News Forum - Private sector expresses fear over Covid surge if alcohol ban lifted in Bangkok

[LoongFred]

14 hours ago, JohninDubin said:

I am looking forward to the days when TH reopens including the bars, but the last thing I am going to do is try to further my own agenda or criticise the use of caution.

There are two conflicting views here, and I have to assume that both are driven by money. On the one hand are the bar owners etc who are eager to re-open. On the other hand there are the non-alcohol businesses who don't want to see any of the gains from the lockdown, lost to lack of control through alcohol. Once the genie is out of the bottle, it is difficult to put it back. I think the sensible thing to do, would be to trial the reopening of bars in a controlled environment such as Phuket or KS, and if there is an outbreak of CV, the epidemiology can be studied and further decisions can be taken.

There has already been an outbreak in KS, almost three months to the day. Have bar owners learned anything from that to prevent further out breaks? Since that time, vaxxing has increased from 5% full and 19% partials, to 42/17% respectively. At least that should give us an idea of how effective the vax is.

The bar environment will certainly cause problems, but the response may be delayed. A vaxed patron may get a asymptomatic or light infection, but pass it on to others. Not wise in my opinion.

[JohninDublin]

25 minutes ago, LoongFred said:

The bar environment will certainly cause problems, but the response may be delayed. A vaxed patron may get a asymptomatic or light infection, but pass it on to others. Not wise in my opinion.

And no doubt your opinion is totally unimpaired by your stated dislike of bar patrons?

[gummy]

5 minutes ago, JohninDubin said:

And no doubt your opinion is totally unimpaired by your stated dislike of bar patrons?

It is often the case that those that previously supported those establishments are their own worst enemy attempting to deny their past. Much like some smokers maybe, as they may have lost the urge for nicotine but their urge for hypocrisy endures. so hence the bar crawlers of the past become the puritanical  loud mouths of the present.

[JohninDublin]

27 minutes ago, gummy said:

It is often the case that those that previously supported those establishments are their own worst enemy attempting to deny their past. Much like some smokers maybe, as they may have lost the urge for nicotine but their urge for hypocrisy endures. so hence the bar crawlers of the past become the puritanical  loud mouths of the present.

In fairness to @LoongFredit is possible that a new wave might be triggered by this, and you have to wonder whether much of his unstated comment is about sex-tourism in particular.

I recall reading that 2/3rds of the tourist economy is dependent on sex tourism, which in turn is about 12% of GDP. Thus it becomes almost inevitable that the bars will re-open at some time. I just hope than when they do, the make a better job of it than Black Bamboo did.

[LoongFred]

1 hour ago, JohninDubin said:

In fairness to @LoongFredit is possible that a new wave might be triggered by this, and you have to wonder whether much of his unstated comment is about sex-tourism in particular.

I recall reading that 2/3rds of the tourist economy is dependent on sex tourism, which in turn is about 12% of GDP. Thus it becomes almost inevitable that the bars will re-open at some time. I just hope than when they do, the make a better job of it than Black Bamboo did.

The closer the contact plus the length of engagement plus of course viral load are the factors that increase spread. 

Having a degree of immunity may protect but you can still get the virus and help it spread.

I could go into great detail about infectious disease but most here wouldn't be interested.

I admit that I'm not into the bar/pub culture. I do enjoy a beer but mostly at home with friends, but this is far from a regular occurrences (beer) but friends regularly visit. 

[JohninDublin]

3 hours ago, LoongFred said:

The closer the contact plus the length of engagement plus of course viral load are the factors that increase spread. 

Having a degree of immunity may protect but you can still get the virus and help it spread.

I could go into great detail about infectious disease but most here wouldn't be interested.

I admit that I'm not into the bar/pub culture. I do enjoy a beer but mostly at home with friends, but this is far from a regular occurrences (beer) but friends regularly visit. 

I think we all understand the risk vectors. The problem is that if your dislike is really about sex-tourists and they don't arrive because the bars remain closed, sooner or later with them accounting for an estimated 12% of GDP, the bars will reopen.

That's why I suggested that maybe a reopening in a controlled environment such as Phuket of KS might give an idea of what the real risks, especially as vaxxing has ramped up so much in since the Black Bamboo out-break.

[RobMuir]

4 minutes ago, JohninDubin said:

sex-tourists and they don't arrive because the bars remain closed, sooner or later with them accounting for an estimated 12% of GDP, the bars will reopen

Sex tourists make up 12% of GDP?.

Nah 

[RobMuir]

20 hours ago, JohninDubin said:

trial the reopening of bars in a controlled environment such as Phuket or KS, and if there is an outbreak of CV, the epidemiology can be studied and further decisions can be taken.

I be would be more worried about Aids, herpes, hepatitis, syphallis etc in those bars than getting covid which is mostly curable.

[JohninDublin]

9 minutes ago, RobMuir said:

Sex tourists make up 12% of GDP?.

Nah 

That was an estimate made by the London School of Economics. They tend to be pretty good at studying models and making estimates.

[JohninDublin]

6 minutes ago, RobMuir said:

I be would be more worried about Aids, herpes, hepatitis, syphallis etc in those bars than getting covid which is mostly curable.

To each, his own. But I think you'll find that the incidence of these diseases are often grossly exaggerated in TH.  

[RobMuir]

11 minutes ago, JohninDubin said:

That was an estimate made by the London School of Economics. They tend to be pretty good at studying models and making estimates.

Nah

[Pi_Tim]

On 10/28/2021 at 2:44 PM, Soidog said:

Are all the bars and nightclubs open and selling alcohol in Phuket now? If so, when did this happen as it will take a week or two to see any change in numbers. 

My friends are going out every day since one week at least

You are right, let s see a week more to evaluate the impact

[LoongFred]

On 10/29/2021 at 4:27 PM, JohninDubin said:

And no doubt your opinion is totally unimpaired by your stated dislike of bar patrons?

That could be part of it, but the other is having uninhibited people in very close environments for extended times.

[JohninDublin]

4 hours ago, LoongFred said:

That could be part of it, but the other is having uninhibited people in very close environments for extended times.

Of course! Why didn't I think of that? Who knew you were so concerned for others?

OTOH, there is your stated dislike for "barflies". Oh well. At least CV can be used as an alibi for your altruism.