Sandbox tourist forced to stay in ASQ hotel after fellow passenger on her flight tests positive

[Stonker]

6 hours ago, JohninDubin said:

nother point is that PCR tests have reported average fail rates of 15%

If you mean the  reports by the Irish health service, that was over a year ago - well out of date.

 

 

Edited July 10, 2021 by Stonker
typo

[JohninDublin]

17 minutes ago, Stardust said:

Thats interesting and a good advice. Is this only for CC holders in Europe or worldwide?

Please see my clarification to Toby.

 

19 minutes ago, Stardust said:

Thats interesting and a good advice. Is this only for CC holders in Europe or worldwide?

I couldn't tell you about the rest of the world, but it definitely applies in the EU as long as you pay by CC. If you pay by debit card, you can ask your bank for a chargeback. But if they refuse or don't obtain a refund, you have no legal rights against your bank. 

The reason why the cards are treated differrently, is that banks charge a modest fee of say 40 cents to the vendor to process the payment. but with a CC, they charge a percentage (usually about 2%). The EU regards this as a commission and as such, view credit card transactions as a partnership between the vendor and the CC company, thus making both parties liable for any failings. So if you can't reasonably be expected to sue in the Thai courts, you can sue your local CC instead.

BTW, you are also fully covered in the event that a vendor goes bankrupt before you get your goods.

This might help if you are in the EU: https://ec.europa.eu/info/sites/default/files/chargeback_report_revised.pdf

[Tanuki]

So I'm waiting for all the grovelling PR folk on the island to make a humble apology to the lady this coming week.. Her photo will be in the news with her holding a bouquet of flowers given to her by some high-ranking member of the TaT... One of the high-end hotels will be seen offering her a suite for the next 2 weeks free of charge including meals.. The taxi-mafia will promise to take her anywhere in Pukkers without ripping her off... (OK that last one was a bit extreme 555)  I think you've all seen the picture I'm painting here.

[Stonker]

1 hour ago, Das said:

Absolute balls that the only ALQ available to her was one hotel at ₿3400 a night 

It seems a bit unlikely - a number of sites show 27 ALQ hotels in Phuket with 14 day ALQ packages priced between 44,900 and 346,000 baht.

[JohninDublin]

13 minutes ago, Stonker said:

If you mean the  reports by the Irish health service, that was over a year ago - well out of date.

I don't know how accurate that figure may be, but this was from six moths ago and is citing 17%: https://virologyj.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12985-021-01489-0 which suggests 17%.

In fairness to you, the Irish report came in with analysis of multiple reports of others researches and quotes between "2% and 29%". The 15% figure I quote is the average of the two outliers.

I think a good case can be made that there are multiple variables in this including the competence of the tester, the skill of the analyst, the quality of the reagents and the calibration of the test machinery. Give that, it would not surprise if there are still labs out there still with high error rates. But with all the conflicting studies, and not to undercut your reply to my post, I wonder if we will even now the true rate?

[Stardust]

1 hour ago, Stonker said:

Reported. 

This is an outright lie as I have never said or suggested in any way that this was "covered and nobody have to pay for it".

The only comments I've ever made about these issues / incidents, once they were reported, was that they weren't covered in the regs and that it was unlikely insurance would cover it.

Your comment is an outright and direct lie, @Stardust.

Everybody can read your quotes about that and are still there! 

[Podgey]

I love Thailand. But this makes me book for Miami this fall. This rules Thailand got Will make sandbox fsul. To be fair, Thai goverment did specify that asq hotels could happen if some one close was infected. 

[Stonker]

41 minutes ago, Stardust said:

Everybody can read your quotes about that and are still there! 

I'm not going to argue about it with you here, but I suggest that you make sure you've understood what I wrote correctly and get your links ready, as what you've said is a complete lie.

[PapayaBokBok]

3400 a night..my rent for a MONTH in CNX is 3500 and is a nice studio..

So im still confused. because of ONE positive passenger ALL the others are in ASQ? Cos same plane?

Even if they dont know that positive person? And if they test Negative they are still in ASQ for 14?

Man, just when you thought it couldn't get more ridiculous, just feel like we are being used as ATMs, again..

Had a Thai I was talking to last night say because my usd currency is higher than baht that means I

should travel across the planet and spend it frivolously. I argued I dont work or have income(silence)

[PapayaBokBok]

16 hours ago, TobyAndrews said:

THis is an outrage! These Thai rats have managed to manipulate a person, who does not have the virus, into paying three times what she was paying before for a less quality room.

Why, where is the justification? Why is a less quality room costing three times the price of a much better room. What extras are there? One test a day is all I think. This is just another Phuket Thai scam. The situation changes and the Phuker scammers adapt their scams to suit.

Well this will seriously influence more potential mugs that were thinking of booking this sandbox. Stay away. There is an established calculated rip off in practice in Phuket called the sandbox. Don't be the next victim. Let them fail. Let them starve. They deserve no less.

And THIS is why I was willing to suffer the 7 days but bailed when it went to 14, like shooting fish in a barrel

[Jaizan]

Just for comparison:

1  A farang who might have come into contact with a covid test failure has to check into ASQ for 50,000 THB.

2  What happens when a Thai person might have come into contact with a covid test failure ?     Are they required to go to ASQ for 50,000 thb ?    

3  What happens to an immigrant worker from Myanmar if they come into contact with a covid test failure ?

I'd just like to know before writing to the Bangkok Post.

[PapayaBokBok]

Thought these were SHA+ approved hotels and the staff was safe--why not let her stay in her original room?

Is he positive or simply at "risk" isnt everyone at risk on the planet? this just isnt washing with me..smh

If i were to return id just do the BKK ASQ as it may be on lockdown but Id be in the room anyway and not have to deal with what seems like an obvious scam someone thought up, just as I would expect from the overpriced PCR tests, how would you know if you really were + or -, or if the  tests were even accurate???

[AdvocatusDiaboli]

41 minutes ago, Jaizan said:

What happens when a Thai person might have come into contact with a covid test failure ?  

They quarantine at their home, or a ASQ if a tourist in another province.

 

42 minutes ago, Jaizan said:

What happens to an immigrant worker from Myanmar if they come into contact with a covid test failure ?

They quarantine the whole workers living arrangement, like the Bangkok building sites recently.

[LaughingOutLoud]

Uh, boohoo? 

Who in thier right mind would visit a country that is next to last in Covid handling, with cases and deaths the highest they've ever been??  Zero sympathy, she is just adding to the covid situation making it worse.

The governor of Phuket is as incompetent and corrupt as they come.  

Som Nom Nah Phuket!!

[Alpeace]

I'd love to return to Thailand, but there are bound to be issues like this initially. This lady did what she thought was right,  however no govt officials involved seems a bit fishy. 

Personally it will be at least a year before I return, to give things time to become more organised. 

It's simply not a good time to travel. 

 

[AussieBob]

9 hours ago, Objectivance said:

Oh, no two fkn ways about it. Anyone with a decent amount of rational thought knew that was gonna end poorly. Your prediction is more optimistic than mine. I don't think there will be a regular flow of international tourism until 4Q of 2022 and it will be at 25% of previous peaks. I don't think the cash cow glory days will return before 2030. 

I tend to agree with you - more hope that reason on my part, as to why I think it might come back earlier. 

[bushav8r]

I wish her well and enjoyed her interview on the Thaiger. I hope she can maintain her positive attitude and enjoy her new life in Thailand.  She is brave and adventurous.

[Mopi]

8 hours ago, JamesE said:

There may have been just them on the flight. They haven't been exactly straining to shut the doors on these jam packed Airbuses.

Thaiger Tim interviewed one of the passangers, a lady name Stephanie, worth watching on YouTube. She said the flight was fairly full so one assumes the rest of the passangers flew on to BKK and checked into ASQ hotels

 

[SickBuffalo]

7 hours ago, Das said:

Absolute balls that the only ALQ available to her was one hotel at ₿3400 a night

She was clearly panicking and had no idea what she was doing.

Again, should have stayed in her room, waited for officials to turn up, engaged in a leisurely, detailed discussion about what, exactly, was going to happen, and secretly videoed every damn word.

[SickBuffalo]

3 minutes ago, Mopi said:

Thaiger Tim interviewed one of the passangers, a lady name Stephanie, worth watching on YouTube.

You mean the video that the first post in this thread links to, and that this entire discussion is about? 

[MelBurn]

Who would have thought? Surprise! If you travel at this time - you can expect anything to happen. Like a new lockdown - how is a person supposed to travel in Thailand when rules can change any day. Her situation "meets expectations" in corporate speak.

[TobyAndrews]

11 hours ago, JohninDubin said:

I need to correct myself here. I've just remembered that the €25 is for this: https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/justice/courts_system/european_small_claims_procedure.html 

and applies, if for example you buy faulty goods say from Holland and you live in Ireland. The chances are that the vendor will have no legal footprint in your country so the EU introduced this scheme to reduce cross border scamming. I used it to obtain a refund from Etihad, who had a London office, but only a desk at DUB airport in Ireland. They settled out of court in  full when they saw my claim and the evidence I was putting forward.

Regarding the CC, the legal situation is that they become the vendor and if the goods or services are not delivered say in Thailand, you can apply to them for what is known as a chargeback. They then contact the vendors CC company raising your issue. Sometimes, the vendor will agree your claim and the problem is resolved through this, but be warned, your CC will only apply once. If the vendor lies, they accept their word for it. I'll give you an example of that later.

At that stage you need to write to your CC informing them that you will sue them for recovery, and if after 14 days, you've not received a reply, you then claim in your local small claims court. At this stage, you need to detail your claim fully and provide any evidence you have. The CC company are allowed to respond, and they will now contact the vendors CC who will receive a copy of your statement and will have to provide a response. If they don't you, get a default judgement. if they do, the judge looks through the statements and decides which is the more plausible. Occasionally, the judge will set a hearing date, which is done by videolink, and the language of the court is that of the claimants.

in this particular, it looks like a no brainer, assuming Steffanie paid by CC. If she paid by DC, she has no rights to claim. But the circumstances here are that she paid in full and in advance for the room and was then denied use of the room. BTW, you can only claim for faulty or non-delivery of goods under this scheme, or non-delivery of services such as hotel rooms, flights etc.

My experience of suing my CC provider arose from being obliged to stay overnight at an hotel near LHR when BA had a computer meltdown. I booked the room by phone and a couple of Americans asked if I could book the room for them also, which I did, We got a cab to a hotel along the M4. When we arrived, I was surprised that they didn't have a reservation for us, but there were plenty of rooms. A couple of days the wife phoned wanting to know why there was two charges for hotels (£179 and £537). She had contacted the CC company and asked them to look into it. About a week later, they replied that it was because I had booked 3 rooms and failed to show. She then told them to look at the CC statement and it was obvious that I had shown up.

As I said, the CC will only initially make one attempt to recover. When I got home, I saw that the £537 was for another hotel in the same chain but at Brentford. The call would have been recorded. Contacted the CC and they were not interested. Sent the warning letter, Got no reply. Issued the summons in Dublin Small claims court and about 10 days later, the CC made a refund in full. My issuing the claim led to the CC again contacting the hotel chain, and this time, the hotel listened to the phone recording and agreed that the booking they made for me, was not the hotel I agreed with them in my call. Paid in full without going to court.

Hope this clears matters up.

Thank you John. I am grateful for your long and detailed explanation. It seems the 25 euro remedy is only used between EU countries. Is that right? 

However I have seen a way this lady can enforce a refund from the SHA hotel. If she booked with an agent, I believe she can sue the agent for the refund. Still I am not sure.

I am of the opinion the only way a Thai will refund any money is if they are put under financial pressure.

I once wanted a refund on a motorbike that was hard to start. They were not going to give it. I told them if they don't I will dump the motor bike in the jungle and leave town. I received the refund.

I always advise anyone who wished to visit Thailand never pay up front. Problem with the sandbox was, the visitors did not have that choice.

 

[Stonker]

7 hours ago, Jaizan said:

2  What happens when a Thai person might have come into contact with a covid test failure ?     Are they required to go to ASQ for 50,000 thb ?    

According to the reports here, seven of the hotel staff were also quarantined in the same ASQ hotel as the 12 from the tour group and Stefanie.

Why that would happen I can't understand as I would have expected them to be quarantined in a field hospital for observation, not in a hotel costing the government 364,000 baht to put hotel staff up in a hotel.

7 hours ago, AdvocatusDiaboli said:

They quarantine at their home, or a ASQ if a tourist in another province.

They quarantine the whole workers living arrangement, like the Bangkok building sites recently.

Sorry, that's not correct - see above. 

[Stonker]

23 hours ago, Pompies said:

I can't stop laughing at this brain dead woman.  How did she think coming to the Phuket concentration camp was a sensible idea? And then thinking she would be able to explore more of this disease raddled country after her 14 days were up. She got exactly what she should have expected.

After watching the video I've got to agree with you, @Pompies, but it's all just a bit wierd. 

 

She's a "translator" who "speaks English and Spanish" but apparently not German although she has a German passport, but has a strong accent, possibly Eastern European, but definitely not German. 

 

She "doesn't know" why she came to Thailand, whether it was possibly to learn Thai, go diving, or learn how to ride a motorbike.

 

Nobody except the hotel receptionist has told her to do anything and she had to find the ASQ hotel herself, but seven hotel staff and the family group of 12 all apparently found the same ASQ hotel which they're all staying in.

 

I hope the Thaiger has done its homework, because this all just sounds a bit too wierd.

[AdvocatusDiaboli]

1 hour ago, Stonker said:

8 hours ago, AdvocatusDiaboli said:

They quarantine at their home, or a ASQ if a tourist in another province.

They quarantine the whole workers living arrangement, like the Bangkok building sites recently.

Sorry, that's not correct - see above. 

Well let’s correct that point.

 

Those who cannot prove that they have been vaccinated for COVID-19 and cannot prove they have tested negative for the virus may enter Phuket on the condition that they observe a 14-day quarantine either at home or at a designated hotel under the supervision of communicable disease control officers and the Emergency Operations Centre (EOC) staff for the area where the arrival will be staying.

Those who must observe a 14-day quarantine at home are to self-monitor for any signs of infection 

Any persons arriving in Phuket and not staying the night are exempt from the quarantine requirement, as are all goods transport drivers, medical workers, officials and anyone else permitted to pass  through the checkpoint onto the island during the hours 11pm to 5am.

https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/2137163/rules-for-arrivals-in-phuket

But could also use the biggest example to prove my point, for Home quarantine, for someone in close proximity to a high risk person in Phuket  …… Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha.

Maybe the people to have some pity for are the Phuket locals whisked away to ALQ with bills unknown. No one is speaking up on their behalf. Maybe a Thaiger article needed.