News Forum - Deadline on Friday to apply for 60-day “Covid” visa extension

[Bob20]

3 minutes ago, gummy said:

Yes they may have families here so in the eyes of the Thai administration why don't they simply get married and hence conform to a conventional family unit, or is it they have something to hide like they have families here but are married with families elsewhere so simply can't  ? Now that raises all sorts of moral arguments as to the type of persons they are and we all know how this PM has high moral standards, or at least he say he has.

Alright, that's the first time someone considers that morals speak louder than on the forum though

Next you'll tell me they're going to seriously address reducing corruption

[gummy]

3 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

Alright, that's the first time someone considers that morals speak louder than on the forum though

Next you'll tell me they're going to seriously address reducing corruption

Nothing to due with deflecting it to a corruption issue but anyone who has lived in Thailand for any length of time should know the importance that Thais place on the family unit, if not then you have never worked or lived closely with a Thai. The problem is that people who have used and abused the Thai system, however lax or open to abuse that may be, have only themselves to blame if now they ( Thai administration) are perhaps putting the importance of a stable Thai family unit ahead of what is commonly seen as a singles  long term stay fiddle factor.  As in most cases, like it or not, it is always the wayward minority that has spoiled it for the majority.

[Bob20]

7 minutes ago, gummy said:

Nothing to due with deflecting it to a corruption issue but anyone who has lived in Thailand for any length of time should know the importance that Thais place on the family unit, if not then you have never worked or lived closely with a Thai. The problem is that people who have used and abused the Thai system, however lax or open to abuse that may be, have only themselves to blame if now they ( Thai administration) are perhaps putting the importance of a stable Thai family unit ahead of what is commonly seen as a singles  long term stay fiddle factor.  As in most cases, like it or not, it is always the wayward minority that has spoiled it for the majority.

No deflection. But it isn't even a few weeks ago that we had heated debates here about tightening regulations and new insurance demands that made quite a few men with families cry out that it would become impossible to stay. And seeing statistics that thousands already did so, leaving families in dire circumstances.

And that's why I asked the question, as it seems that one rule creates the opposite result of another.

[Changnam43]

It's also a good money spinner. 

If you assume 100,000 people are using these visas that is more than one billion Baht a year in visa fees alone.  Plus whatever they spend every day which is mostly money from abroad flowing into Thailand and vastly exceeds the visa income.

Given how difficult it is to persuade people to come here it makes sense to hang on to that.

[Faz]

I'd like to respond to some of your questions but then I'd be as guilty as going off topic as this is wandering yet again into general Immigration themes and not specifically the 60 day Covid extensions. I'm happy to open a new topic and move your posts and general questions there if your agreeable.

[LoongFred]

45 minutes ago, Changnam43 said:

It's also a good money spinner. 

If you assume 100,000 people are using these visas that is more than one billion Baht a year in visa fees alone.  Plus whatever they spend every day which is mostly money from abroad flowing into Thailand and vastly exceeds the visa income.

Given how difficult it is to persuade people to come here it makes sense to hang on to that.

Your numbers are way too high. Need to verify.

[Wasminbe]

On 11/25/2021 at 4:42 PM, Stonker said:

Others, like you, could be on a regular visa but you prefer not to be, leaving only a few who have a genuine reason - like @Svcoquette.

Why would I be on a regular visa when I'll be going back to Canada in January for work? This visa/extension is a one-off for me, and many others. I was fully prepared to leave Thailand after 3 months last March, but because I have a wife and kids here, was between contract jobs, and have good money in the bank I took advantage of it to stay with my family.

You see Stonker, I'm only 50 years old and I will still work for a few more years before I move here full time. After that, I will look at the regular visa.

[Stonker]

On 11/25/2021 at 7:32 PM, Bob20 said:

 ... Many have written here about the government wanting retirees and other expats out, regardless of their home or family, by making it more difficult with new regulations and demands, even during Covid and recently pre-announced for next year.

Yet, your explanations show the exact opposite, being lenient even for the ones without proof of finances.

Why would the government do this while I see that many claim that they use everything in the book to get rid of us?

 

On 11/25/2021 at 7:44 PM, gummy said:

Perhaps it just the simple case they understand the importance of family ties and relationships so hence people who are on extensions due to marriage supporting Thai spouses and family meet their objectives of Thai family support. Whereas given the dodges and fiddles over the years for people who have obtained extensions based on "retirement" are known not to offer anything in that regard so hence the government's apparent  push to to get these types out. You have to consider what the Thai government consider as morally acceptable is not necessarily what others may think especially so in a society where family ties and support is so important to them. 

 ... or perhaps it's just a simple case that what many have written here isn't correct ... ... ?

[Stonker]

23 hours ago, LoongFred said:

Your numbers are way too high. Need to verify.

Exactly - 100,000 is more than are here on retirement extensions!

[Changnam43]

9 minutes ago, Stonker said:

Exactly - 100,000 is more than are here on retirement extensions!

What is your number then?

Honestly it is just a guessing game and I would not give any credence to any Thai government source for the numbers on retirement extensions or any other kind of extension.

[Stonker]

2 hours ago, Changnam43 said:

What is your number then?

Honestly it is just a guessing game and I would not give any credence to any Thai government source for the numbers on retirement extensions or any other kind of extension.

I don't have one, but my guess if I did would be in the low thousands at the most.

This not giving credence to government numbers for anything is, I 'm afraid, getting rather tedious - there's no point at in the numbers being fudged either way.

[Faz]

On 11/25/2021 at 8:28 PM, Changnam43 said:

It's also a good money spinner. 

If you assume 100,000 people are using these visas that is more than one billion Baht a year in visa fees alone.  Plus whatever they spend every day which is mostly money from abroad flowing into Thailand and vastly exceeds the visa income.

Given how difficult it is to persuade people to come here it makes sense to hang on to that.

On 11/25/2021 at 9:15 PM, LoongFred said:

Your numbers are way too high. Need to verify.

12 hours ago, Stonker said:

Exactly - 100,000 is more than are here on retirement extensions!

@Changnam43 estimated numbers on 60 day Covid extensions, not annual extensions based on retirement. I'd estimate there are more foreigners on 60 day Covid extensions than on extensions based on retirement and @Changnam43 figures are a conservative estimate.

[Stonker]

12 minutes ago, Faz said:

@Changnam43 estimated numbers on 60 day Covid extensions, not annual extensions based on retirement. I'd estimate there are more foreigners on 60 day Covid extensions than on extensions based on retirement and @Changnam43 figures are a conservative estimate.

I would think a reasonable estimate could be based on the numbers applying at Phuket immigration, since applications for Covid extensions would be made at around the same time.

@Svcoquette has given those before a number of times based on her personal experience of those also applying, as have others in Pattaya, and that makes 100,000 a massive over estimate.

Of course only a proportion are in Phuket / Pattaya, albeit most of the yachties are, and they're spread around other provinces too, but there are none in mine and unlikely to be many outside the tourist areas.

[Faz]

51 minutes ago, Stonker said:

I would think a reasonable estimate could be based on the numbers applying at Phuket immigration, since applications for Covid extensions would be made at around the same time.

Why would they be applying around the same time?
Foreigners enter every single day so Covid extensions applications are subject to their current permission of stay dates. My local rural Immigration office in Isaan estimates they receive 3 Covid extension applications a day.

There were double figure numbers of foreigners with Thai spouse/family applying for the Non Imm O ME Visa from Savannakhet alone on a daily basis previously. For the last 18 months they've remained in Thailand using the 60 day Covid extensions. It's not only tourists that have been taking advantage of these extensions.

[Changnam43]

1 hour ago, Stonker said:

I would think a reasonable estimate could be based on the numbers applying at Phuket immigration, since applications for Covid extensions would be made at around the same time.

@Svcoquette has given those before a number of times based on her personal experience of those also applying, as have others in Pattaya, and that makes 100,000 a massive over estimate.

Of course only a proportion are in Phuket / Pattaya, albeit most of the yachties are, and they're spread around other provinces too, but there are none in mine and unlikely to be many outside the tourist areas.

You might be surprised how many there are.  I live in a southern province which is not a high profile tourist area.  In everyday life I can go literally months without seeing another foreigner.

In this province vaccination is centralised at one hospital in the provincial capital.  On the two days I went there each time there were more than 100 foreigners getting shots.  A fair percentage of them were Asian but as the hospital operated a separate queue for foreigners and as they were in it it was clear they were not Thai.  I got a glance at the passports of some and nationalities included China and the Philippines.  With one exception I have no idea who these people are or what they do.  The only one I spoke to was a South African who was teaching English online for customers in China.  All these people must be on one visa or another.     

Edited November 27, 2021 by Changnam43

[Fluke]

1 hour ago, Stonker said:

I would think a reasonable estimate could be based on the numbers applying at Phuket immigration, since applications for Covid extensions would be made at around the same time.

@Svcoquette has given those before a number of times based on her personal experience of those also applying, as have others in Pattaya, and that makes 100,000 a massive over estimate.

Of course only a proportion are in Phuket / Pattaya, albeit most of the yachties are, and they're spread around other provinces too, but there are none in mine and unlikely to be many outside the tourist areas.

When I was at CM immigration last week , of the hundreds of people applying for extensions , about half were applying for the Covid extensions .

  But take into consideration that those on the Covid extension need to attend immigration 12 times per year to get extensions and those on retirement visa just need to attend once per year 

[Stonker]

23 minutes ago, Faz said:

Why would they be applying around the same time?
Foreigners enter every single day so Covid extensions applications are subject to their current permission of stay dates. My local rural Immigration office in Isaan estimates they receive 3 Covid extension applications a day.

There were double figure numbers of foreigners with Thai spouse/family applying for the Non Imm O ME Visa from Savannakhet alone on a daily basis previously. For the last 18 months they've remained in Thailand using the 60 day Covid extensions. It's not only tourists that have been taking advantage of these extensions.

They'd have to re-apply at much the same time to meet cut-off dates, even if their own extension date was later, as those on them have said here.

I'm simply going by what those who've been on them in Pattaya and Phuket have posted here, and while they said the offices were full of Covid extenders as a result, that's nowhere near the numbers suggested.

[Stonker]

23 minutes ago, Changnam43 said:

You might be surprised how many there are.  I live in a southern province which is not a high profile tourist area.  In everyday life I can go literally months without seeing another foreigner.

In this province vaccination is centralised at one hospital in the provincial capital.  On the two days I went there each time there were more than 100 foreigners getting shots.  A fair percentage of them were Asian but as the hospital operated a separate queue for foreigners and as they were in it it was clear they were not Thai.  I got a glance at the passports of some and nationalities included China and the Philippines.  With one exception I have no idea who these people are or what they do.  The only one I spoke to was a South African who was teaching English online for customers in China.  All these people must be on one visa or another.     

I had a similar experience when getting vaccinated, albeit there weren't that many and that only happens in my province for Pfizer.  As you say, though "one visa or another".

[Stonker]

23 minutes ago, Fluke said:

When I was at CM immigration last week , of the hundreds of people applying for extensions , about half were applying for the Covid extensions .

  But take into consideration that those on the Covid extension need to attend immigration 12 times per year to get extensions and those on retirement visa just need to attend once per year 

So a hundred or so in Chiang Mai - that still seems a long way short of a hundred thousand or more - still, it's unlikely anyone will ever know for sure and we're all guessing based on snapshots. The visa runners will have been kept happy, though .

[Fluke]

6 minutes ago, Stonker said:

So a hundred or so in Chiang Mai - that still seems a long way short of a hundred thousand or more - still, it's unlikely anyone will ever know for sure and we're all guessing based on snapshots. The visa runners will have been kept happy, though .

That is just on one day , times that by five days (200 people)  = 1000 and times that by eight weeks and you get 8000 people on Covid extensions 

[Stonker]

Just now, Fluke said:

That is just on one day , times that by five days (200 people)  = 1000 and times that by eight weeks and you get 8000 people on Covid extensions 

But as those on them have said, several times, the maths doesn't work that way as the extensions are all concentrated by now due to past cut off dates and the need to meet the cut off date whether your extension was one day or fifty days after the cut off date. 

As I said we're all guessing.

[Faz]

24 minutes ago, Stonker said:

They'd have to re-apply at much the same time to meet cut-off dates, even if their own extension date was later, as those on them have said here.

I don't know how you reach that conclusion.

Foreigners have to apply for the extensions subject to their current permission of stay dates, not at the end of the cut off application dates. Immigration won't process them to far in advance, usually 7-14 days.

[Fluke]

18 minutes ago, Stonker said:

But as those on them have said, several times, the maths doesn't work that way as the extensions are all concentrated by now due to past cut off dates and the need to meet the cut off date whether your extension was one day or fifty days after the cut off date. 

As I said we're all guessing.

The cut off date was on Friday , I was at immigration on the Tuesday and Wednesday , I expect that Thursday and Friday would have seen more people there applying for extensions 

[Faz]

13 minutes ago, Stonker said:

But as those on them have said, several times, the maths doesn't work that way as the extensions are all concentrated by now due to past cut off dates and the need to meet the cut off date whether your extension was one day or fifty days after the cut off date. 

That isn't how it works Stonker.

If I currently had a Covid extension until 20th December, it's extremely doubtful and I know for sure at my Immigration office, they wouldn't grant a further extension before the end of this month, they'd advise to come 7 days before, e.g 13th December.
Any further extension would also be dated to the 20th of a future month.

Immigration offices must be receiving 100's of Covid extension applications daily and in 60 day cycles.
It's not just tourists taking advantage, there are thousands of long term stayers taking advantage as well.

 

[oldschooler]

Pragmatically, and supplemental to the Faz explanation, the Covid Extention is the ONLY way for Immigration to systematically control perhaps 50-80,000 foreigners choosing to stay here long term without Longstay Visa / Extention.

Govt. simply cant have this huge number of foreigners at large here and on computer as overstay ! Eventually, they would turn up at Border Exits and have to be banned for 1-5 years from returning here…big loss of income for thailand from people loving the place, and inhumane if having family here.

Glad to see that the minority “just go home” crowd here have been politely told to wind their necks in……

Some of us here have no “home” except here, with high value properties, businesses, families, transport, etc.here, and in any case are staying legally here. Certainly on that basis we have earned also the moral right to settle or be based here.

We all have the option to get here Longstay Visas, either direct / with financials, or via Agents at low cost / no financials, or Covid Extention direct.