China to sign first Pacific security deal which will give them warships on Australia's doorstep

[KaptainRob]

 

China and Solomon Islands are set to sign off on a security deal that will see Chinese warships based in the Pacific and shift the balance of power in Australia’s region.

The agreement will give China the power to use its military to protect the safety of Chinese personnel and major projects in Solomon Islands and give Beijing a base for its navy less than 2000 kilometres off Australia’s coast.

The base would be the first time Australia has had a strategic adversary within striking distance of its coastline since World War II.

“China may, according to its own needs and with the consent of Solomon Islands, make ship visits to, carry out logistical replenishment in and have stopover and transition in the Solomon Islands,” the draft framework agreement states.   STUFF NEWS story continues here > CLICK <

 

[Poolie]

Wow, only 2000km away! Big threat.

[Shade_Wilder]

30 minutes ago, Poolie said:

Wow, only 2000km away! Big threat.

 

Respectfully, you do not understand the significance of the location of the new base.

China, having a naval base there, is in a position to interdict supplies and materiel arriving from the United States or elsewhere by ship.

It is the precise reason that Japan wanted the same islands in WW2. Gee, I wonder what other similarities there are between that era and now?

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

 

[Pinetree]

34 minutes ago, Poolie said:

Wow, only 2000km away! Big threat.

You have heard of missiles haven't you?  You do know that ships can move around and aircraft can fly for more than 2,000km? 2,000km is far too near for comfort, in an area that is basically de militarised, until the Chinese get there. Typical of them and their ambitions to rule the World and sod everyone else.  They are a much bigger danger than Putin and his criminals. Australia and NZ are right to be worried. 

[Fanta]

Too close to Brisvegas for my liking. Australia should go and buy those islands and set up some immigration detention centers that way they’ll always have people there /s

We should definitely stop pumping money into the Solomons simply because the Chinese will always have deeper pockets.

[Vigo]

Give this some time. I don't think the Chinese fully appreciate the "cultural dynamics" of the local population. I expect the welcome will wear off once the  robberies and thefts start, and that riots will result as soon as the first local thief is shot while stealing something from the Chinese base.

It is similar to PNG.

 

[Poolie]

31 minutes ago, Pinetree said:

You have heard of missiles haven't you?  You do know that ships can move around and aircraft can fly for more than 2,000km? 2,000km is far too near for comfort, in an area that is basically de militarised, until the Chinese get there. Typical of them and their ambitions to rule the World and sod everyone else.  They are a much bigger danger than Putin and his criminals. Australia and NZ are right to be worried. 

Pure, western media driven paranoia. China isn't America. They dont scatter missiles around like confetti.

At present all they have is a draft document, so keep tour trousers on.

[KaptainRob]

4 minutes ago, Vigo said:

Give this some time. I don't think the Chinese fully appreciate the "cultural dynamics" of the local population. I expect the welcome will wear off once the  robberies and thefts start, and that riots will result as soon as the first local thief is shot while stealing something from the Chinese base.

It is similar to PNG.

I took a yacht thru the western end, from Alotau (PNG), and the islanders are actually quite different, culturally they're well spoken, even reserved, and were schooled by English missionaries.  Didn't go as far as Honiara though I can imagine it being just a bigger version of Alotau.  A larger dump.

[Pinetree]

9 minutes ago, Poolie said:

Pure, western media driven paranoia. China isn't America. They dont scatter missiles around like confetti.

At present all they have is a draft document, so keep tour trousers on.

haha, there are none so blind as those who cannot see. 

[NorskTiger]

I see no problem with China being allowed to endear themselves with a country far away from home, as long as it is commonplace practice by others. 

    A large Asian nation spreading it's wings outside of Asia should be welcomed by those who desire to do the same elsewhere. 

[EdwardV]

On 4/15/2022 at 1:39 PM, NorskTiger said:

A large Asian nation spreading it's wings outside of Asia should be welcomed by those who desire to do the same elsewhere. 

That's what the Japanese said back in the 30s. Can you say "Guadalcanal 2.0"? 

[oldschooler]

On 3/26/2022 at 8:55 AM, KaptainRob said:

China and Solomon Islands are set to sign off on a security deal that will see Chinese warships based in the Pacific and shift the balance of power in Australia’s region.

The agreement will give China the power to use its military to protect the safety of Chinese personnel and major projects in Solomon Islands and give Beijing a base for its navy less than 2000 kilometres off Australia’s coast.

The base would be the first time Australia has had a strategic adversary within striking distance of its coastline since World War II.

“China may, according to its own needs and with the consent of Solomon Islands, make ship visits to, carry out logistical replenishment in and have stopover and transition in the Solomon Islands,” the draft framework agreement states.   STUFF NEWS story continues here > CLICK <

Any CCP submarine base so close to Oz would not be good.

[oldschooler]

On 3/26/2022 at 12:08 PM, Shade_Wilder said:

Respectfully, you do not understand the significance of the location of the new base.

China, having a naval base there, is in a position to interdict supplies and materiel arriving from the United States or elsewhere by ship.

It is the precise reason that Japan wanted the same islands in WW2. Gee, I wonder what other similarities there are between that era and now?

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

China hemmed in on all sides by geography & strong alliances. First aggressive move from that base and its “goodbye former base”. CCP desperate to “ break out” hence SC Sea antics.  

[NorskTiger]

On 4/22/2022 at 1:00 AM, EdwardV said:

That's what the Japanese said back in the 30s. Can you say "Guadalcanal 2.0"? 

Isn't that a bit of a stretch to draw a historical parallell? 

[EdwardV]

31 minutes ago, NorskTiger said:

Isn't that a bit of a stretch to draw a historical parallell? 

Is it? Geography plays a bigger part in most strategic and  geopolitical decisions than some think. For the same reason the allies attacked Guadalcanal in WW2, will be the same reason it would be a target in a conflict with China (not that I think there will be one). It’s the same reason China finds value in the island in the first place. Geography will also be the reason any battle will have the same result. Small islands far from your home are incredibly hard to defend. 

[NorskTiger]

16 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

Is it? Geography plays a bigger part in most strategic and  geopolitical decisions than some think. For the same reason the allies attacked Guadalcanal in WW2, will be the same reason it would be a target in a conflict with China (not that I think there will be one). It’s the same reason China finds value in the island in the first place. Geography will also be the reason any battle will have the same result. Small islands far from your home are incredibly hard to defend. 

So you don't see this happening? I agree. 

    Otherwise, the geostrategic situation appears quite different. China is a self-sustained nation with expansionism based on trade and development (BRI) and not colonization. One island as military base is peanuts compared to the main geostrategic adversary (USA) has in the same region. 

     The main strategic toggle in Pacific appears to be over Taiwan and North China Sea area. This is much closer to China and incredibly far from the USA. There is no significant logistical bases for USA to be able to sustain a campaign against China in the near-China areas. 

     Furthermore, the USA empire is more or less spent and is not capable of taking on China the way they did Japan. China did most of the heavy lifiting vs. Japan in the same way Russia did ti vs. Germany. This time, there is no two-front pressure and the USA and the professional army is simply not able to fight an enemy which entails massive casualties. 

    So I don't see a parallell to Guadalcanal. There is no evidence of CHinese expansionism and one tiny island base is a pittance compared to what the main adversary has. 

[EdwardV]

56 minutes ago, NorskTiger said:

 The main strategic toggle in Pacific appears to be over Taiwan and North China Sea area. This is much closer to China and incredibly far from the USA. There is no significant logistical bases for USA to be able to sustain a campaign against China in the near-China areas. 

Not that I agree with your interpretation of China, but that's just our opinion so we will let that be. No doubt you mean the South China Sea, but it's not that far from US bases and defense treaty countries as you think. The US has major US bases in South Korea, Japan, Okinawa, Singapore and of course Guam which is a US territory. There are five permanent major bases on Japan alone. The USS Reagan carrier battle group home port is Japan (not the US). The US also has binding mutual defense treaties with South Korea, Japan, Philippines, and Australia. The idea the US can't sustain a campaign in the area isn't grounded in reality. Let's not forget the fact the US Navy is fully blue water capable, unlike that of China.

However you are not quite understanding what a war between the two countries would look like. The US Navy isn't going to sail into the South China Sea to defend Taiwan, they don't have to. They can do the job from outside the first island chain. What some don't realize is you can basically destroy China from the Indian Ocean. Think about that one for a minute. Last the idea any war would be just between China and the US/Taiwan again isn't grounded in reality. Unlike China, the US has allies which would also be included in any fight. Massive casualties? Do you think someone is going to be landing troops in China?  

[oldschooler]

On 6/4/2022 at 3:18 AM, NorskTiger said:

So you don't see this happening? I agree. 

    Otherwise, the geostrategic situation appears quite different. China is a self-sustained nation with expansionism based on trade and development (BRI) and not colonization. One island as military base is peanuts compared to the main geostrategic adversary (USA) has in the same region. 

     The main strategic toggle in Pacific appears to be over Taiwan and North China Sea area. This is much closer to China and incredibly far from the USA. There is no significant logistical bases for USA to be able to sustain a campaign against China in the near-China areas. 

     Furthermore, the USA empire is more or less spent and is not capable of taking on China the way they did Japan. China did most of the heavy lifiting vs. Japan in the same way Russia did ti vs. Germany. This time, there is no two-front pressure and the USA and the professional army is simply not able to fight an enemy which entails massive casualties. 

    So I don't see a parallell to Guadalcanal. There is no evidence of CHinese expansionism and one tiny island base is a pittance compared to what the main adversary has. 

CCP Tyrants are contained & sealed in by Geography & Implacable Free Enemy. First Island Chain to South & East. Guarded by Pacific Alliance: USA Japan S. Korea Taiwan Australia UK France. Siberia to North. India to South. Stans to West. China also choked by Mallacca Straits / South China Seas oil passage, both easily cut by Pacific Alliance. 

CCP China Conventional Military is Clearly Useless & Trapped on their Land.Unable to Project Any Power beyond Land Borders. Nukes Aside.

Pathetic Illegal South China Seas seizures already sinking under weight of concrete / rocks added US will sweep away this $20 billion investment in hours when CCP eventually move on Taiwan thus sealing their planned destruction. 

CCP China can only Expand Economically by BRI & Loans to Poor Countries who will be forced to ultimately Default, keeping the CCP - built Infrastructure.

In my strong imagination / opinion : 

CCP Ownership of US/ Western Assets & Debt Cancelled as Covid Reparations & Enemy.

World $30 Trillion Debt is Reset, after Next Crash, by West, with Land / Asset Transfers, not for China though, or US$ Devaluation ( 200 to 1?) or Cut CCP / Russia from US$ Trading, China the Biggest Loser by far.   World stops trading with Tyrannies & Enables their Internal Collapse.  

Thus CCP China would be / are effectively already Insolvent / Broke/ Walking Dead.just doesn’t know it yet.

[oldschooler]

3 minutes ago, oldschooler said:

CCP Tyrants are contained & sealed in by Geography & Implacable Free Enemy. First Island Chain to South & East. Guarded by Pacific Alliance: USA Japan S. Korea Taiwan Australia UK France. Siberia to North. India to South. Stans to West. China also choked by Mallacca Straits / South China Seas oil passage, both easily cut by Pacific Alliance. 

CCP China Conventional Military is Clearly Useless & Trapped on their Land.Unable to Project Any Power beyond Land Borders. Nukes Aside.

Pathetic Illegal South China Seas seizures already sinking under weight of concrete / rocks added US will sweep away this $20 billion investment in hours when CCP eventually move on Taiwan thus sealing their planned destruction. 

CCP China can only Expand Economically by BRI & Loans to Poor Countries who will be forced to ultimately Default, keeping the CCP - built Infrastructure.

In my strong imagination / opinion : 

CCP Ownership of US/ Western Assets & Debt Cancelled as Covid Reparations & Enemy.

World $30 Trillion Debt is Reset, after Next Crash, by West, with Land / Asset Transfers, not for China though, or US$ Devaluation ( 200 to 1?) or Cut CCP / Russia from US$ Trading, China the Biggest Loser by far.   World stops trading with Tyrannies & Enables their Internal Collapse.  

Thus CCP China would be / are effectively already Insolvent / Broke/ Walking Dead.just doesn’t know it yet.

Also any conventional Alliance / CCP war would be over in 2-3 days with the clunky unskilled CCP navy /Air Force/ army invasion forces, at bottom of sea.

My concern here though is that CCP will then nuke Taiwan etc. with dire world Consequences. CCP /NK/  Russian Nukes must be somehow disabled beforehand…..

[oldschooler]

Just now, oldschooler said:

Also any conventional Alliance / CCP war would be over in 2-3 days with the clunky unskilled CCP navy /Air Force/ army invasion forces, at bottom of sea.

My concern here though is that CCP will then nuke Taiwan etc. with dire world Consequences. CCP /NK/  Russian Nukes must be somehow disabled beforehand…..

CCP / NK Leadership & Control/ Command must be somehow Decapitated first (thousand cruise missiles ?).

[Joeweb]

On 3/25/2022 at 10:48 PM, Poolie said:

Pure, western media driven paranoia. China isn't America. They dont scatter missiles around like confetti.

At present all they have is a draft document, so keep tour trousers on.

China has the largest stockpile of of conventional missles in the word.  That was part of their plan for denying access to the south China sea strategy against the usa's more superior and capable crrier task forces.

 

[Poolie]

5 minutes ago, Joeweb said:

China has the largest stockpile of of conventional missles in the word.  That was part of their plan for denying access to the south China sea strategy against the usa's more superior and capable crrier task forces.

And where are these missiles?

[oldschooler]

On 6/4/2022 at 3:18 AM, NorskTiger said:

So you don't see this happening? I agree. 

    Otherwise, the geostrategic situation appears quite different. China is a self-sustained nation with expansionism based on trade and development (BRI) and not colonization. One island as military base is peanuts compared to the main geostrategic adversary (USA) has in the same region. 

     The main strategic toggle in Pacific appears to be over Taiwan and North China Sea area. This is much closer to China and incredibly far from the USA. There is no significant logistical bases for USA to be able to sustain a campaign against China in the near-China areas. 

     Furthermore, the USA empire is more or less spent and is not capable of taking on China the way they did Japan. China did most of the heavy lifiting vs. Japan in the same way Russia did ti vs. Germany. This time, there is no two-front pressure and the USA and the professional army is simply not able to fight an enemy which entails massive casualties. 

    So I don't see a parallell to Guadalcanal. There is no evidence of CHinese expansionism and one tiny island base is a pittance compared to what the main adversary has. 

“….far from USA” irrelevant. USA is not “spent”. nor incurring “massive casualties” from a backward incompetent inexperienced CCP military.

China, Disunified, Weak, Defeated; did so very little in WW2 except Retreat, Tie Up Enemy & Internally Squabble. Japan took all of China at will, as required. 

Russia, without the 17.5 million tons of US / UK Materiel, which Soviet Union was simply incapable of Producing, were Beaten in 1942. Half the tanks that beat the Germans back from Moscow, were British. The Steel which built Russian Tanks was American. Trucks, Personnel Carriers, Fighter Planes etc.

US Navy / Air Force with its regional Allies & many bases & strong assets in theatre, would Obliterate CCP Attack Forces in 2-3 days, with minimal Loss. 

You fail to understand the immense power of US aircraft carriers, submarines, aircraft & missiles & Allies (and that “bases” float). China a conventionally -armed midget in comparison. 

Correct that China is not expanding militarily …only because it can’t …..  I have explained why elsewhere…simply,China is Caged & Vulnerable by Geography, Inexperience & Enemy. 
 

 

[extoxttra]

52 minutes ago, oldschooler said:

“….far from USA” irrelevant. USA is not “spent”. nor incurring “massive casualties” from a backward incompetent inexperienced CCP military.

China, Disunified, Weak, Defeated; did so very little in WW2 except Retreat, Tie Up Enemy & Internally Squabble. Japan took all of China at will, as required. 

Russia, without the 17.5 million tons of US / UK Materiel, which Soviet Union was simply incapable of Producing, were Beaten in 1942. Half the tanks that beat the Germans back from Moscow, were British. The Steel which built Russian Tanks was American. Trucks, Personnel Carriers, Fighter Planes etc.

US Navy / Air Force with its regional Allies & many bases & strong assets in theatre, would Obliterate CCP Attack Forces in 2-3 days, with minimal Loss. 

You fail to understand the immense power of US aircraft carriers, submarines, aircraft & missiles & Allies (and that “bases” float). China a conventionally -armed midget in comparison. 

Correct that China is not expanding militarily …only because it can’t …..  I have explained why elsewhere…simply,China is Caged & Vulnerable by Geography, Inexperience & Enemy. 
 

So not the warmongers they are being touted to be then?

[butterfly]

On 3/26/2022 at 12:35 AM, Poolie said:

Wow, only 2000km away! Big threat.

I think Australia should invade the Solomon islands for good measure