News Forum - Chinese entrepreneurs betting on real estate ahead of reopening

[Thaiger]

Thailand’s scheduled reopening is just around the corner, and Chinese entrepreneurs have already begun placing bets on prized real estate. Some are plowing money into acquiring hotels, land, and other properties with record-low prices, thanks to the Covid-19 pandemic. Nancy Chen, a Fujian native, joins the growing number of Chinese who have decided to take a chance and invest in Thailand’s hotel business by taking over a Phuket hotel. “The most trying times will teach us more lessons than usual. … Starting up a business is a process to accumulate experience. We are starting small, and this hotel business will […]

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[Nobodysfriend]

Chinese entrepreneurs buying Hotels in Phuket / Thailand means that they count on the revival of chinese tourism .

Profit from low real estate prices for hotels , buy now , wait until chinese are allowed to travel again , promote the Hotel in chinese media , and get it packed with chinese tourists .

China is just 'round the corner from Thailand and chinese will definitely like to holiday in the warm thai climate again .

Not a bad bet , it just depends on when the chinese will be able to travel internationally again ...

[EdwardV]

Zero dollar tourism will be alive and well, just waiting for their compatriots to return. 4th quarter 2022? 

[Poolie]

43 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

Zero dollar tourism will be alive and well, just waiting for their compatriots to return. 4th quarter 2022? 

That's why the Thai's want them back see?

Zero dollar tourism, remember that? 2005 revisited.

[Faz]

Post and replies have been removed.

[Faz]

Further replies posted whilst moderator busy removing other replies have now also been removed.

[AlexPTY]

44 minutes ago, Poolie said:

That's why the Thai's want them back see?

Zero dollar tourism, remember that? 2005 revisited.

Correct, zero dollar scheme is a standard model for the group tours and Thailand doesn't seem to learn the lessons from the past

[Bob20]

Any business is set up to make money and will to some extent benefit the community. Even though here it will be mostly hard work for as little pay as the employer can get away with. Gosh, even Apple and Google with big tax evasion schemes contribute. But not remotely enough in proportion.

The 49% rule, as far as I know, is for private residences with regard to condo-buildings. I believe you can setup or takeover a business if you invest enough and employ enough Thais. 

My point was more that the Chinese tend to stick together and more Chinese hotels would just be a place to keep things amongst themselves, the money concentrated and few Thais benefitting.

Not even because of Covid, but almost anywhere I make it a point to choose independent places to go to. Whether it is to stay or to eat or to buy things, rather than a large company raking in the cash and paying a pittance to the workers. 

The Chinese are obviously looking for good business opportunities before the prices rise again and as such you can't fault them business-wise. I just don't think Thailand in general benefits from more Chinese dominance whether it is in business or politics.

Edited October 27, 2021 by KaptainRob
Quote removed

[gummy]

If it is actually true that the Chinese are piling in buying hotels then how have they got round the Thai law of only allowing 49% Foreign ownership ?  Now the Chinese are world renowned as astute businessmen, unlike the elite/hiso Thais who rely on patronage/bribes to acquire wealth. The regular Thais, the normal ones, not the hiso elite will be employed by these hotels as they are now so no change for them, only much needed work. In fact as the Chinese may well adopt a more progressive business model their business will grow so hence more employment for locals. Remember the elite Thai give bribes and gifts in millions of baht annually to certain people, the Chinese will have none of that if it effects their business growth. All in all The Thai elite have brought it on themselves and it will be to the benefit of normal Thais far more than it is now. In my opinion anyway.

[KaptainRob]

8 minutes ago, gummy said:

If it is actually true that the Chinese are piling in buying hotels then how have they got round the Thai law of only allowing 49% Foreign ownership ?  Now the Chinese are world renowned as astute businessmen, unlike the elite/hiso Thais who rely on patronage/bribes to acquire wealth. The regular Thais, the normal ones, not the hiso elite will be employed by these hotels as they are now so no change for them, only much needed work. In fact as the Chinese may well adopt a more progressive business model their business will grow so hence more employment for locals. Remember the elite Thai give bribes and gifts in millions of baht annually to certain people, the Chinese will have none of that if it effects their business growth. All in all The Thai elite have brought it on themselves and it will be to the benefit of normal Thais far more than it is now. In my opinion anyway.

Chinese buy through a company structure 49/51% shareholding with a Thai/Chinese partner.

[gummy]

1 minute ago, KaptainRob said:

Chinese buy through a company structure 49/51% shareholding with a Thai/Chinese partner.

So same as any company then so thus they are a minority (49%) investor,. Did I mention nominees 

[Bob20]

3 minutes ago, gummy said:

So same as any company then so thus they are a minority (49%) investor,. Did I mention nominees 

Ah, thanks. Learned something. So the 49/51 ownership rule is for business too. I wonder how many successful rich foreigners are going to fall for that one Or does something different apply for those new rich ones they're targeting?

[KaptainRob]

4 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

Ah, thanks. Learned something. So the 49/51 ownership rule is for business too. I wonder how many successful rich foreigners are going to fall for that one Or does something different apply for those new rich ones they're targeting?

Yes, although it's intended use in residential development and ownership is being flouted by Chinese investors especially.  They are masters at using Cn agents, Cn/Th lawyers and setting up company structures which may look kosher upon cursory examination.  Many developments in CM are set up this way and properties advertised for short-term letting via social media as well as AirBnB.

[gummy]

2 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

Ah, thanks. Learned something. So the 49/51 ownership rule is for business too. I wonder how many successful rich foreigners are going to fall for that one Or does something different apply for those new rich ones they're targeting?

Its all about nominees, strictly illegal which was yet another thing the PM was going to stop but never did. When I started my company here several years ago now the first lawyers I saw explained it was normal practice, easy to do and quiet safe. Fortunately I did not consider having people who I did not know, owning on paper 51% of my company, a good idea, nor using that lawyer either. 

[Bob20]

28 minutes ago, gummy said:

Its all about nominees, strictly illegal which was yet another thing the PM was going to stop but never did. When I started my company here several years ago now the first lawyers I saw explained it was normal practice, easy to do and quiet safe. Fortunately I did not consider having people who I did not know, owning on paper 51% of my company, a good idea, nor using that lawyer either. 

 

28 minutes ago, KaptainRob said:

Yes, although it's intended use in residential development and ownership is being flouted by Chinese investors especially.  They are masters at using Cn agents, Cn/Th lawyers and setting up company structures which may look kosher upon cursory examination.  Many developments in CM are set up this way and properties advertised for short-term letting via social media as well as AirBnB.

Thank you both. 

Seems as dodgy as buying co-owned land to build your house. Decided not to do that and fortunately I'm not looking to set up shop here either  

[HolyCowCm]

Well just means that I have to try to dig in more to avoid buying anything, renting or staying anywhere they have bought into. I have been on a do not buy Chinese products campaign for a long time now, but some things are very hard to avoid. This massive Chinese buying spree is going to come back and bite Thailand in the rear end. It should be regulated, and not by brown envelopes or kowtowing to them..

[KaptainRob]

2 minutes ago, HolyCowCm said:

Well just means that I have to try to dig in more to avoid buying anything, renting or staying anywhere they have bought into. I have been on a do not buy Chinese products campaign for a long time now, but some things are very hard to avoid. This massive Chinese buying spree is going to come back and bite Thailand in the rear end. It should be regulated, and not by brown envelopes or kowtowing to them..

There's a lot of Thai's who aren't happy with the situation but you know how they are with confrontation. 

I recently advised local couples to a./ complain to The Hotel Association re blatant short-term lettings (plenty of ads on AirBnB - Chiang Mai ... look at the rents !!!!) and... b./ each time there's a rowdy party (which is frequent) to call the Police.  Luckily we have THE top cop living here so the RTP are quick to respond.

As to what will ultimately transpire ... probably 5/8th's of stuff all.

[Poolie]

5 minutes ago, KaptainRob said:

There's a lot of Thai's who aren't happy with the situation but you know how they are with confrontation. 

I recently advised local couples to a./ complain to The Hotel Association re blatant short-term lettings (plenty of ads on AirBnB - Chiang Mai ... look at the rents !!!!) and... b./ each time there's a rowdy party (which is frequent) to call the Police.  Luckily we have THE top cop living here so the RTP are quick to respond.

As to what will ultimately transpire ... probably 5/8th's of stuff all.

Who were your recent lets to? The rowdy ones? Can't have been Chinese as they haven't travelled for 18 months?

[HolyCowCm]

28 minutes ago, KaptainRob said:

There's a lot of Thai's who aren't happy with the situation but you know how they are with confrontation. 

I recently advised local couples to a./ complain to The Hotel Association re blatant short-term lettings (plenty of ads on AirBnB - Chiang Mai ... look at the rents !!!!) and... b./ each time there's a rowdy party (which is frequent) to call the Police.  Luckily we have THE top cop living here so the RTP are quick to respond.

As to what will ultimately transpire ... probably 5/8th's of stuff all.

Yeah the writing looks to be on the wall and a blind eye is going to be taken to it. You are correct as there needs to be some complaints to provide some substance of pushing back, but unfortunately once those gates open back up it is going to go back to the massive groups of them flooding back in. My daughter several years back was the night time manager of a condo building in CM near the airport vicinity (won't say what one) that had someone or a group buy too many condos there. Probably used a proxy, but the owners were in the mainland as was told. She speaks and writes Chinese but would literally come home and tell me stories of how noisy, pushy and boisterous and obnoxious some of these guests were. They used the condo just like a hotel so it was group after group after group non stop. If that was me owning  a unit there, I probably would have jumped out the window. Everything in moderation but with the Chinese there is none of that for the most of them. Not saying all, but from what I have observed most all act the same. Thank Buddha no Chinese bought a house in my area, but before Covid you would see them in every crevice and even near my area cruising around. They have literally ruined my home town in the USA, but they do have that buying power coming from the millions of millionaires of them out of the billions of people. I am one of not really wanting to see too many of any one race in one place at one time including Americans, well except for Thai people that is. Lovely bunch and why I stay here..

[Bob20]

3 minutes ago, HolyCowCm said:

Yeah the writing looks to be on the wall and a blind eye is going to be taken to it. You are correct as there needs to be some complaints to provide some substance of pushing back, but unfortunately once those gates open back up it is going to go back to the massive groups of them flooding back in. My daughter several years back was the night time manager of a condo building in CM near the airport vicinity (won't say what one) that had someone are a group buy too many condos there. Probably used a proxy, but the owners were in the mainland as was told. She speaks and writes Chinese but would literally come home and tell me stories of how noisy, pushy and boisterous and obnoxious some of these guests were. They used the condo just like a hotel so it was group after group after group non stop. If that was me owning  a unit there, I probably would have jumped out the window. Everything in moderation but with the Chinese there is none of that for the most of them. Not saying all, but from what I have observed most all act the same. Thank Buddha no Chinese bought a house in my area, but before Covid you would see them in every crevice and even near my area cruising around. They have literally ruined my home town in the USA, but they do have that buying power coming from the millions of millionaires of them out of the billions of people. I am one of not really wanting to see too many of any one race in one place at one time including Americans, well except for Thai people that is. Lovely bunch and why I stay here..

Remember they're not all like that.

It's the same as saying all Brits are loud fighting drunks, just because of what you see in Benidorm pubs... Parts of Thailand are like Benidorm for the Chinese. Not too far and cheap and it attracts a certain type.

There is a reason the CCP are trying to educate their citizens with leaflets at airports before they travel as it's embarrassing for the whole nation.

Unfortunately, not many seem to take notice yet.

[HolyCowCm]

2 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

Remember they're not all like that.

It's the same as saying all Brits are loud fighting drunks, just because of what you see in Benidorm pubs... Parts of Thailand are like Benidorm for the Chinese. Not too far and cheap and it attracts a certain type.

There is a reason the CCP are trying to educate their citizens with leaflets at airports before they travel as it's embarrassing for the whole nation.

Unfortunately, not many seem to take notice yet.

Didn't say all, but when they are in groups then pretty close to probably all. But BTW, I have noticed a bit of a change for the better for how they act in their younger generation. Benidorm? You mean like CM? : (

[Bob20]

6 minutes ago, HolyCowCm said:

Didn't say all, but when they are in groups then pretty close to probably all. But BTW, I have noticed a bit of a change for the better for how they act in their younger generation. Benidorm? You mean like CM? : (

I have Chinese friends. Polite and pleasant. But sure, I don't mind the obnoxious ones not being here. 

And yes, some tourgroups in CM are similar to the Benidorm crowd. But it's not just the Chinese, they simply are higher in number.