said:

I hope you don’t mind me saying this, but if I had 3 kids in Thailand, I would be doing all I could to get them out and in a better country for their long term future. Not a great option if you like living in Thailand, but I’d certainly be making solid plans to move out with my family at very short notice. The Chinese are experts and if advising the Thai government, they will surely become far more hardline. 

I would too - at least for their education.  I would not close off Thailand in any way shape or form, that is their country and their people. But I would look to give them a broader and better education than available in Thailand. 

[Soidog]

7 minutes ago, AussieBob said:

I would too - at least for their education.  I would not close off Thailand in any way shape or form, that is their country and their people. But I would look to give them a broader and better education than available in Thailand. 

Agreed. I think the option of closing off Thailand is very much dependant on how the country moves forward. It would be extremely sad if children born in Thailand feel unable to return. However, if that’s the case then it’s probably better to keep away. At least moving them out provides them with safe options. If Thailand chooses a different path, then hopefully they can return to work and live in Thailand again. 
All of this makes me consider my own longer term plans. I don’t think I would ever totally sell up and burn my bridges with my home country.  However, I was planning to spend the vast majority of my time living in Thailand in the coming years. I may have that option taken away from me? 

[AussieBob]

1 minute ago, Soidog said:

Agreed. I think the option of closing off Thailand is very much dependant on how the country moves forward. It would be extremely sad if children born in Thailand feel unable to return. However, if that’s the case then it’s probably better to keep away. At least moving them out provides them with safe options. If Thailand chooses a different path, then hopefully they can return to work and live in Thailand again. 
All of this makes me consider my own longer term plans. I don’t think I would ever totally sell up and burn my bridges with my home country.  However, I was planning to spend the vast majority of my time living in Thailand in the coming years. I may have that option taken away from me? 

We are in the same boat.  While waiting here and planning to move back to Thailand, I am seriously considering if it is worth the trouble. Lots of things will be taken into account, number one being the 'rules' around Expats and immigration. When I first went to Thailand in 2012 the rules were great and easy to deal with (except that effin 90 day reporting).  Then the Junta arrived and it all went downhill - more and more rules enforced, and harsh new ones introduced - it was like being under attack - we left earl;ier than originally planned.  If the immigration rules are even worse in a few years time, then we will probably not return - other than for annual holiday visits.  I am not after anything 'special' - just something like what Malaysia, Indonesia, Philippines, Taiwan, Singapore etc offer to long term older married/retired Expats wishing to live in their country.  The 2023 election will go a long way to making that decision for us - and what happens afterwards.

[Soidog]

34 minutes ago, AussieBob said:

We are in the same boat.  While waiting here and planning to move back to Thailand, I am seriously considering if it is worth the trouble. Lots of things will be taken into account, number one being the 'rules' around Expats and immigration. When I first went to Thailand in 2012 the rules were great and easy to deal with (except that effin 90 day reporting).  Then the Junta arrived and it all went downhill - more and more rules enforced, and harsh new ones introduced - it was like being under attack - we left earl;ier than originally planned.  If the immigration rules are even worse in a few years time, then we will probably not return - other than for annual holiday visits.  I am not after anything 'special' - just something like what Malaysia, Indonesia, Philippines, Taiwan, Singapore etc offer to long term older married/retired Expats wishing to live in their country.  The 2023 election will go a long way to making that decision for us - and what happens afterwards.

That’s exactly how I feel about it all. I’ve been spending most of the year living in Thailand since around 2006. I haven’t gone down the retirement extension  option; which is now getting harder with only a NonO-A seemingly available which requires health insurance. Currently that’s fine, but it won’t be if I make it past 70 years old. Back in 2006 until around 2012 I use to get an annual Non-O multiple entry tourist visa. It gave me 90 days and a quick trip in to Cambodia or Laos or even a quick holiday to Hong Kong or Malaysia and back in got me a further 90 days. That’s all been removed and getting harder all the time. It’s clear to me that they wish for 14-30 day tourists to spend 10,000 baht a day and then go home. I’m considering Malaysia as an alternative. Like you I don’t want much. Just somewhere relatively easy to get in to. Reasonably safe when you travel and weather far better than you get in Northern Europe in the winter months! 

[AussieBob]

7 minutes ago, Soidog said:

That’s exactly how I feel about it all. I’ve been spending most of the year living in Thailand since around 2006. I haven’t gone down the retirement extension  option; which is now getting harder with only a NonO-A seemingly available which requires health insurance. Currently that’s fine, but it won’t be if I make it past 70 years old. Back in 2006 until around 2012 I use to get an annual Non-O multiple entry tourist visa. It gave me 90 days and a quick trip in to Cambodia or Laos or even a quick holiday to Hong Kong or Malaysia and back in got me a further 90 days. That’s all been removed and getting harder all the time. It’s clear to me that they wish for 14-30 day tourists to spend 10,000 baht a day and then go home. I’m considering Malaysia as an alternative. Like you I don’t want much. Just somewhere relatively easy to get in to. Reasonably safe when you travel and weather far better than you get in Northern Europe in the winter months! 

If you can go elsewhere, then Malaysia has the best Expat package, and in terms of overall services and issues, it is in front of Thailand. If I had my time all over again, knowing what I know now, I would have chosen Malaysia to retire, or Singapore if I had the money, or Philippines if I just wanted it to be easy and cheap. Thailand would have been the 4th choice - but who was to know what would happen in 2014 and the changes they would make as they take Thailand towards being an 'ally' with China, and reject their USA and European dominated past.  Thailand was like Korea and Japan - a western oriented Asian country. Now there are very few retired/married Expats coming to Thailand from Korea or Japan - there are still lots of them in Thailand (especially Japanese) - but very few new ones coming now since 2015.

[Chaimai]

1 hour ago, AussieBob said:

We are in the same boat.  While waiting here and planning to move back to Thailand, I am seriously considering if it is worth the trouble. Lots of things will be taken into account, number one being the 'rules' around Expats and immigration. When I first went to Thailand in 2012 the rules were great and easy to deal with (except that effin 90 day reporting).  Then the Junta arrived and it all went downhill - more and more rules enforced, and harsh new ones introduced - it was like being under attack - we left earl;ier than originally planned.  If the immigration rules are even worse in a few years time, then we will probably not return - other than for annual holiday visits.  I am not after anything 'special' - just something like what Malaysia, Indonesia, Philippines, Taiwan, Singapore etc offer to long term older married/retired Expats wishing to live in their country.  The 2023 election will go a long way to making that decision for us - and what happens afterwards.

 

 

Like Soidog, I have been around since 2006. Initially on Non-Imm 'O' visas from the UK and then retirement extensions from about 2011. I haven't noticed any additional rules enforced - and 90 day reporting is easier now that it can be done online. Certainly, there will be minor frustrating changes each year but, fundamentally, the long-term stay requirements in Thailand are not difficult. The coup as made no difference... remember, there have been 18 coups ......one more will not see much change.

 

Those coming here now will have to contend with evidencing insurance - but I don't see that as a bad thing.

[Chaimai]

6 minutes ago, yetanother said:

if they extend the insurance requirement to non-O extensions-of-stay, then ,since i am nearing 70, can you please help pay my 200,000 baht yearly health insurance cost at that time ?

 

Nope.

 

Take care of your own affairs like I do.

[AussieBob]

58 minutes ago, Chaimai said:

Like Soidog, I have been around since 2006. Initially on Non-Imm 'O' visas from the UK and then retirement extensions from about 2011. I haven't noticed any additional rules enforced - and 90 day reporting is easier now that it can be done online. Certainly, there will be minor frustrating changes each year but, fundamentally, the long-term stay requirements in Thailand are not difficult. The coup as made no difference... remember, there have been 18 coups ......one more will not see much change.

Those coming here now will have to contend with evidencing insurance - but I don't see that as a bad thing.

I hear you Chaimai, but I disagree.  My Expat Visa comparison was not done as someone that has lived in Thailand for 15 years, and is therefore 'wedded' to the country.  It was written from the view of if I had to choose again from scratch, knowing what I now know, then Thailand would have been rated 4th not 1st.  My main issue on that point being, what 'incentives' is Thailand offering me in terms of a long-term Expat deciding to live in Thailand compared to what other countries are offering - and the answer is very very little, and in fact it is less than in 2012.  You are there and already decided/wedded, and that is all good, but for someone who is deciding 'where' then Thailand for me is 4th now (but Taiwan might also be better). That is why there has been so few new retired/married Expats, especially Korea and Japan but also other countries, coming to Thailand since 2015 - in fact the numbers are the other way - they are leaving.

Having said that, I am pleased you are happy to stay and you accept all the immigration/visa impositions. But it makes me think negatively when I am contemplating whether or not we return, to be treated as a long term tourist, and with all those impositions and costs, when other nearby countries are offering so much better Expat packages. I recall when the Junta required all Expats to report where they were staying when they were away from their normal residence for 24 hours (remember that?), and there was an uproar and they 'relented' - but they never repealed the law and they never apologised.  Plus all those extra documents that had to be completed by landlords, and all that private personal information they started demanding when applying to extend, and the visits to people's houses to 'prove' they were married, and many others that I cant recall.  A long term blogger (Richard Barrow) was threatened with deportation about 2 years ago because he didnt have all the (new) paperwork done correctly.  A mate of mine had to leave the country (twice) because he was a few baht short of the mandated monthly bank total due to the bank taking out a fee. Plus all the costs to apply every year - with all the annual changes in the rules - and all the different interpretations in each Province. Etc Etc Etc. 

Those things and many others are in stark contrast to what other SEAsian countries (not China) are offering to attract retirement/married Expats from western countries to come and live long term in their country.  And make no mistake about it, the Thai Govt and Businesses realise (now) that they need Expats (billions of baht has left the country).  So what do they propose to offer?  Absolute rubbish like the Visa Elite program that is very expensive - they cost more than to move as an Expat to live in Singapore, but they give none of the incentives and advantages.  IMO they are ideal for wealthy rich (Chinese?) business and family members to come and go - but not Expats like us.

The Junta does not want western Expats in Thailand long term. They have made that very very clear. I am happy for you and all the other guys who are willing to put up with it all and choose to stay.  I may end up moving back there anyway, because I do love the place and the people and my wife is Thai, but I am not happy about it.  When I did a cost benefits analysis of the new imposed mandatory health insurance (scam), the wife made it quite plain that we are not going to live long term in Thailand and pay upwards of 3-4 million baht in insurance premiums, that will probably not pay up when really needed.  She would rather use that money to help buy a house here in Australia, where the medical system is far far better and it is mostly free.   

[AussieBob]

1 hour ago, yetanother said:

if they extend the insurance requirement to non-O extensions-of-stay, then ,since i am nearing 70, can you please help pay my 200,000 baht yearly health insurance cost at that time ?

Mate - I calculated that when I am 70+ the annual premiums would be 300K upwards for the mandatory coverage. The problems is they demand coverage includes what we call here 'extras' being non-hospital costs.  If the coverage required was for hospital treatmnent after a car accident or serious illness/operation, then that would be OK. But older people have a lot of 'extra' medical costs, and that makes the premiums far more costly as one gets older.  Will the Thai Junta Govt ever recognise this and relent and change their requirements? Unlikely.   Anutin Charnvirakul has said in public exactly what the Junta Govt thinks about western Expats - he has never withdrawn it and he has never been criticised or corrected for saying it.    

[HolyCowCm]

4 hours ago, AussieBob said:

Yes - the hairy moles is a dead give away   Big P is, Toad Boy definitely, and the majority of Thai billionaires are too. The Monarchy are not. 

Big P is actually small P  Toad Boy on the books, but they just like to reverse the role model game. If you picture Mao's face and then look at some then that is also a dead give away. The other one is an off color, not white and not brown and the faces will sometimes have a lot of small pigment blotches on them.

For the record, most of the wealth off to rich Thai business owners I know having ancestry reaching back to that area are fully anti the CCP and are not in the least fans of the you know who in every level here. But hey do have their little Chinese things they do every year such as the little red envelopes and such as what the normal chi9ense folk do. But  then again Thais love everyone's holidays and will celebrate all of them. That's the fun loving part of them. 

[HolyCowCm]

4 hours ago, Soidog said:

I hope you don’t mind me saying this, but if I had 3 kids in Thailand, I would be doing all I could to get them out and in a better country for their long term future. Not a great option if you like living in Thailand, but I’d certainly be making solid plans to move out with my family at very short notice. The Chinese are experts and if advising the Thai government, they will surely become far more hardline. 

They have been to the States and really at this time have no desire to live there. Wife has a 10 year visa for there and the kids US passport. Bulk of all money of mine is in US banks and if need being we could uproot very fast with dogs in tow. For their future here, that is if nothing happens, they will be just fine as am setting them up to have a business. I have a semi large network of Thai business owners and outlets and for in the USA as well many contacts who are friends. My 2 youngest are currently studying business, and one speaks Chinese. 

Yeah, the Chinese and these ruling bozos are almost on the negative number side of the scale now, and for the bozos here is looking like that level of just putting up with them is about to snap.

[Chaimai]

2 hours ago, AussieBob said:

I hear you Chaimai, but I disagree.  My Expat Visa comparison was not done as someone that has lived in Thailand for 15 years, and is therefore 'wedded' to the country.  It was written from the view of if I had to choose again from scratch, knowing what I now know, then Thailand would have been rated 4th not 1st.  My main issue on that point being, what 'incentives' is Thailand offering me in terms of a long-term Expat deciding to live in Thailand compared to what other countries are offering - and the answer is very very little, and in fact it is less than in 2012.  You are there and already decided/wedded, and that is all good, but for someone who is deciding 'where' then Thailand for me is 4th now (but Taiwan might also be better). That is why there has been so few new retired/married Expats, especially Korea and Japan but also other countries, coming to Thailand since 2015 - in fact the numbers are the other way - they are leaving.

Having said that, I am pleased you are happy to stay and you accept all the immigration/visa impositions. But it makes me think negatively when I am contemplating whether or not we return, to be treated as a long term tourist, and with all those impositions and costs, when other nearby countries are offering so much better Expat packages. I recall when the Junta required all Expats to report where they were staying when they were away from their normal residence for 24 hours (remember that?), and there was an uproar and they 'relented' - but they never repealed the law and they never apologised.  Plus all those extra documents that had to be completed by landlords, and all that private personal information they started demanding when applying to extend, and the visits to people's houses to 'prove' they were married, and many others that I cant recall.  A long term blogger (Richard Barrow) was threatened with deportation about 2 years ago because he didnt have all the (new) paperwork done correctly.  A mate of mine had to leave the country (twice) because he was a few baht short of the mandated monthly bank total due to the bank taking out a fee. Plus all the costs to apply every year - with all the annual changes in the rules - and all the different interpretations in each Province. Etc Etc Etc. 

Those things and many others are in stark contrast to what other SEAsian countries (not China) are offering to attract retirement/married Expats from western countries to come and live long term in their country.  And make no mistake about it, the Thai Govt and Businesses realise (now) that they need Expats (billions of baht has left the country).  So what do they propose to offer?  Absolute rubbish like the Visa Elite program that is very expensive - they cost more than to move as an Expat to live in Singapore, but they give none of the incentives and advantages.  IMO they are ideal for wealthy rich (Chinese?) business and family members to come and go - but not Expats like us.

The Junta does not want western Expats in Thailand long term. They have made that very very clear. I am happy for you and all the other guys who are willing to put up with it all and choose to stay.  I may end up moving back there anyway, because I do love the place and the people and my wife is Thai, but I am not happy about it.  When I did a cost benefits analysis of the new imposed mandatory health insurance (scam), the wife made it quite plain that we are not going to live long term in Thailand and pay upwards of 3-4 million baht in insurance premiums, that will probably not pay up when really needed.  She would rather use that money to help buy a house here in Australia, where the medical system is far far better and it is mostly free.   

 

 

I hear what you say Bob but all the cases you mention should not affect you (or anyone else) IF they stick by the rules.

 

Richard Barrow (who I do admire and follow) made a meal out of his situation and the friends you mentioned fell short of long-established Immigration criteria. They are not here to cut us any slack, it is up to us to abide by the rules - yes, I fully accept that those rules can be interpreted, juggled, ignored and the whim of an IO. For those who do not meet the criteria there are plenty of avenues where less than 300 Quid will buy you a 12 month stay. I don't consider it unreasonable for the Thai authorities to expect us to look after ourselves - including health insurance as appropriate. Even there you can bypass the system....enter on SETV and pay to convert to a retirement extension. 

[Soidog]

4 hours ago, HolyCowCm said:

They have been to the States and really at this time have no desire to live there. Wife has a 10 year visa for there and the kids US passport. Bulk of all money of mine is in US banks and if need being we could uproot very fast with dogs in tow. For their future here, that is if nothing happens, they will be just fine as am setting them up to have a business. I have a semi large network of Thai business owners and outlets and for in the USA as well many contacts who are friends. My 2 youngest are currently studying business, and one speaks Chinese. 

Yeah, the Chinese and these ruling bozos are almost on the negative number side of the scale now, and for the bozos here is looking like that level of just putting up with them is about to snap.

Sounds like you are well Prepared for whatever comes your way

[AussieBob]

4 hours ago, Chaimai said:

I hear what you say Bob but all the cases you mention should not affect you (or anyone else) IF they stick by the rules.

Richard Barrow (who I do admire and follow) made a meal out of his situation and the friends you mentioned fell short of long-established Immigration criteria. They are not here to cut us any slack, it is up to us to abide by the rules - yes, I fully accept that those rules can be interpreted, juggled, ignored and the whim of an IO. For those who do not meet the criteria there are plenty of avenues where less than 300 Quid will buy you a 12 month stay. I don't consider it unreasonable for the Thai authorities to expect us to look after ourselves - including health insurance as appropriate. Even there you can bypass the system....enter on SETV and pay to convert to a retirement extension. 

I dont understand Chaimai - are you saying that you think it is OK to have to report whenever you spend 24+ hours away from your nominated address? You are OK with reporting every 90 days (it is 90 days because that is when a toruist Visa expries). You do realise that all those other countries I mentioned offer Expat Visa without that and all the other impositions Thailand has - and they offer so much more in incentives.  I know you are happy to accept those things, but surely you dont agree with them. 

[Soidog]

3 hours ago, Chaimai said:

I hear what you say Bob but all the cases you mention should not affect you (or anyone else) IF they stick by the rules.

Richard Barrow (who I do admire and follow) made a meal out of his situation and the friends you mentioned fell short of long-established Immigration criteria. They are not here to cut us any slack, it is up to us to abide by the rules - yes, I fully accept that those rules can be interpreted, juggled, ignored and the whim of an IO. For those who do not meet the criteria there are plenty of avenues where less than 300 Quid will buy you a 12 month stay. I don't consider it unreasonable for the Thai authorities to expect us to look after ourselves - including health insurance as appropriate. Even there you can bypass the system....enter on SETV and pay to convert to a retirement extension. 

I certainly agree with the idea that we should be in a position to look after ourselves while we are in Thailand. People who haven’t paid taxes shouldn’t  be able to get benefits for free (although funny how if you’re a Thai living in most Western countries you would)! I also pay at least 7% VAT on all I buy and have ploughed millions of baht in to the local economy. However, putting that aside, there few things I’d like to chip in with:

The first is that changes to rules are applied retrospective. So tomorrow, they could decide, at a whim and no explanation or rationale given, that you need 2 million or 5 million baht in a Thai bank, or proof of 100,000 or 200,000 baht a month income to extend your visa on the basis of retirement. Straight away you send hundreds, possibly thousands of people, many who are elderly and been living in Thailand for 20 years or more, in to total chaos and panic. It’s one thing to change the law and apply for new applicants (if you don’t like it don’t come), but it’s totally unreasonable and cruel to apply it retrospectively and to people who have fixed incomes.

Currently the need to have health insurance for people extending their visa on the basis of retirement only applies to people with Non-OA. Again, overnight, that law could change and apply it to people holding Non-O. Thousands of people who have been living in Thailand for years would then have to either pay annual health insurance costing $2,000-$5,000; assuming they can even get it if they are 75+? What do these people do if they can’t afford it? Many have been living in Thailand for 20-30 years. Kicking these people out without thought of what it will do to these unfortunate people is totally heartless. If they really cared they would apply the changes to new applicants and offer affordable health insurance using government hospitals for those who can’t afford anything else. Perhaps 20,000 baht a year. 

Finally I would pick out the point AussieBob made about the reporting of movement fiasco. You need look no further than that to see what kind of feelings and sentiment towards expats exists at the highest levels. You can’t pass laws like that without it going through significant steps and opportunities to get it stopped. This surely shows how negative the feelings are and hence only likely to go in one direction. That was clearly testing the envelope of resistance and it was good resistance was shown. Next time they may not listen?…

[AussieBob]

16 minutes ago, Soidog said:

I certainly agree with the idea that we should be in a position to look after ourselves while we are in Thailand. People who haven’t paid taxes shouldn’t  be able to get benefits for free (although funny how if you’re a Thai living in most Western countries you would)! I also pay at least 7% VAT on all I buy and have ploughed millions of baht in to the local economy. However, putting that aside, there few things I’d like to chip in with:

The first is that changes to rules are applied retrospective. So tomorrow, they could decide, at a whim and no explanation or rationale given, that you need 2 million or 5 million baht in a Thai bank, or proof of 100,000 or 200,000 baht a month income to extend your visa on the basis of retirement. Straight away you send hundreds, possibly thousands of people, many who are elderly and been living in Thailand for 20 years or more, in to total chaos and panic. It’s one thing to change the law and apply for new applicants (if you don’t like it don’t come), but it’s totally unreasonable and cruel to apply it retrospectively and to people who have fixed incomes.

Currently the need to have health insurance for people extending their visa on the basis of retirement only applies to people with Non-OA. Again, overnight, that law could change and apply it to people holding Non-O. Thousands of people who have been living in Thailand for years would then have to either pay annual health insurance costing $2,000-$5,000; assuming they can even get it if they are 75+? What do these people do if they can’t afford it? Many have been living in Thailand for 20-30 years. Kicking these people out without thought of what it will do to these unfortunate people is totally heartless. If they really cared they would apply the changes to new applicants and offer affordable health insurance using government hospitals for those who can’t afford anything else. Perhaps 20,000 baht a year. 

Finally I would pick out the point AussieBob made about the reporting of movement fiasco. You need look no further than that to see what kind of feelings and sentiment towards expats exists at the highest levels. You can’t pass laws like that without it going through significant steps and opportunities to get it stopped. This surely shows how negative the feelings are and hence only likely to go in one direction. That was clearly testing the envelope of resistance and it was good resistance was shown. Next time they may not listen?…

Absolutely correct Soidog - on verey single point.  But I would add something to your first point.  The vast majority of Thais do not pay income tax - the only taxes they pay are the VAT tax.  Most Expats who stay for 5+ years pay huge amounts of VAT taxes over the period they live in Thailand - far more than most Thais pay in a lifetime. 

 

[AussieBob]

7 minutes ago, yetanother said:

my wife is a thai life ins agent; she inquired , on my behalf, for age 70,75 for me;

even tho i have been with them for  the last 12 years, the quotes at 70 were 200,000/year and at 75, 350,000/year;

at those prices the other surrounding countries start looking more attractive ;

then just playing footsie with tourist visas and the like to maybe get back here for 6 months/yr to benefit from the assets we have developed here over the years;

that was all pre-pandemic thinking;

so to sum: forced out to live here half-time by a cruel immigration requirement which should contain "asset exemptions" (proof of 3 mill in bank for example)

I got about the same numbers when I did my analysis - 350K upwards per year for 400K total coverage when I hit 75.  The Thai wife decided it was a scam before I did - she pointed out that it was not for Thai Hospitals, it was for Private Hospitals.  If they enforce that rule for O (Marriage) then we aint moving back to Thailand. Even if we do for a few years, we will not be buying a property - because of the health insurance scam and all the other potential rules and impositions they can make up.  Those other countries guarantee the conditions of their Expat Visas (except Philippines) will not change for 5 or 10 years. Automatic renewals, no reporting, no annual payments, no big brother rules, and so much more.

Now before anyone starts to whinge at me for being forced to take out health insurance - it is NOT about that - it is the fact that the coverage they demand is extremely costly (and highly profitable to them).  Those other countries all require insurance (except Philippines), but only for accident and emergency in a hospital - additional 'extras' type insurance coverage is optional.

[Soidog]

8 minutes ago, AussieBob said:

Absolutely correct Soidog - on verey single point.  But I would add something to your first point.  The vast majority of Thais do not pay income tax - the only taxes they pay are the VAT tax.  Most Expats who stay for 5+ years pay huge amounts of VAT taxes over the period they live in Thailand - far more than most Thais pay in a lifetime. 

Yes a good point Bob and something I’d not considered. It’s a xenophobic attitude that’s drives the policy. It also promotes the “Them and us” culture which works for populist governments. Dual pricing is for the same reasons.
 

My lose comment about Thais being treated with greater compassion in most western countries is actually something I’m proud of and pleased we do. We are after all, human. It’s easy to raise passions when you say “why should people get something for free they didn’t contribute to it”. However, when it comes down to it, we are all people and should show greater compassion and respect. 

[AussieBob]

15 minutes ago, Soidog said:

Yes a good point Bob and something I’d not considered. It’s a xenophobic attitude that’s drives the policy. It also promotes the “Them and us” culture which works for populist governments. Dual pricing is for the same reasons.
 

My lose comment about Thais being treated with greater compassion in most western countries is actually something I’m proud of and pleased we do. We are after all, human. It’s easy to raise passions when you say “why should people get something for free they didn’t contribute to it”. However, when it comes down to it, we are all people and should show greater compassion and respect. 

I hear you Soidog and agree 100%.  Thailand is a bit xenophobic overall, but the Junta is pathologically anti-Xenos, especially Expats.  We both mentioned how their Expat rules are just wrong and unfair.  As an example of the Junta's (and Thai Govts in all Provinces) attitude towards 'the rules', today it was announced 104 new cases in Phuket.  Just like the Phuket Sandbox situation whereby they said close if 90 cases in a week - they ignore the rules whenever they want, and they change the rules whenever they want.  

[Poolie]

11 hours ago, AussieBob said:

Wow - that is news to me.   But I am sure you are fully qualified expert to say such a thing.  Or maybe you just didnt like his signing and therefore, like all things that you dont like, they are bad and no good - and everyone else who does like them is an idiot ??

Francis Albert Sinatra; December 12, 1915 – May 14, 1998) was an American singer and actor who is generally perceived as one of the greatest musical artists of the 20th century. He is one of the best-selling music artists of all time, having sold an estimated 150 million records worldwide. 

Frank Sinatra - Wikipedia

Maybe he sounds better in Australia. I don't need to be an expert to decide who is in tune.

Wikipedia.