News Forum - Covid-19 infected patients to receive vaccine after recovering

[Thaiger]

Covid-19 infected patients who have had at least 1 month to recover are now approved to get a Covid-19 vaccine. The Public Health Ministry says it will provide shots of AstraZeneca or Pfizer. Sophon Mekthon, assistant to the public health minister, announced the decision after a meeting on Tuesday. Those who have been infected that have yet to be vaccinated or who have received only 1 dose of a Covid-19 vaccine will be eligible for the shots, starting 1 month after they stop showing Covid-19 symptoms. However, those who are already fully vaccinated are not approved yet to receive a […]

The story Covid-19 infected patients to receive vaccine after recovering as seen on Thaiger News.

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[ThatGuy]

Well that's pretty smart to upset your immune system again with a totally unneeded jab. If you have had c19 and recovered you have a much better immunity than the one you get with the jabs.

Dangerous idea, just like the mix and match that only Thailand does.

[Lawyers_Guns_and_Money]

There is no evidence that recovering from covid provides future immunity. Antibody levels would need to be tested for each person who recovers which is not being done. The CDC would disagree with you on both of your opinions. They have stated that recovering from cv19 and getting the vaccination is the best option. Additionally, the US is days away from approving the mix and match approach.

Isn't learning fun!?!

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/faq.html?s_cid=10482:covid vaccine after having covid:sem.ga:p:RG:GM:gen:PTN:FY21

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/10/21/covid-delta-variant-live-updates/

[Malc-Thai]

1 minute ago, Lawyers_Guns_and_Money said:

There is no evidence that recovering from covid provides future immunity. Antibody levels would need to be tested for each person who recovers which is not being done. The CDC would disagree with you on both of your opinions. They have stated that recovering from cv19 and getting the vaccination is the best option. Additionally, the US is days away from approving the mix and match approach.

Isn't learning fun!?!

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/faq.html?s_cid=10482:covid vaccine after having covid:sem.ga:p:RG:GM:gen:PTN:FY21

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/10/21/covid-delta-variant-live-updates/

Just a thought. if you recovered from covid why do they only allow you to travell up to 3 months..unlike vaccinated..does that mean antibodies drop after 3 months

[ThatGuy]

8 minutes ago, Lawyers_Guns_and_Money said:

There is no evidence that recovering from covid provides future immunity.

There you go : Click

Natural immunity after infection is a lot better than the immunity you get from the vaccine. Don't forget the vaccine only supplies you with a specific part of the virus on which your immune system reacts. A real infection gives your immune system much more to work with.

A tip : don't be condescending if you don't know the subject. Thanks.

[Lawyers_Guns_and_Money]

11 minutes ago, Malc-Thai said:

Just a thought. if you recovered from covid why do they only allow you to travell up to 3 months..unlike vaccinated..does that mean antibodies drop after 3 months

Or there are no antibodies present. Impossible to know without antibody testing. It is an assumption that people who recover are immune from future infection. I have known several people who have gotten covid twice. 

[Lawyers_Guns_and_Money]

6 minutes ago, ThatGuy said:

There you go : Click

Natural immunity after infection is a lot better than the immunity you get from the vaccine. Don't forget the vaccine only supplies you with a specific part of the virus on which your immune system reacts. A real infection gives your immune system much more to work with.

A tip : don't be condescending if you don't know the subject. Thanks.

Site your source 

[BlueSphinx]

20 minutes ago, Lawyers_Guns_and_Money said:

There is no evidence that recovering from covid provides future immunity. Antibody levels would need to be tested for each person who recovers which is not being done. The CDC would disagree with you on both of your opinions. They have stated that recovering from cv19 and getting the vaccination is the best option. Additionally, the US is days away from approving the mix and match approach.

Isn't learning fun!?!

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/faq.html?s_cid=10482:covid vaccine after having covid:sem.ga:p:RG:GM:gen:PTN:FY21

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/10/21/covid-delta-variant-live-updates/

On page 23 of the latest PHE (Public Health England) weekly Covid Surveillance report it says “N antibody levels appear to be lower in people who acquire infection following two doses of vaccination.”

You can check it out here > https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1027511/Vaccine-surveillance-report-week-42.pdf

Yes, learning is fun...

[Lawyers_Guns_and_Money]

5 minutes ago, BlueSphinx said:

On page 23 of the latest PHE (Public Health England) weekly Covid Surveillance report it says “N antibody levels appear to be lower in people who acquire infection following two doses of vaccination.”

You can check it out here > https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1027511/Vaccine-surveillance-report-week-42.pdf

Yes, learning is fun...

...and the next paragraph states.

Vaccination has made an important contribution to the overall Roche S increases observed 
since the roll out of the vaccination programme, initially amongst individuals aged 50 years and 
above who were prioritised for vaccination as part of the phase 1 programme and more recently 
in younger adults as part of phase 2 of the vaccination programme.

[Malc-Thai]

11 minutes ago, Lawyers_Guns_and_Money said:

Or there are no antibodies present. Impossible to know without antibody testing. It is an assumption that people who recover are immune from future infection. I have known several people who have gotten covid twice. 

Yes had family members had covid twice badly within 3 months..they finally managed to get vaccinated 3 months after their second infection

[FloridaMiami]

1 hour ago, Lawyers_Guns_and_Money said:

Or there are no antibodies present. Impossible to know without antibody testing. It is an assumption that people who recover are immune from future infection. I have known several people who have gotten covid twice. 

If you had a Covid-19 infection then there are antibodies. If there are no antibodies then you had a different infection.

[Lawyers_Guns_and_Money]

3 minutes ago, FloridaMiami said:

If you had a Covid-19 infection then there are antibodies. If there are no antibodies then you had a different infection.

And you are making an assumption that those antibody levels would be sufficient to ward off future illness....in someone whose immune system allowed them to get sick to begin with.

[FloridaMiami]

1 hour ago, ThatGuy said:

There you go : Click

Natural immunity after infection is a lot better than the immunity you get from the vaccine. Don't forget the vaccine only supplies you with a specific part of the virus on which your immune system reacts. A real infection gives your immune system much more to work with.

A tip : don't be condescending if you don't know the subject. Thanks.

Exactly! After recovering from a Covid-19 infection you are much better protected than you would be with a vaccination of all available vaccines. There is a new research from Israel which clearly proves this.

[Bob20]

15 minutes ago, FloridaMiami said:

Exactly! After recovering from a Covid-19 infection you are much better protected than you would be with a vaccination of all available vaccines. There is a new research from Israel which clearly proves this.

 

16 minutes ago, Lawyers_Guns_and_Money said:

And you are making an assumption that those antibody levels would be sufficient to ward off future illness....in someone whose immune system allowed them to get sick to begin with.

 

1 hour ago, Malc-Thai said:

Yes had family members had covid twice badly within 3 months..they finally managed to get vaccinated 3 months after their second infection

 

1 hour ago, ThatGuy said:

There you go : Click

Natural immunity after infection is a lot better than the immunity you get from the vaccine. Don't forget the vaccine only supplies you with a specific part of the virus on which your immune system reacts. A real infection gives your immune system much more to work with.

A tip : don't be condescending if you don't know the subject. Thanks.

 

For your convenience, an overview:

Both unvaccinated and vaccinated people can catch the virus and pass it on to others.

Unvaccinated people are at much higher risk of severe illness or death from Covid19 (approx. 10 times higher). If they survive the infection, they have a 1 in 3 chance of suffering from long-Covid, something not completely understood, but varying from long-term light symptoms to very unpleasant and severe health issues. If an unvaccinated person recovers, they will have a level of natural immunity, but this wanes. This is why it is recommended that after 3-6 months they take the vaccine. If not, they roll the dice anew if they get infected again.

Vaccinated people (using a highly effective vaccine) are near 95% protected from severe illness or death from the Covid19 virus. The vaccine protection wanes as well, and that is why boosters are necessary. Vaccinated people also have only approx. half the chance (so 1 in 6) of developing long-Covid after an infection.

Measures that limit the spread of the virus are:
Facemasks (preventing infected persons from spreading mostly aerosole droplets high in viral load and prevent uninfected persons from breathing these in), hygiene (washing, disinfecting hands and surfaces to limit cross-infection), physical distancing (to reduce the chance to pass on the virus) and limiting movement (in order not to move the virus to other areas). None of the measures works perfectly, but altogether they contribute to limiting the problem.

For the above reasons it is incomprehensible that vaccines are apparently available and not used, but are then shipped to cluster areas. The already infected people will not immediately benefit from the vaccine and the people who are still in the clear will not have protection from the vaccine for a long time (until a few weeks after the second jab). It is therefore a mainly useless exercise.

Vaccine-supplies should instead be used immediately when available all over the country for those who wish to have them, because they are for prevention, not for treatment.

And while the country is nowhere near sufficiently protected, opening up will spread the virus. We already saw this happening after some limits on interprovincial travel were lifted. Having tourists (domestic or international) traveling all over, will cause the spread of the virus, just like at Songkran. It is not relevant that they start their trip with a negative PCR-test, as the virus can be picked up anywhere in Thailand and spread further.

This overview is a generalisation and does not intend to go into fractions of percentiles. It also does not take into account economic reasoning for taking risks. It is, however, correct as a guide from purely a health point of view.

 

[FloridaMiami]

6 minutes ago, Lawyers_Guns_and_Money said:

And you are making an assumption that those antibody levels would be sufficient to ward off future illness....in someone whose immune system allowed them to get sick to begin with.

Lol! What a nonsense! If you recovered from measles then first your immune system "allowed" to get sick but afterwards you're immune for lifetime. After a Covid-infection you're probably not immune for lifetime but neither you are with any of those vaccines which apparently are not very effective anyway

 

[Poolie]

And out come all the internet experts!

Reassuring.

[riclag]

37 minutes ago, FloridaMiami said:

Exactly! After recovering from a Covid-19 infection you are much better protected than you would be with a vaccination of all available vaccines. There is a new research from Israel which clearly proves this.

Using that country as a source for the the Covid studies is getting much push back by those who want to push their own agendas! Sad ! Experts vs Experts

 

[Malc-Thai]

39 minutes ago, FloridaMiami said:

Lol! What a nonsense! If you recovered from measles then first your immune system "allowed" to get sick but afterwards you're immune for lifetime. After a Covid-infection you're probably not immune for lifetime but neither you are with any of those vaccines which apparently are not very effective anyway

Unfortunately your body doesn't keep high levels of antibodies for every single infection you get.. your blood probably couldn't circulate being thick with so many different antibodies...that's where the memory cells come in (B cells), they trigger the body into reproducing the antibodies to fight that illness..  if you have previously had that infection  then your body will take time to identify and reproduce the antibodies needed.. if you have a vaccine and booster shots your body will keep a high level of antibodies ready to fight the infection a lot faster than having to reproduce them

[Jason]

I do think it's important that every opportunity to administer vaccines is availed of (to the maximum level that vaccines are available). In my own country, there might be 100,000 tests but only 30,000 vaccinations occurring in one day. Think about it....shouldn't the stats be around the other way. Which is more important? Testing or vaccination? It doesn't need to be a case of either or. Why not test and vaccinate at the same time? Both are administered by a medical practitioner (doctor or nurse). It certainly makes logistical sense.

[Bob20]

1 minute ago, Jason said:

I do think it's important that every opportunity to administer vaccines is availed of (to the maximum level that vaccines are available). In my own country, there might be 100,000 tests but only 30,000 vaccinations occurring in one day. Think about it....shouldn't the stats be around the other way. Which is more important? Testing or vaccination? It doesn't need to be a case of either or. Why not test and vaccinate at the same time? Both are administered by a medical practitioner (doctor or nurse). It certainly makes logistical sense.

See above

Because it takes time to get the results and those who test positive don't need to be vaccinated for 3-6 months. Those vaccines are better used for others first.

[ThatGuy]

4 hours ago, ThatGuy said:

There you go : Click

For some reason the link didn't copy : LINK

And i tried again but no, maybe because i am new here ? anyway a quick search on the subject will give you many answer to why natural immunity -after infection with c19- is a lot better than the immunity provided by your body in reaction to the mrna shot. 

Try duckduck.go instead of google for a more unbiased result. 

Edited October 22, 2021 by ThatGuy

[BlueSphinx]

5 hours ago, Lawyers_Guns_and_Money said:

5 hours ago, BlueSphinx said:

On page 23 of the latest PHE (Public Health England) weekly Covid Surveillance report it says “N antibody levels appear to be lower in people who acquire infection following two doses of vaccination.”

You can check it out here > https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1027511/Vaccine-surveillance-report-week-42.pdf

Yes, learning is fun...

Expand  

...and the next paragraph states.

Vaccination has made an important contribution to the overall Roche S increases observed 
since the roll out of the vaccination programme, initially amongst individuals aged 50 years and 
above who were prioritised for vaccination as part of the phase 1 programme and more recently 
in younger adults as part of phase 2 of the vaccination programme.

Here the graph which was already published in the week 40 PHE (Public Health England) Covid Surveillance Report.  Educate yourself about the difference between Roche S and Roche N, to understand the devastating consequences of what this means...

[Stonker]

On 10/22/2021 at 1:23 PM, Poolie said:

And out come all the internet experts!

Reassuring.

"internet experts"?

None here, on any side of the vax debate, noticed or remarked on this little gem in both the Thaiger article and the source report in the Phuket News:

On 10/22/2021 at 11:04 AM, Thaiger said:

The AstraZeneca and Pfizer vaccines are mRNA vaccines, which are believed to be more effective against the Delta variant that has spread throughout the country.

That should have struck anyone with even a minimal knowledge of Covid and vaccines like a sledgehammer between the legs