News Forum - One-third of adult Thai citizens applied for welfare

[Thaiger]

Applications for welfare have seen a huge jump, with 22 million Thai people requesting a state welfare card in the latest round of registration. That massive figure equates to about one-third of the entire adult population of Thailand. It is a huge jump from the current 13.5 million people now carrying welfare cards in the country. The figures come after the end of the last registration period in October. Deputy Finance Minister Santi Promphat reported the numbers and said that many applying for welfare are likely the result of the Covid-19 pandemic and the economic hardship that it brought over the […]

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[ChrisS]

Sadly an increase in dependence on welfare in one form or another has risen across the world in the aftermath of Covid but even so a third of the adult population is a huge percentage. 

[Fanta]

And how many of these applicants are legitimate? 

[palooka]

Have seriously been trying to understand the qualification requirements for official welfare over the past year. Seems if you worked for as major employer payments were paid (? taxes, credits?)  into your welfare account and you are unemployed for whatever reason, you can apply for assistance.

If you are a farmer, or work in an industry that doesn't pay into this system, bad luck.

There seems to be some sort of "fall back" system that the poor can lodge a claim for assistance and it is given out to recipients who can present at certain shops and get 150 baht of goods.  The times this is available is varied and haven't managed to get my head around the workings yet.

(Maybe never will, TIT)

[palooka]

2 hours ago, ChrisS said:

Sadly an increase in dependence on welfare in one form or another has risen across the world in the aftermath of Covid but even so a third of the adult population is a huge percentage. 

Exceedingly massive, most western countries go in into financial apoplectic shock if they hit 10%, and their currencies react accordingly, (nosedive) so why is the baht so strong?

[Soidog]

1 hour ago, palooka said:

Exceedingly massive, most western countries go in into financial apoplectic shock if they hit 10%, and their currencies react accordingly, (nosedive) so why is the baht so strong?

Very good question. I think part of the reason is that their bank Governor and other leading financial figures always talk to the positives and play up the outlook. Unlike for example in the U.K., where the Governor of the Bank of England thinks it’s his job to outline and second guess all the doom and gloom. A difference in growth of 0.1% between a forecast for the U.K. and for Germany is reported as the U.K. will have the lowest growth of the G7. A combination of financial key figures and the media talks the country down. In Thailand the media talk most things up. 10 million tourists is reported as a massive 500% rise in tourism year on year, not a 75% reduction in pre-Covid numbers as it would be if reported in the U.K. Much of the financial markets are about sentiment and the Thais are masters at sending out positive news. 

[SkyDogJack]

2 hours ago, palooka said:

Have seriously been trying to understand the qualification requirements for official welfare over the past year. Seems if you worked for as major employer payments were paid (? taxes, credits?)  into your welfare account and you are unemployed for whatever reason, you can apply for assistance.

If you are a farmer, or work in an industry that doesn't pay into this system, bad luck.

There seems to be some sort of "fall back" system that the poor can lodge a claim for assistance and it is given out to recipients who can present at certain shops and get 150 baht of goods.  The times this is available is varied and haven't managed to get my head around the workings yet.

(Maybe never will, TIT)

My Thai wife, for over 25 years working in Thailand has had jobs for the government, contractors and private companies in Thailand.  She is a university graduate and a determined and excellent employee. As she has explained it to me, so many private employers don't report employee income to the government to avoid taxes or under report income, or coerce employees to accept cash, that millions upon millions of Thai's do not pay into Thai Social Security.  Again, as I understand, there are two level of both income and medical coverage available to Thai citizens.  Those that have paid into Social Security get the best benefits.  All the rest not even enough for subsistence.

I know this happens back here in the USA, but not nearly as bad as in Thailand (and I suppose other countries).  One of the main advantages of our moving back to the USA is my Thai wife will be eligible for Social Security and Medicare based on her earning that she and her employer pay through payroll taxes.  She would never have had anything resembling that if we had stayed in Thailand.

It saddens me to see the Thai people suffer, or anyone to be honest.  My brother-in-law just posted on Facebook a TikTok from a Thai man venting about the flooding and the damage to his home and property.  He is wiped out and the only government assistance was 600 baht.  His last comment was the community needs to sue the irrigation company.  We here in the USA are blessed with FEMA and the government programs to aid in disaster recovery and insurance.  We take it for granted.  

So, between Covid and the flooding, I can see how so many Thai would apply for assistance.  In a country where the culture is about family and community helping each other and not relying on the government, when entire families and communities are affected, they need help.

That's all I can add.  If I get anything wrong about the government systems, let me know.  My wife speaks great English, but as I know you all understand, much is still lost in translation with languages as different as English and Thai.  I might have misunderstood something she was explaining to me.

Edited November 24, 2022 by SkyDogJack
Spelling

[SkyDogJack]

On 11/24/2022 at 8:38 AM, Soidog said:

Very good question. I think part of the reason is that their bank Governor and other leading financial figures always talk to the positives and play up the outlook. Unlike for example in the U.K., where the Governor of the Bank of England thinks it’s his job to outline and second guess all the doom and gloom. A difference in growth of 0.1% between a forecast for the U.K. and for Germany is reported as the U.K. will have the lowest growth of the G7. A combination of financial key figures and the media talks the country down. In Thailand the media talk most things up. 10 million tourists is reported as a massive 500% rise in tourism year on year, not a 75% reduction in pre-Covid numbers as it would be if reported in the U.K. Much of the financial markets are about sentiment and the Thais are masters at sending out positive news. 

I like what you wrote.  In the USA, the mainstream media paints an ever-optimistic picture regarding the economy, yet every financial advisor from all the leading financial institutions tell a very different story.  The Thai media certainly has no monopoly on promoting misleading information.  There are so many datasets and indicators that I quite frankly am not be able to understand, not having a PhD in Economics, that I rely on experts who appear impartial to the media and just tell it like it is.

If what I am reading and watching is true, we are headed for a major global financial crisis in 2023-2024.  Just back here in the USA, the overvaluation in the real estate market has already started to turn.  Market prices in the last 90 days, averaged across the USA are down 15-20 percent.  I am no expert on any of this, but I think we all have some rough waters ahead.

[Soidog]

5 minutes ago, SkyDogJack said:

I like what you wrote.  In the USA, the mainstream media paints an ever-optimistic picture regarding the economy, yet every financial advisor from all the leading financial institutions tell a very different story.  The Thai media certainly has no monopoly on promoting misleading information.  There are so many datasets and indicators that I quite frankly am not be able to understand, not having a PhD in Economics, that I rely on experts who appear impartial to the media and just tell it like it is.

If what I am reading and watching is true, we are headed for a major global financial crisis in 2023-2024.  Just back here in the USA, the overvaluation in the real estate market has already started to turn.  Market prices in the last 90 days, averaged across the USA are down 15-20 percent.  I am no expert on any of this, but I think we all have some rough waters ahead.

Thank you and I totally agree with your view of the outlook. One thing that amazed me is how people thought we could essentially shut down the world for 18 months during Covid and there would be little to no lasting impact.
 

The world is locked in this never ending desire for growth; something I fail to fully comprehend why? After the impact of Covid and a healthy measure of mid 20th century war mongering by Putin, the world can’t suddenly go back to how it was in 2019. No one should be shocked, surprised or taken off guard by what’s happened. I just wish the western world, especially, would get things in to perspective. When I have to walk 5 miles with a dirty bucket to get clean water, I may complain as much as some of the western mainstream media. People in the U.K. are complaining as if they have no food simply because they are having to be more careful what they spend over Christmas. It’s embarrassing. 

[SkyDogJack]

7 minutes ago, Soidog said:

Thank you and I totally agree with your view of the outlook. One thing that amazed me is how people thought we could essentially shut down the world for 18 months during Covid and there would be little to no lasting impact.
 

The world is locked in this never ending desire for growth; something I fail to fully comprehend why? After the impact of Covid and a healthy measure of mid 20th century war mongering by Putin, the world can’t suddenly go back to how it was in 2019. No one should be shocked, surprised or taken off guard by what’s happened. I just wish the western world, especially, would get things in to perspective. When I have to walk 5 miles with a dirty bucket to get clean water, I may complain as much as some of the western mainstream media. People in the U.K. are complaining as if they have no food simply because they are having to be more careful what they spend over Christmas. It’s embarrassing. 

Soidog, I could not have said it better.  Today is "Black Friday" here in the USA.  People are standing in line to spend billions of dollars, much on credit, which in the end, they will default on.  The American appetite for spending and consumption knows no bounds or limits.  Many mistakes were made on all levels as regards the pandemic, but it the greed and lust for material things that will drag us all back down.  The war in the Ukraine and the lockdowns in China are enough in themselves to bring the world economy to a halt but add in the unquenchable thirst for the acquisition of "things", and I fear we are really in for a rough coming few years.  And to top it off?  Nobody really knows if Covid is gone.  My wife tells me about the hospitals in rural Thailand are starting to fill up with Covid patients.  Well, we will just have to wait and see.  Thanks for your thoughtful comments.

Jack

PS: I am so lucky I have a wife that has the same values as I do.  We live modestly and have no debt.  We will be ok, whether we were in the USA or Thailand.  I don't think we can say that about most the western world.  Sad...

[ExpatPattaya]

28 minutes ago, SkyDogJack said:

In the USA, the mainstream media paints an ever-optimistic picture regarding the economy, yet every financial advisor from all the leading financial institutions tell a very different story.  The Thai media certainly has no monopoly on promoting misleading information. 

If what I am reading and watching is true, we are headed for a major global financial crisis in 2023-2024.  Just back here in the USA, the overvaluation in the real estate market has already started to turn.  Market prices in the last 90 days, averaged across the USA are down 15-20 percent.

People are working and joblessness is very low in the USA from what I hear on Bloomberg.  Yes financial institutions who only use your money to make their money are not going to do well, that only hurts them IMO.  The reason why many wealthy people say crisis, is because their money comes from the stock market, so when the DOW is down they all see a crisis.  Working people could care less about the "Markets" 

Interest rates hit like 19% back in 1979, currently just 5.15% and likely stabilizing.  Not everyone needs a new car or a new house built and are happy to lease or rent.  This pisses off the people who rely on the working class to go into debt every year by buying a new car or a new house.   

Not happening as peoples priorities have changed,  They no longer live with the new house with 2 cars in the garage concept that the boomers lived with.  

Am obviously not an economist either, but see things changing while many financial people seem to want everything to be the same or as it used to be. Does that make perfect sense on no sense at all? 555

 

[HolyCowCm]

On 11/24/2022 at 10:06 PM, SkyDogJack said:

One of the main advantages of our moving back to the USA is my Thai wife will be eligible for Social Security and Medicare based on her earning that she and her employer pay through payroll taxes.  She would never have had anything resembling that if we had stayed in Thailand.

This is what infuriates me of the USA and its racist archaic dinosaur law about foreign wives not being able to recieve the citizen of the USA husband's SS after he passes away, as again is purely racist. I think it was instituted as under the War Brides Act and was huge against Asians after the final curtain of WWll. My wife doesn't want to live in the USA and I don't either for a long long long time now. This law should be repealed for USA citizen's wives who are married for over a certain 5yr time and who especially have children with that woman. All my wife will be able to get is what I have in the bank and bought out right for our family, and honestly the racist War Bride's act should be stricken off the books and allow our wives to at least have something in their older part of their lives that we US Citizens worked to build up and have. 

 

 

[SkyDogJack]

25 minutes ago, HolyCowCm said:

This is what infuriates me of the USA and its racist archaic dinosaur law about foreign wives not being able to recieve the citizen of the USA husband's SS after he passes away, as again is purely racist. I think it was instituted as under the War Brides Act and was huge against Asians after the final curtain of WWll. My wife doesn't want to live in the USA and I don't either for a long long long time now. This law should be repealed for USA citizen's wives who are married for over a certain 5yr time and who especially have children with that woman. All my wife will be able to get is what I have in the bank and bought out right for our family, and honestly the racist War Bride's act should be stricken off the books and allow our wives to at least have something in their older part of their lives that we US Citizens worked to build up and have. 

HolyCowCm,

I am confused.  My wife can receive my Social Security either as a green card Holder or a U.S. Citizen under current law.  I have actually talked to my immigration attorney and as long as she has gone through the legal immigration process, she is fully eligible.  If you can take the time to explain this, I'm sure we all would appreciate it.  I looked up the original law as revisited in 2021, and I don't understand how this effect you?  Immigration benefits are no different here than anywhere as a general rule.  The immigrate has to be lawfully admitted to the USA and meet the requirements set forth under USCIS immigration rules and regulations, many from the original Immigration and Naturalization Act.  Please help us understand.

I have a recent link to the War Bride Act you are referencing.  There are hundreds of articles written about this, so again, I am confused.

https://www.legion.org/honor/253045/our-wwii-story-here-come-war-brides

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Brides_Act

Edited November 26, 2022 by SkyDogJack
Provide link and cleanup my post.

[ExpatPattaya]

16 minutes ago, HolyCowCm said:

foreign wives not being able to recieve the citizen of the USA husband's SS after he passes away, as again is purely racist.

Why should anyone who does not pay into SS receive SS?  I don't get that at all.   Maybe a child under 18 should get their parents SS if they happen to pass away before their child is an adult.   

Someone told me if you are married legally in the USA for over 10 years your spouse will get part of your SS pension regardless of their citizenship...maybe check on that with the SS website.

 

[ExpatPattaya]

7 minutes ago, SkyDogJack said:

My wife can receive my Social Security either as a green card Holder or a U.S. Citizen under current law. 

I do not think HolyCowCM's wife has either is what he was saying

[SkyDogJack]

18 minutes ago, ExpatPattaya said:

Why should anyone who does not pay into SS receive SS?  I don't get that at all.   Maybe a child under 18 should get their parents SS if they happen to pass away before their child is an adult.   

Someone told me if you are married legally in the USA for over 10 years your spouse will get part of your SS pension regardless of their citizenship...maybe check on that with the SS website.

ExpatPattaya,

I can expand on this a little.  Your first point is about anyone getting Social Security if they have not paid in.  This rule was established to help protect spouses who made much less income, or none as stay at home spouses.  Typically, this was for women who stayed home to care for children.

The ten-year rule applies to claiming after divorce.  Both Green Card and Naturalized Citizens can apply. The 10-year rule is not about claiming Social Security when married and the death of the spouse occurs.  There are different rules.  If I remember correctly, the marriage needs to have lasted for at least nine months before a claim can be made.

I looked up a quick reference and am linking it here.

Jack

https://www.aarp.org/retirement/social-security/questions-answers/social-security-spouse-dies.html?cmp=KNC-DSO-SAPLA-SocialSecurityQuestions-22000-GOOG-SurvivorBenefits-Exact-NonBrand&gclid=CjwKCAiA7IGcBhA8EiwAFfUDsR9CiBZECGJZJVUzglnz4V6rZ9U6TDc6TpYKfEZJt4PbbvV8HDeNphoCT9YQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Edited November 26, 2022 by SkyDogJack
More info

[HolyCowCm]

24 minutes ago, SkyDogJack said:

HolyCowCm,

I am confused.  My wife can receive my Social Security either as a green card Holder or a U.S. Citizen under current law.  I have actually talked to my immigration attorney and as long as she has gone through the legal immigration process, she is fully eligible.  If you can take the time to explain this, I'm sure we all would appreciate it.  I looked up the original law as revisited in 2021, and I don't understand how this effect you?  Immigration benefits are no different here than anywhere as a general rule.  The immigrate has to be lawfully admitted to the USA and meet the requirements set forth under USCIS immigration rules and regulations, many from the original Immigration and Naturalization Act.  Please help us understand.

I have a recent link to the War Bride Act you are referencing.  There are hundreds of articles written about this, so again, I am confused.

https://www.legion.org/honor/253045/our-wwii-story-here-come-war-brides

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Brides_Act

It all spouts from the USA citizen's foreign wife has to live in the USA for a period of time in orderto qualify, and for this we will never do. I believe this law came about from the USA's racist reaction to outside USA marriages just after WWll. And I do mean racist. My wife can go to the USA no problem as has a 10 year visa that is easy to get time and time again, but she has no inclination to want to live there in order to get rights to my SS, as this is just not worth it having to bear living there. So bearing this in mind, we plan other ways to keep her going after I pass away or if I pass away first. But I do find it unbelievable that they still in this day and age to disallow my chosen legal wife whether not a citizen and having no green card the right to have my money that I paid in. They say it is a privilege and not a right in general. But they try to flip flop on that. They consider it theiur money and not my tax money I paid in order to reach being able to get it. I did not pay into it in order to pay for other free loaders or for them to take it and fund something else. It shoulkd be the right of my wishes to have my SS go to my wife whether or not ever lived in the USA.

[HolyCowCm]

33 minutes ago, ExpatPattaya said:

Why should anyone who does not pay into SS receive SS?  I don't get that at all.   Maybe a child under 18 should get their parents SS if they happen to pass away before their child is an adult.   

Someone told me if you are married legally in the USA for over 10 years your spouse will get part of your SS pension regardless of their citizenship...maybe check on that with the SS website.

That's the point. she and me do not want to live in the USA, and trhis SS fund was generated by my money and sweat and should be ble to go to my wife. Children are a different story. The USA thinks it's theirs, but is should never be and it should take care of the spouse with no strings as a right of the spouse.

[HolyCowCm]

34 minutes ago, ExpatPattaya said:

I do not think HolyCowCM's wife has either is what he was saying

That is the point and I fully disagree with it. If my wife lived in the USA then they should pay her hazzard and PTSD pay for putting up with the BS and American whack jobs there. It plainly is not worth the torment living there. Here is the top of the banana to have a great life. She has been to the USA a few times and says no-thank-you!

[SkyDogJack]

9 hours ago, HolyCowCm said:

It all spouts from the USA citizen's foreign wife has to live in the USA for a period of time in orderto qualify, and for this we will never do. I believe this law came about from the USA's racist reaction to outside USA marriages just after WWll. And I do mean racist. My wife can go to the USA no problem as has a 10 year visa that is easy to get time and time again, but she has no inclination to want to live there in order to get rights to my SS, as this is just not worth it having to bear living there. So bearing this in mind, we plan other ways to keep her going after I pass away or if I pass away first. But I do find it unbelievable that they still in this day and age to disallow my chosen legal wife whether not a citizen and having no green card the right to have my money that I paid in. They say it is a privilege and not a right in general. But they try to flip flop on that. They consider it theiur money and not my tax money I paid in order to reach being able to get it. I did not pay into it in order to pay for other free loaders or for them to take it and fund something else. It shoulkd be the right of my wishes to have my SS go to my wife whether or not ever lived in the USA.

Ok, I understand now where you are coming from.  Yea, I get it.  The only way my wife (Thai) or any non-U.S. national can collect on my Social Security is to follow the rules.  However, it is not about the law you referenced.  These are Social Security Rules.  In our case, my wife does not need to collect my Social Security.  She will have paid enough into the American tax system to qualify on her own.  The American rules are not really any different than other countries.  They all have their rules to follow.  Some work for us, some doesn't.  I'm sorry you are suffering about your wife's future financial security.  I understand.  I would have the same fear as you if we had not moved back.  

PS: I forgot to mention.  My wife has made friends in the Thai community here, and we go to the local Thai temples to celebrate holidays.  It took some time, but she came to appreciate what we have here and has created her own belonging and found a very good Thai culture here to join in with.  If she had felt as your wife, we probably would not be here.  Different people can adjust to this culture, some not.  It is not easy, but my wife also worked in an Internation business career in Bangkok before we moved back to the USA.  I think that also helped her.  Good luck.

Edited November 26, 2022 by SkyDogJack
Spelling

[Marc26]

9 hours ago, HolyCowCm said:

That is the point and I fully disagree with it. If my wife lived in the USA then they should pay her hazzard and PTSD pay for putting up with the BS and American whack jobs there. It plainly is not worth the torment living there. Here is the top of the banana to have a great life. She has been to the USA a few times and says no-thank-you!

Yet you feel she should be entitled to our welfare system

 

Sorry doesn't work that way.....

 

You made a choice, which you seem very happy with, so you live with that choice

 

Why you think someone who has no interest in the county should keep getting money from the country is a bit absurd 

 

To then rail on about racism is a bit ridiculous HC

 

 

PS.....I will very much be in the same position as you and the thought that my wife should be entitled to any money after never living in the US would never occur to me 

[SkyDogJack]

11 hours ago, ExpatPattaya said:

I do not think HolyCowCM's wife has either is what he was saying

Yea, I figured that too.  This is a difficult position for anyone, but especially expats who either did not plan for future care of spouses or simply did not have the resources.  My decision to move back was based on Medicare benefits, most and foremost. Many people have no clue American Medicare provides no coverage outside the USA. I knew that when I moved to Thailand, and I soon developed some health issues that I am dealing with. To get the necessary coverage I needed the monthly premium at age 70 outside the USA (not just Thailand) was going to push 1,000 dollars month.   And I might not be able to find the advanced eye surgery I needed to keep my sight in the host country.

I think HC may also be overlooking the fact that he cannot use Medicare outside the USA for his own benefit.  He would have to fly back to the USA, find a place to stay and have been enrolled and paid his premiums into Medicare to be eligible.  There is nothing racist about that decision on the American government's part to deny him benefits.  This is strictly government rules and economics.

I have friends from New Zealand and Australia who share with me their stories about the limitations placed on their own citizens to even collect Social Security when living outside their home countries.  At least the American system has not yet implemented those reforms, else a lot of American expats would be in serious trouble.

I will say this about moving back to the USA and bringing my Thai wife when I did; I am lucky I made the decision after less than two years living in Thailand.  I figured out very quickly that at age 66 and falling in love and marrying a younger Thai woman, I was not going to have enough time to pull together a plan that would serve us both in the long term.  America is expensive and has lots of problems.  There are things I don't like here and there were thing that I did not like about Thailand, but it does not serve any purpose to blame Thailand or America.  We all make our own decisions, and we have to live with them.  Good chatting.  I'm rarely on the forum anymore but enjoy the opportunity to connect.   Take care.

Jack

Edited November 26, 2022 by SkyDogJack
Cleanup my post.

[HolyCowCm]

35 minutes ago, Marc26 said:

Yet you feel she should be entitled to our welfare system

Sorry doesn't work that way.....

You made a choice, which you seem very happy with, so you live with that choice

Why you think someone who has no interest in the county should keep getting money from the country is a bit absurd 

To then rail on about racism is a bit ridiculous HC

PS.....I will very much be in the same position as you and the thought that my wife should be entitled to any money after never living in the US would never occur to me 

Sorry Marc but SS is not a welfare system in my case but is from my taxes paid into the system. You can feel free to call it a welfare system if you like though. Yes it does occur to me and of course this is the choice I made, but the initial SS laws years and years ago focused I believe around War brides and there was quite a bit of racism built upon that. There is a lot to read in that category subject. My mom was not from the USA. Yes there is nothing I can do about it as we will not be living in the USA for even 1 month, but the fact is I paid that money through taxes and it should be able to go to my real long term wife and mother to my usa kids who are citizens. Just ticks me off but I have another plan to take care. Seems you do ax well. 

 

 

[SkyDogJack]

2 hours ago, Marc26 said:

Yet you feel she should be entitled to our welfare system

Sorry doesn't work that way.....

You made a choice, which you seem very happy with, so you live with that choice

Why you think someone who has no interest in the county should keep getting money from the country is a bit absurd 

To then rail on about racism is a bit ridiculous HC

PS.....I will very much be in the same position as you and the thought that my wife should be entitled to any money after never living in the US would never occur to me 

Marc26, I understand your point, however, Social Security is much more than Welfare.

Definition and Examples of Welfare Programs
Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF)
Medicaid.
Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Programs (SNAP or "food stamps")
Supplemental Security Income (SSI)
Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC)
Housing assistance.

https://www.cbpp.org/research/social-security/top-ten-facts-about-social-security

Edited November 26, 2022 by SkyDogJack
More info

[Marc26]

1 hour ago, HolyCowCm said:

Sorry Marc but SS is not a welfare system in my case but is from my taxes paid into the system. You can feel free to call it a welfare system if you like though. Yes it does occur to me and of course this is the choice I made, but the initial SS laws years and years ago focused I believe around War brides and there was quite a bit of racism built upon that. There is a lot to read in that category subject. My mom was not from the USA. Yes there is nothing I can do about it as we will not be living in the USA for even 1 month, but the fact is I paid that money through taxes and it should be able to go to my real long term wife and mother to my usa kids who are citizens. Just ticks me off but I have another plan to take care. Seems you do ax well. 

Yes you paid your taxes and you will receive your SS pension for the years remaining 

 

But it's not a system where you get exactly what you put in

If it were I'd say she'd be entitled to it

 

You could live to 100 and you will take more than you contributed 

 

It shouldn't then go to someone who has never contributed to the system at all

 

And I stress I will be in the same situation as you so it's not like I am disagreeing with you for my own interests 

 

I don't think my wife should be entitled as well

 

Now my wife will get a small Canadian pension but she has lived and contributed in the country