News Forum - Tourism Minister proposes reopening entertainment venues November 1

[Soidog]

5 hours ago, RobMuir said:

So it is better here.

You complain a lot mate.

Harden up.

Better in what way? The fact the Thai authorities tried to keep Covid to zero by locking the country down and harming the economy and its people?  That was easy to do. Anyone could do that. Let’s do nothing, isolate and stop anyone coming in. At the same time provided little or no support to business and workers laid off or had no income. Then, after a year of lockdown, they finally got their head around how a virus works; especially in a country with hundreds of kilometres of porous land borders. Now, in a desperate last roll of the dice they are opening up some of the most dangerous environments for the virus to spread in bars and clubs. This virus isn’t finished yet. This pandemic isn’t over. Let’s leave the judgements a little longer. Any comparisons and decisions over who handled the pandemic best needs to cast a bigger net than simple case numbers and deaths. To do that totally misunderstands the damage this pandemic has caused through the world. 
 

The good news however is the vaccines developed in western countries  are arriving , the western countries who you seem so eager to criticise its people. 

[Benroon]

8 hours ago, RobMuir said:

Well I just at the facts. Looks you still haven't got over his comments about the farangers refusing to wear masks in Thailand during a pandemic.

Let's compare the UK and Thailand with similar populations.

uK dead 139,461

Thai dead. 18,699

uK death rate 2,040

Thai death rate. 267

And let's not forget the numbers were extremely low in Thailand before the British Alpha strain showed up here. A strain that mutated because of the high numbers in the UK despite all the denials.

Unfortunately Thailand were a bit slow to get vaccines that went to countries who has a much more urgent need. 

And the farangers like to float about their superior vaccine rollouts, but they are not proving to be that effective and the silver bullet they promised. The other measures were.

Time to get over it and admit he was correct by saying the way the farangers behave will and has caused a big spread of covid and this has killed millions.

Yesterday new cases 

uK 44,577

Thai 9,744

And finally deaths yesterday in heavily vaccinated

 UK 135

Thailand 74

Anutin was on the money last March, that's for sure.

Some people are blinded by their anti Thai everything bias and ignore facts and statistics.

"Unfortunately Thailand were a bit slow in getting vaccines"

lol you think ? I didn't need to read past that

Your love of the junta is making you look a fool - but then perhaps you know better than the thais ? and there you were complaining about other peoples sense of entitlement ! 

Yet another post where you daren't go near the word 'testing' - give us some 'facts and statistics' on that ...

 

[Benroon]

8 hours ago, RobMuir said:

So it is better here.

You complain a lot mate.

Harden up.

Is it 10 times better ? Or did you just make that up ?

Yes or No is fine

Oh, there is a big difference between anti-thai and anti military dictatorship - try to work on that.

[RobMuir]

2 hours ago, Benroon said:

Your love of the junta is making you look a fool - but then perhaps you know better than the thais ?

I don't love or like the junta. But I am not going to complain about covid, because they haven't done a bad job compared to most other countries.

And Anutin WAS right in his comments that the damn farangs wouldn't be told, they would get infected and advised Thais to be wary of them. I listened to him and managed to avoid getting infected. My brother was in the USA, listened to trump saying masks were not necessary etc and he got it. 

Anutin was wrong to give his votes to prayut after the election giving them power, but that is a seperate issue.

Farangers complaining about covid in Thailand is like us complaining that Thailand is too cold, or that Thais are too fat. 

[RobMuir]

4 hours ago, Soidog said:

The good news however is the vaccines developed in western countries  are arriving , the western countries who you seem so eager to criticise its people. 

Thailand exports Astra Zenaca to other countries. 

Those vaccines are not looking very effective. 

[RobMuir]

4 hours ago, Soidog said:

Better in what way?

About 121,000 extra dead in the UK might agree with me.

4 hours ago, Soidog said:

The fact the Thai authorities tried to keep Covid to zero by locking the country down and harming the economy and its people?

I am from Melbourne mate. Locked down more than here. Factories and most other businesses didn't close at all here, not like in the UK, Australia etc.

Thailand has not racked up 5% of the debt that Euro or Australia has. Who do you think pays for the big handouts? The taxpayer with interest.

Merkel is one of the only ones who has fessed up, saying this covid debt will take 60 years to pay back. 

The Thais have just toughed it out and will end up in front without austerity measures for decades to come.

Clever and tough people the Thais. They don't fall for the lefty fiscal policies weak politicians introduced to prop up their chances of being reelected. $750 per person per week in Oz for months on end. Now it has to be paid back. That's what all these bleeding heart leftys don't realise. They think money grows on trees.

[Soidog]

38 minutes ago, RobMuir said:

About 121,000 extra dead in the UK might agree with me.

I am from Melbourne mate. Locked down more than here. Factories and most other businesses didn't close at all here, not like in the UK, Australia etc.

Thailand has not racked up 5% of the debt that Euro or Australia has. Who do you think pays for the big handouts? The taxpayer with interest.

Merkel is one of the only ones who has fessed up, saying this covid debt will take 60 years to pay back. 

The Thais have just toughed it out and will end up in front without austerity measures for decades to come.

Clever and tough people the Thais. They don't fall for the lefty fiscal policies weak politicians introduced to prop up their chances of being reelected. $750 per person per week in Oz for months on end. Now it has to be paid back. That's what all these bleeding heart leftys don't realise. They think money grows on trees.

You keep talking of lefties. You are obviously well informed about left wing people. I tend to keep well clear of them. 
 

You are right in that money doesn’t grow on trees and any loans will need to be paid back. Fortunately for Thailand they keep much of their people just above the poverty line and so they expect little from the government. Equally, the U.K. GDP will ensure that the loans which have been used to support its people are paid back without the need to cut services. 

[Soidog]

2 hours ago, RobMuir said:

Thailand exports Astra Zenaca to other countries. 

Those vaccines are not looking very effective. 

Yes, Thailand manufactures vaccines designed and developed in the U.K. It does this just as it builds Toyota cars. Thailand is a workshop where products designed and developed in more advanced countries are built. 
 

The AZ vaccine is looking very good. Not sure where you get your data from which would suggest otherwise, or perhaps you don’t understand the role of vaccines in this pandemic? 

[RobMuir]

12 minutes ago, Soidog said:

Equally, the U.K. GDP will ensure that the loans which have been used to support its people are paid back without the need to cut services

Yeah sure mate. 

That's how it works in lefty fantasy world. Which is impossible. £382 billion + interest paid back would make any difference. It shocks me how many people are unaware of the situation.

However- 

"the cross-party reports published on Sunday, the PAC said the taxpayer would be exposed to "significant financial risks for decades to come" 

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-57958178

 

 

[Soidog]

1 minute ago, RobMuir said:

Yeah sure mate. 

That's how it works in lefty fantasy world. Which is impossible. £382 billion + interest paid back would make any difference. It shocks me how many people are unaware of the situation.

However- 

"the cross-party reports published on Sunday, the PAC said the taxpayer would be exposed to "significant financial risks for decades to come" 

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-57958178

Now I understand where you get your left wing issues. You shouldn’t always take what the BBC says as anything other than left wing agenda. 
 

By the way. I’m not interested in arguing and exchanging silly comments. If you wish to stay calm and polite I will discuss with you. However I sense you are frustrated by something and getting a little agitated. 

[RobMuir]

21 minutes ago, Soidog said:

Yes, Thailand manufactures vaccines designed and developed in the U.K

It is the only one I would refuse. I would rather take my chances with covid. It ain't worth the risk  

https://celebrity.nine.com.au/latest/melle-stewart-icu-after-stroke-astrazeneca/a80810a6-2d89-45ae-9c98-b95e08adbb2f

[RobMuir]

6 minutes ago, Soidog said:

I’m not interested in arguing

I am not arguing with you.

I am telling you. 

And I have provided links that back up what I am telling you.

What you are saying is based on wishful thinking.

[Soidog]

12 minutes ago, RobMuir said:

It is the only one I would refuse. I would rather take my chances with covid. It ain't worth the risk  

https://celebrity.nine.com.au/latest/melle-stewart-icu-after-stroke-astrazeneca/a80810a6-2d89-45ae-9c98-b95e08adbb2f

Ok up to you as they say. Good luck and hope you stay safe with Covid. 

[Marc26]

2 hours ago, RobMuir said:

 

The Thais have just toughed it out and will end up in front without austerity measures for decades to come.

Clever and tough people the Thais. They don't fall for the lefty fiscal policies weak politicians introduced to prop up their chances of being reelected. $750 per person per week in Oz for months on end. Now it has to be paid back. That's what all these bleeding heart leftys don't realise. They think money grows on trees.

An extremely good point

Does anyone know Thais that are in really bad shape because of covid?

Like don't have food to eat or lost their houses?

 

I personally don't, over a wide range of Thai demographics

 

That is in no way saying people aren't hurting...........there are many that are.

But in Thai resilience and being able to relay on family, coupled with the fact they can make a little go a long way...............I haven't seen too many totally desperate situations

 

Other people may have...........I am just saying personally I haven't seen it

[Soidog]

9 minutes ago, RobMuir said:

I am not arguing with you.

I am telling you. 

And I have provided links that back up what I am telling you.

What you are saying is based on wishful thinking.

I think we should agree to disagree. 

[vlad]

Sorry few pointers Rob here in the UK we were locked down the only reason you were permitted to leave your home was for food and Doctor Visits, the only shops open were for Food all others were closed. We were only allowed to travel to work if you were in support of essential work like Food delivery, medicines, refuse collection if you were caught outside without a good reason you were fined. Most people were Furlough'd.  The UK Goverment stumped up Millions to pay Employee's 80% of there wages so people did not struggle financially. How did the Thai Government help all there staff who were made jobless through factories's, shops, restaurants, and all Entertainment venues closing. We began the vaccine roll out as soon as we given the green light from our top Scientist's to use a top vaccine like A/Z or Moderna. Agaim what did the Thai PM do he instructed his advisors to use a vaccine that most other country's refused to accept and only now has he Acknowledged the Sinovac Chinese vaccine is inadequate to halt and fight Covid 19. Most country's have vaccinated 60 -70 % double jabbed and in the UK we are well on the way with Booster jabs. Were still having 50 thousand cases daily here in the UK mostly from 16 and under School Children and a plan B for a restriction of Covid rising numbers is on the way if needed. How can he possibly be thinking of opening up on Nov 1 when he is still receiving vaccines Donated from other country's due to poor vaccinations Thailand has given to there population. You are lucky if 50% have been given  a reputable 2nd Dose let alone 80% needed for opening anything up.

[vlad]

2 minutes ago, vlad said:

Sorry few pointers Rob here in the UK we were locked down the only reason you were permitted to leave your home was for food and Doctor Visits, the only shops open were for Food all others were closed. We were only allowed to travel to work if you were in support of essential work like Food delivery, medicines, refuse collection if you were caught outside without a good reason you were fined. Most people were Furlough'd.  The UK Goverment stumped up Millions to pay Employee's 80% of there wages so people did not struggle financially. How did the Thai Government help all there staff who were made jobless through factories's, shops, restaurants, and all Entertainment venues closing. We began the vaccine roll out as soon as we given the green light from our top Scientist's to use a top vaccine like A/Z or Moderna. Agaim what did the Thai PM do he instructed his advisors to use a vaccine that most other country's refused to accept and only now has he Acknowledged the Sinovac Chinese vaccine is inadequate to halt and fight Covid 19. Most country's have vaccinated 60 -70 % double jabbed and in the UK we are well on the way with Booster jabs. Were still having 50 thousand cases daily here in the UK mostly from 16 and under School Children and a plan B for a restriction of Covid rising numbers is on the way if needed. How can he possibly be thinking of opening up on Nov 1 when he is still receiving vaccines Donated from other country's due to poor vaccinations Thailand has given to there population. You are lucky if 50% have been given  a reputable 2nd Dose let alone 80% needed for opening anything up.

Who cares about paying back what you Borrowed Rob it saved peoples live's ans saved the Economy and more importantly people were able to return to there jobs. Some were lost but its better than losing 50-60% of your workforce.

[RobMuir]

10 minutes ago, Marc26 said:

Like don't have food to eat or lost their houses?

Everyone has food to eat. I know one woman who has lost her house officially to the bank. She had 11 pharmacies employing 22 people in Phuket. She lasted a year not thinking it would go on for more than a few months like most people at the time were saying.

The good news is the banks have been ordered by the government not to kick people out and the courts are not hearing the cases currently.

So, she is still in her house and if she can prove that she can get back in her feet again when covid is finally over the bank will refinance.

I know another bloke with three green plated cars for hire with driver for tourists. The bank has also allowed him to stop payments until he gets back on his feet.

It is a sensible solution. They are clever these Thais, sensible and practible.

I know another woman who has lost the lot, but she was struggling before covid.

A lot of the handouts in the west have wasted taxpayers money propping up businesses that were doomed anyway and businesses that didn't need assistance. The blanket assistance was a huge waste of money that will take decades to pay back with interest. By the taxpayers. Most of them haven't realised yet. It is a big bill. Expect the baht to go up against western currencies when this is over.

[RobMuir]

13 minutes ago, vlad said:

Sorry few pointers Rob here in the UK we were locked down the only reason you were permitted to leave your home was for food and Doctor Visits, the only shops open were for Food all others were closed. We were only allowed to travel to work if you were in support of essential work like Food delivery, medicines, refuse collection if you were caught outside without a good reason you were fined. Most people were Furlough'd.  The UK Goverment stumped up Millions to pay Employee's 80% of there wages so people did not struggle financially. How did the Thai Government help all there staff who were made jobless through factories's, shops, restaurants, and all Entertainment venues closing. We began the vaccine roll out as soon as we given the green light from our top Scientist's to use a top vaccine like A/Z or Moderna. Agaim what did the Thai PM do he instructed his advisors to use a vaccine that most other country's refused to accept and only now has he Acknowledged the Sinovac Chinese vaccine is inadequate to halt and fight Covid 19. Most country's have vaccinated 60 -70 % double jabbed and in the UK we are well on the way with Booster jabs. Were still having 50 thousand cases daily here in the UK mostly from 16 and under School Children and a plan B for a restriction of Covid rising numbers is on the way if needed. How can he possibly be thinking of opening up on Nov 1 when he is still receiving vaccines Donated from other country's due to poor vaccinations Thailand has given to there population. You are lucky if 50% have been given  a reputable 2nd Dose let alone 80% needed for opening anything up.

And the daily deaths are still higher in the UK more than Thailand. 

80% of wages paid is crazy. Because you have to pay it back with interest.

Nobody has starved to death in Thailand. 

As I said the factories here stayed open. Most of the shops, restaurants outside tourist areas  etc were also open until that nasty UK mutant strain showed up here. That caught them off guard, and then they got smashed again with Delta.

If England and India had a kept a lid on it in 2020 like Thailand successfully did then it is probable those strains would not have mutated or existed.

I blame the liars in China, the Karens in England and the situation in India for the mess the Thais are in now. Not the Thais.

Yet we have people from England on this forum criticizing Thailand and gloating that the UK are doing a better job even though still more are dying in the UK than in Thailand. 

Can you imagine the criticism on this forum if a highly contagious mutant variant had of developed in Thailand and killed thousands in England and spread across the globe?

 

[vlad]

Do you honestly believe Prayut and his Government has done a brilliant job handling the Pandemic Rob ? As you like statistics ask how many are donating food in Temples up and down the country  because people are starving, and while your looking them up look for the suicide rates. Nobody is having a go at Thailand Rob what people who are having a go at is the People like TAT and other bodies blatantly telling lies and trying to pull the wool over our eyes. How can you blame the UK for allowing inter travel and spreading the virus throughout Thailand for Songkran ? and lastly are we getting the blame for Hi SO's bringing Illegal migrant Burmese workers in knowing full well they will spread the virus and exploiting them. i won't bring up the murderer who collected all the flash cars through curruption on a coppers salary. Explain that.

[Soidog]

5 hours ago, RobMuir said:

Can you imagine the criticism on this forum if a highly contagious mutant variant had of developed in Thailand and killed thousands in England and spread across the globe?

Sorry Rob but you are confusing detection of variants with the source of variants. The U.K. detected the B.1.1.7 in Kent first, as the U.K. is a world leading genome sequencing centre. There is no evidence to show the initial or original mutation took place in Kent and spread outward. It could just have easily come from Italy, Germany or many other countries. You may also recall a few months ago, the same U.K. genomic sequencing capabilities detected a variant which they believed originated in Thailand. Following complaints from the Thai authorities, the term “Thai variant” was removed. 
 

The point is that there is little to no point in trying to “blame” any country for variants which may or may not have originated in their country. This is a global pandemic which needs everyone to get in the boat and row, not point fingers. 
 

The criticisms I’ve posited regarding Thailands handling of the pandemic relate to lack of support to individuals and businesses. Not just to support the people directly, but to ensure those businesses are able to function after the pandemic. Other criticisms have been focused on the shambolic vaccine purchase, communications around reopening, estimated tourism numbers and requirements to enter Thailand. I make these comments in this forum as this is a Thailand focused forum. If it was about the U.K., US or another country, my focus would be on those countries and I’m sure I would find plenty of shortcomings around the handling of the pandemic. 
 

If you wish to have a debate about which country performs better on a particular issue, then please start a topic and start a healthy debate. 

[RobMuir]

7 hours ago, vlad said:

Do you honestly believe Prayut and his Government has done a brilliant job handling the Pandemic Rob ?

Not brilliant, but better than most faranger countries who let Karens roam and spread.

7 hours ago, vlad said:

 

 

As you like statistics ask how many are donating food in Temples up and down the country  because people are starving

Nobody is starving. People can't pay the bills but nobody is starving. If you know someone who actually is I will send them some food.

7 hours ago, vlad said:

 

, and while your looking them up look for the suicide rates. Nobody is having a go at Thailand Rob what people who are having a go at is the People like TAT and other bodies blatantly telling lies and trying to pull the wool over our eyes.

TAT are often misrepresented in the English media because people get worked up about it. For decades they have been successfully enticing people to Thailand creating millions of jobs for Thais and lifting millions  Burmese, Cambodians and Laotians out of poverty. 

7 hours ago, vlad said:

 

How can you blame the UK for allowing inter travel and spreading the virus throughout Thailand for Songkran ? and lastly are we getting the blame for Hi SO's bringing Illegal migrant Burmese workers in

You have your stories mixed up. The highso covid spread was a hiso nightclub. There were also hookers crossing the border and putting it on Facebook.

7 hours ago, vlad said:

 

 knowing full well they will spread the virus and exploiting them. i won't bring up the murderer who collected all the flash cars through curruption on a coppers salary. Explain that.

The copper got his flash cars by seizing illegal imports where he was legally paid 30% commission for doing it. Plus other businesses such as bird nests. Plus extorting drug dealer scum with plastic bags. Not from his coppers salary.

Public servants are paid low wages here. So they are not a burden on the taxpayers. But they are given opportunities to earn in other ways. I favor low taxes and a user pays system. I think it is good.

[RobMuir]

4 hours ago, Soidog said:

There is no evidence to show the initial or original mutation took place in Kent and spread outward. It could just have easily come from Italy, Germany

Unfortunately for your theory they do backtracing. There is no doubt anymore that it originated in England, it simply want found anywhere else. 

That was the line trotted out by the Brits early on but it doesn't stack up despite you wanting to blame it on the Germans and Italians.

It is what it is.

The so called Thai strain was one Egyptian discovered in the Thai quarantine system (that the UK didn't have), no Thais actually ever had it so it was a valid point.  Secondly it didn't spread round the globe killing hundreds of thousands and forcing new lockdown. Nice bit of whataboutism though.

[vlad]

4 hours ago, RobMuir said:

Unfortunately for your theory they do backtracing. There is no doubt anymore that it originated in England, it simply want found anywhere else. 

That was the line trotted out by the Brits early on but it doesn't stack up despite you wanting to blame it on the Germans and Italians.

It is what it is.

The so called Thai strain was one Egyptian discovered in the Thai quarantine system (that the UK didn't have), no Thais actually ever had it so it was a valid point.  Secondly it didn't spread round the globe killing hundreds of thousands and forcing new lockdown. Nice bit of whataboutism though.

Rob i asked you if you are happy with the PM'S handling the Pandemic and did you think he is doing a good job of it ??.

[Soidog]

5 hours ago, RobMuir said:

Unfortunately for your theory they do backtracing. There is no doubt anymore that it originated in England, it simply want found anywhere else. 

That was the line trotted out by the Brits early on but it doesn't stack up despite you wanting to blame it on the Germans and Italians.

It is what it is.

The so called Thai strain was one Egyptian discovered in the Thai quarantine system (that the UK didn't have), no Thais actually ever had it so it was a valid point.  Secondly it didn't spread round the globe killing hundreds of thousands and forcing new lockdown. Nice bit of whataboutism though.

Ok @RobMuir you win. You get two gold stars.