News Forum - Covid-19 pill treatment highly effective at preventing hospitalisation, death

[Thaiger]

A prominent Thai virologist says the world’s first oral treatment for Covid-19 is highly effective if taken within 5 days of symptoms developing. Dr Yong Poovorawan from the Centre of Excellence in Clinical Virology at Chulalongkorn University made the statement on his Facebook page yesterday. According to a Bangkok Post report, he was citing research published on the health sciences website, medRxiv. “Molnupiravir is the first oral, direct-acting antiviral shown to be highly effective at reducing nasopharyngeal SARS-CoV-2 infectious virus and viral RNA and has a favourable safety and tolerability profile.” Yong says the Molnupiravir pill, developed by pharmaceutical firm […]

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[Helmut]

Ivermectin has been proven very effective in India when taken early after symptoms … and cost is minimal.

Why not repeat the Indian experience?

 

[Bob20]

A manufacturer will hopefully publish honest information, but will most likely not show his product as "underperforming". So, while one Thai virologist calls it highly effective, I tend to believe the official figure of 50% effectiveness at the stage of mild or moderate Covid symptoms.

I am sceptical about the quoted price, as Merck is allowing 8 generic medication producers to produce Molnupiravir at a price level from $12 per course of treatment for more than 100 low and middle income countries, a category in which Thailand would likely fit. Have the GPO done a bad deal or are they providing it at an excessive markup?

[mickkotlarski]

This  is very good news but Merck Pharmaceuticals are a pack of rogues. The actual generic cost is US$17 but it is sold to the government. For US$728. This is a box of 10 tablets. Considering that the US government was the driving factor financing the development of Molnupiravir.

There are some very rich people now that present themselves as fighting Covid19 for humanity but I think that it is time for regulation even if Vaccines and pills are for emergency use.

[NCC1701A]

'According to a Bangkok Post report, he was citing research published on the health sciences website, medRxiv."

not doubting the effectiveness but it would be nice if this 'prominent Thai virologist"  had first hand experience he could report instead of copy and paste. because we all read about this two or three weeks ago. 

 

[Faraday]

26 minutes ago, Helmut said:

Ivermectin has been proven very effective in India when taken early after symptoms … and cost is minimal.

Why not repeat the Indian experience?

No money to be made unfortunately.

[Bob20]

1 hour ago, mickkotlarski said:

This  is very good news but Merck Pharmaceuticals are a pack of rogues. The actual generic cost is US$17 but it is sold to the government. For US$728. This is a box of 10 tablets. Considering that the US government was the driving factor financing the development of Molnupiravir.

There are some very rich people now that present themselves as fighting Covid19 for humanity but I think that it is time for regulation even if Vaccines and pills are for emergency use.

Not that it makes much difference to the principle, but you'll find that it was actually DRIVE owned by Emory university that profited from grants dating back to 2004 when research began into EIDD-2081, followed by a company named Ridgeback Biotherapeutics that purchased the license from DRIVE in march 2020. Since then Ridgeback sold the license for further development and production to Merck. And Merck had an advance order from the US government in September 2021 to supply the drug, but no further grants or development funding.

[AlexPTY]

3 hours ago, Thaiger said:

A prominent Thai virologist says

of cause, "a prominent" just gives it more credibility.. @Maya for the love of the God, use thesaurus once in a while please

[mickkotlarski]

4 hours ago, Bob20 said:

Not that it makes much difference to the principle, but you'll find that it was actually DRIVE owned by Emory university that profited from grants dating back to 2004 when research began into EIDD-2081, followed by a company named Ridgeback Biotherapeutics that purchased the license from DRIVE in march 2020. Since then Ridgeback sold the license for further development and production to Merck. And Merck had an advance order from the US government in September 2021 to supply the drug, but no further grants or development funding.

Correct. Ridgeback did get the ball rolling. 

[El_Trauco]

9 hours ago, Helmut said:

Ivermectin has been proven very effective in India when taken early after symptoms … and cost is minimal.

Why not repeat the Indian experience?

Because it's not proven. R0 in India was already declining prior to the guidelines including ivermectin. Peru recommended ivermectin for mild cases as early as  9 May 2020. They continued to suffer from repeat waves of COVID-19. Peru removed the recommendation in March 2021.

Reference here: https://healthfeedback.org/claimreview/no-data-available-to-suggest-a-link-between-indias-reduction-of-covid-19-cases-and-the-use-of-ivermectin-jim-hoft-gateway-pundit/

[Saunk]

American tax payer money funded the development of this drug.  the drug maker turns around and prices it at 40x the cost for Americans per cycle of treatment.  You can't make this stuff up. Always follow the money.

[Saunk]

10 hours ago, mickkotlarski said:

This  is very good news but Merck Pharmaceuticals are a pack of rogues. The actual generic cost is US$17 but it is sold to the government. For US$728. This is a box of 10 tablets. Considering that the US government was the driving factor financing the development of Molnupiravir.

There are some very rich people now that present themselves as fighting Covid19 for humanity but I think that it is time for regulation even if Vaccines and pills are for emergency use.

Well said sir.

[Saunk]

1 hour ago, El_Trauco said:

Because it's not proven. R0 in India was already declining prior to the guidelines including ivermectin. Peru recommended ivermectin for mild cases as early as  9 May 2020. They continued to suffer from repeat waves of COVID-19. Peru removed the recommendation in March 2021.

Reference here: https://healthfeedback.org/claimreview/no-data-available-to-suggest-a-link-between-indias-reduction-of-covid-19-cases-and-the-use-of-ivermectin-jim-hoft-gateway-pundit/

It actually is proven, there's been tons of studies done on IVM and Covid.  A little research goes a long way

[El_Trauco]

6 minutes ago, Saunk said:

It actually is proven, there's been tons of studies done on IVM and Covid.  A little research goes a long way

Let's see the data then. References please.

[Muad-Dib]

6 hours ago, El_Trauco said:

Let's see the data then. References please.

Hey ya go lazy boy: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34145166/

Please note that this is but one of many studies and the link is to the US .Gov's own website. Numerous examples and charts to show how India tamed covid using ivermectin. I personally know almost 20 people who recovered from the virus using ivermectin, both here in TH and abroad.

But please, by all means, keep parroting the corporate media talking points... we all know they have our best interests at heart. (yes bubi, that was sarcasm)

Now anyone want to ask me about the efficacy of wearing masks to stop corona viruses? lol

[HiuMak]

18 hours ago, AlexPTY said:

of cause, "a prominent" just gives it more credibility.. @Maya for the love of the God, use thesaurus once in a while please

He is a vocal one

[HiuMak]

22 hours ago, Thaiger said:

A prominent Thai virologist says the world’s first oral treatment for Covid-19 is highly effective if taken within 5 days of symptoms developing. Dr Yong Poovorawan from the Centre of Excellence in Clinical Virology at Chulalongkorn University made the statement on his Facebook page yesterday. According to a Bangkok Post report, he was citing research published on the health sciences website, medRxiv. “Molnupiravir is the first oral, direct-acting antiviral shown to be highly effective at reducing nasopharyngeal SARS-CoV-2 infectious virus and viral RNA and has a favourable safety and tolerability profile.” Yong says the Molnupiravir pill, developed by pharmaceutical firm […]

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a miracle oral drug finally 

[El_Trauco]

15 hours ago, Muad-Dib said:

Hey ya go lazy boy: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34145166/

Please note that this is but one of many studies and the link is to the US .Gov's own website. Numerous examples and charts to show how India tamed covid using ivermectin. I personally know almost 20 people who recovered from the virus using ivermectin, both here in TH and abroad.

But please, by all means, keep parroting the corporate media talking points... we all know they have our best interests at heart. (yes bubi, that was sarcasm)

Now anyone want to ask me about the efficacy of wearing masks to stop corona viruses? lol

Your cited "study" is not a study at all. It is a meta-analysis, these things are not the same.

A meta-analysis combines data from actual studies which can be of varying quality, have different end points, and methods of measurements. So... low quality studies, beget low quality meta-analysis. Major concerns like publication bias (studies that showed no effect or were not statistically significant are not likely to be published and therefore do not appear in meta-analyses), heterogenicity (combining apples with oranges) between studies are confounding factors. Amongst others. Further, the data includes results of a preprint study that has been withdrawn and the authors are being investigated for possible research fraud.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02081-w

Did you actually read the publication?

I thought not. 

Actually I don't wish to ask you anything. But I will give you some advice. Get yourself some quality education if you want to run with the big dogs, otherwise... stay on the porch.

 

[El_Trauco]

So back on topic.

Molnupiravir is indeed a game changer for those who are unvaccinated and become infected with COVID-19. Because it is an oral drug it does not require access to a hospital unlike monoclonal antibody infusion  or convalescent plasma. Other antivirals such as remdesivir also require hospital access. Dexamethasone while inexpensive and easily obtained cannot be self administered.

The caveat with molnupiravir is that to be optimally effective it must be started within 5 days of symptom onset (and the earlier the better) and a positive test .

Given the poor availability of testing here in Thailand this will be a major hurdle to efficient use of this drug.

Named after Thor's Hammer Mjölnir.

Excellent article here:

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/10/mercks-experimental-covid-pill-cant-fix-everything/620320/

Edited October 20, 2021 by El_Trauco
Clarity

[Bob20]

1 minute ago, El_Trauco said:

...Dexamethasone while inexpensive and cheap ...

You must have had a super deal!

[El_Trauco]

Lol, check the edit!

1 minute ago, Bob20 said:

You must have had a super deal!

 

[Bob20]

8 minutes ago, El_Trauco said:

So back on topic.

Molnupiravir is indeed a game changer for those who are unvaccinated and become infected with COVID-19. Because it is an oral drug it does not require access to a hospital unlike monoclonal antibody infusion  or convalescent plasma. Other antivirals such as remdesivir also require hospital access. Dexamethasone while inexpensive and easily obtained cannot be self administered.

The caveat with molnupiravir is that to be optimally effective it must be started within 5 days of symptom onset (and the earlier the better) and a positive test .

Given the poor availability of testing here in Thailand this will be a major hurdle to efficient use of this drug.

Named after Thor's Hammer Mjölnir.

Excellent article here:

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/10/mercks-experimental-covid-pill-cant-fix-everything/620320/

Latest publication claimed the government is paying some $700 per course of treatment (which I don't believe as $12 generic versions will be available) and the sales price was claimed to have been set at THB 23.000.

At that price they will not be selling it over the counter to anyone slightly out of breath or with a cough.

Costs of a PCR tests are negligible compared to the costs of this medication. For now I am of the opinion that it will be prescribed to people in hospitals or field-hospitals who have been PCR+ (or ATK+ with symptoms and subsequently also PCR+). I don't think your local pharmacy will be stocking it just yet.

[El_Trauco]

700.00 USD is the contract price agreed to by the US government per 5 day treatment course.

Actual cost to produce the drug is 17.74 USD (5-day Rx).

Including 10% profit and 27% tax allowance. 19.99 USD (5-day Rx). Approximately 666.36 THB.

Who said pharma executives are only concerned about stockholder dividends, stock buybacks, and share-prices (+ golden parachutes)?

https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/melissabarber/files/estimated_cost-based_generic_prices_for_molnupiravir_for_the_treatment_of_covid-19_infection.pdf

[Bob20]

59 minutes ago, El_Trauco said:

Who said pharma executives are only concerned about stockholder dividends, stock buybacks, and share-prices (+ golden parachutes)?

They're not philanthropist, but they are compromising somewhat in view of the pandemic, like some vaccine producers did.

Merck has reached agreements with eight generic drug companies, allowing each of them to sell molnupiravir in more than 100 low- and middle-income countries. These generic companies will compete on price, with one report saying they are expected to charge about $12 to $15 per treatment course.

https://www.businessinsider.com/how-merck-is-pricing-its-covid-19-pill-molnupiravir-globally-2021-10

[MikeTexas]

So whether or not it works, I would be concerned that he is citing from medrxiv!  From their own website they say their publications should not be reported on or used a a guide for clinical practice.  The site is a place that houses prepublished papers that are only preliminary and haven't undergone any peer review.