Important rules and behaviours for driving in Thailand

[Philly]

  On 10/25/2021 at 12:38 PM, Faz said:

Is that a fact -can you supply a link to that please, or is this just more dross.

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Yes that’s true, I didn’t believe it either 

[Faz]

A post and reply have been removed.

[kellio48]

  On 10/11/2021 at 8:34 AM, palooka said:

It would be nice if anyone abided by the rules, but they don't.

Pulling out from the side of the road, check there are no cars coming and then check ahead that there no cars, bikes coming on your side intent on a head on collison. Thailand drives on the left side of road or maybe the right, depends on where they want to go.

What's the speed limit in Thailand? Ans. How fast can your car go.

Quality roads, had a semi trailer turn over on a straight stretch of a major road recently, he hit a big pothole and lost it.

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One of the most frustrating beliefs here among Thai drivers and particularly taxis, is their apparent belief that a driver parked on the side of the road can simply put his indicator on to display his/her intention to pull out into the flow of traffic or even do a U turn  without waiting for a break in traffic.
I've seen it numerous times and particularly from taxi drivers who seem to think they own the road and can do whatever they like.
If you sound your horn at them, they'll let go with a tirade of vocal abuse in Thai as if you're the one in the wrong.

[Bluesofa]

  On 12/10/2021 at 10:58 PM, kellio48 said:

One of the most frustrating beliefs here among Thai drivers and particularly taxis, is their apparent belief that a driver parked on the side of the road can simply put his indicator on to display his/her intention to pull out into the flow of traffic or even do a U turn  without waiting for a break in traffic.
I've seen it numerous times and particularly from taxi drivers who seem to think they own the road and can do whatever they like.
If you sound your horn at them, they'll let go with a tirade of vocal abuse in Thai as if you're the one in the wrong.

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You are the one in the wrong - you're causing them to lose face.

[El_Trauco]

Curious thing with turn signals.

Apparently establishes right-of-way under any circumstances.

Example:

Making a right hand turn at a signaled intersection.

Even with oncoming traffic (going straight)

Many drivers here will turn immediately on green without waiting for oncoming traffic to clear the intersection.

Very confusing

[cowslip]

  On 12/10/2021 at 10:58 PM, kellio48 said:

One of the most frustrating beliefs here among Thai drivers and particularly taxis, is their apparent belief that a driver parked on the side of the road can simply put his indicator on to display his/her intention to pull out into the flow of traffic or even do a U turn  without waiting for a break in traffic.
I've seen it numerous times and particularly from taxi drivers who seem to think they own the road and can do whatever they like.
If you sound your horn at them, they'll let go with a tirade of vocal abuse in Thai as if you're the one in the wrong.

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This is because the basic rule of the road in Thailand is that there is priority from the left. They have right of way.....Translated Thai highway code dated 1979, Section 71 (500B)]

Edited December 30, 2021 by Khunwilko

[Rain]

Driving while being distracted by texting or any other gadgetry priorities.

[Guest1]

On urban roads, the speed limit has been set at 50 kms/hour.

I think, this is an questionable one.

Or a new one?

Aside, that they starting to put up 50 signs in many urban areas, which wouldn't be needed, if there were a general 50 in urban rule out there, I remember a couple of years ago an interview with a station chief , I think was it, of Phuket. 

In there was written, that there is no such general urban speed limit in Thailand (which would explain the need of all the new 50 signs), and that therefor the legal limit, in urban areas, without specific speed limit signs, would be 90, too.

So, how old is this, and where does it stand, please?

But hey, they start often to put up blue signs on traffic lights, now, "wait for green", instead of the "turn left when save" sign. Or/and expecting people to wait for a green "right" arrow, without having any red signal on, to support that waiting expectation.

[Fester]

  On 12/30/2021 at 11:45 PM, Khunwilko said:

This is because the basic rule of the road in Thailand is that there is priority from the left. They have right of way.....Translated Thai highway code dated 1979, Section 71 (500B)]

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Not quite as simple as that and that is not a pure transation.

The important wording is that the vehicle on the principle roadway has a right of way.

So all the bozos that cut in from side roads and gas stations etc are.....well...bozos.

[Bluesofa]

  On 12/31/2021 at 6:21 AM, Fester said:

Not quite as simple as that and that is not a pure transation.

The important wording is that the vehicle on the principle roadway has a right of way.

So all the bozos that cut in from side roads and gas stations etc are.....well...bozos.

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This looks rather complicated.
Why do you say it's not a pure translation - perhaps because it's not clear enough?
This is what the translations says:

[quote]
Section 71. Subject to section 21 and section 26, when a driver
drives a conveyance reaching a junction, he or she shall follow the instructions as
follows:
(1) if there is another conveyance at the junction, the driver shall let
the conveyance at the junction pass first;
(2) if two conveyances reach the junction at the same time and there
is no other conveyance at the junction, the driver shall let the conveyance driving on
his or her left side pass first; provided that at any junction where a main road
intersects a secondary road, the conveyance driving on the main road has the right
to pass first;
[endquote]

It seems to me 'provided that' in the middle of (2) means 'remembering that'?

[cowslip]

  On 12/31/2021 at 6:21 AM, Fester said:

The important wording is that the vehicle on the principle roadway has a right of way.

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the translation of the "Highway Code" is from 1979 and it is more a historical document than a modern translation. From an era when translations were very hit or miss. It does however highlight early cultural mores than still populate Thai driving culture to this day.

In the case of a parked car, they are both on the principle road.

This is similar to the rule in countries like France and Netherlands (except from the right)  leads to a basic priority rule and that is for traffic on the left. Thai drivers are basically quite polite and expect people to come in from the left....This is part of Thai driving psyche and if foreign drivers don't understand this, they are in for a few surprises.

"principle roadway" is a very dubious concept in Thailand as road markings seldom make this clear. Near where I used to live - in the suburbs, my road was a "Soi", but there was a road joining it that was a "Sai"; it didn't appear any different apart from the wording on the blue label...however it had right of way. "Straight on" at the junction was into the Soi but people entering from the Sai had right of way to come out across in front of you.

It is one of the reasons that roundabouts are so ineffective in Thailand as they involve an inversion of the give way to the left rule and there are seldom markings or signs to show this.

The problem is foreign drivers tend to drive by the rules of "home" and when confronted with a Thai rule the seems different, their normal reaction is to say "that ca't be right" and then apply their "home logic".

Edited December 31, 2021 by Khunwilko

[cowslip]

  On 12/31/2021 at 6:21 AM, Fester said:

vehicle on the principle roadway has a right of way

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Not actually the case - it says on roads of EQUAL status there is automatic priority for traffic on the left - this is only overridden in the case of a "principle road" (definitions of the aren't straightforward, either)

[cowslip]

  On 12/31/2021 at 1:01 AM, Guest1 said:

On urban roads, the speed limit has been set at 50 kms/hour.

I think, this is an questionable one.

Or a new one?

Aside, that they starting to put up 50 signs in many urban areas, which wouldn't be needed, if there were a general 50 in urban rule out there, I remember a couple of years ago an interview with a station chief , I think was it, of Phuket. 

In there was written, that there is no such general urban speed limit in Thailand (which would explain the need of all the new 50 signs), and that therefor the legal limit, in urban areas, without specific speed limit signs, would be 90, too.

So, how old is this, and where does it stand, please?

But hey, they start often to put up blue signs on traffic lights, now, "wait for green", instead of the "turn left when save" sign. Or/and expecting people to wait for a green "right" arrow, without having any red signal on, to support that waiting expectation.

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The urban speed limit WAS 80 km/h. Cars over 1.2 kg had a 60 km/h limit.

Te problem here is to define a "built up area". In UK it is by the density of street lighting. In Thailand with extensive ribbon development it is hard to tell and sing WAS non-existent.

Local authorities cannot, I believe introduce new speed limits in areas they deem necessary. This has lead to a plethora of signs and road markings, mostly with little national consistency.

The national speed limit is still 90 km/h, the exception being motorways and some other roads with a central reservation. They have a 120 km/h limit.

The Expressways around BKK and Pattaya have an 80 limit.

these limits are for standard 4-wheel private vehicles.

Interestingly in Laos they use the French system and are much better signed, telling you if you are entering built up areas or school areas etc...

[Fester]

  On 12/31/2021 at 10:32 AM, Khunwilko said:

Not actually the case - it says on roads of EQUAL status there is automatic priority for traffic on the left - this is only overridden in the case of a "principle road" (definitions of the aren't straightforward, either)

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It's very actually the case. 

[Fester]

  On 12/31/2021 at 8:41 AM, Bluesofa said:

This looks rather complicated.
Why do you say it's not a pure translation - perhaps because it's not clear enough?
This is what the translations says:

[quote]
Section 71. Subject to section 21 and section 26, when a driver
drives a conveyance reaching a junction, he or she shall follow the instructions as
follows:
(1) if there is another conveyance at the junction, the driver shall let
the conveyance at the junction pass first;
(2) if two cet the conveyance driving on
his or her left side pass first; provided that at any junction where a main road
intersects a secondary road, the conveyance driving on onveyances reach the junction at the same time and there
is no other conveyance at the junction, the driver shall lthe main road has the right
to pass first;
[endquote]

It seems to me 'provided that' in the middle of (2) means 'remembering that'?

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It's certainly confusing, especially when people don't quote properly. 

[cowslip]

  On 12/31/2021 at 7:43 PM, Fester said:

It's very actually the case. 

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The vehicle on the left by default has the right of way - the only time this rule is cancelled is when entering a "principle roadway". By default vehicles on the left have right of way.

Unfortunately many drivers don't know that they aren't on a principle road and ASSUME there are and have right of way. Rods of EQUAL status the priority is from the left

Sect 72 - [A principle roadway is announced by the traffic officer and installed with indicative traffic signs.]

Edited December 31, 2021 by Khunwilko

[Fester]

  On 12/31/2021 at 8:04 PM, Khunwilko said:

The vehicle on the left by default has the right of way - the only time this rule is cancelled is when entering a "principle roadway". By default vehicles on the left have right of way.

Unfortunately many drivers don't know that they aren't on a principle road and ASSUME there are and have right of way. Rods of EQUAL status the priority is from the left

Sect 72 - [A principle roadway is announced by the traffic officer and installed with indicative traffic signs.]

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Sorry you had such a lousy New Year's Eve.

Edited December 31, 2021 by Fester
such

[cowslip]

Priority to the left

Priority to the left is a right-of-way system, in which the driver of a vehicle is required to give way to vehicles approaching from the left at intersections.

Priority to the left is the basic rule and is valid if there are no traffic signs or road markings.

[Fester]

  On 12/31/2021 at 8:04 PM, Khunwilko said:

The vehicle on the left by default has the right of way - the only time this rule is cancelled is when entering a "principle roadway". By default vehicles on the left have right of way.

Unfortunately many drivers don't know that they aren't on a principle road and ASSUME there are and have right of way. Rods of EQUAL status the priority is from the left

Sect 72 - [A principle roadway is announced by the traffic officer and installed with indicative traffic signs.]

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Yeah, there's a BIB on each junction with a mike, karaoke box and baton.

[cowslip]

  On 1/7/2022 at 2:42 PM, Fester said:

Yeah, there's a BIB on each junction with a mike, karaoke box and baton.

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sorry , don't follow... who's Mike?

[DesperateOldHand]

  On 1/7/2022 at 3:03 PM, Khunwilko said:

sorry , don't follow... who's Mike?

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Short for Somchai.

[Rain]

  On 1/8/2022 at 10:07 AM, Transam said:

You forget, in LOS, the populace know nothing about anything regarding road use, except a red traffic light means stop, but even then, at times they disregard it. 

The next time you are on holiday here, set up a deck chair near a road junction, it will be an eye opener for you.

..............

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Thai magic.

[cowslip]

  On 1/8/2022 at 10:07 AM, Transam said:

You forget, in LOS, the populace know nothing about anything regarding road use, except a red traffic light means stop, but even then, at times they disregard it. 

The next time you are on holiday here, set up a deck chair near a road junction, it will be an eye opener for you.

..............

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So long as people use sweeping inaccurate generalisations like this they will never understand road safety or how it should be applied in Thailand.

Edited January 8, 2022 by Khunwilko

[JamesR]

  On 1/9/2022 at 2:27 AM, Transam said:

You're 'avin a laugh.....This country issues driving licences, have you taken a driving test here, or been present at one, well I have, it is a joke, a non-event from a department that should know what they are doing, a reason why the road carnage is like it is, nobody knows what they are doing from the start...

PS. 51 years back, 1971,I took a HGV driving test in the UK, there were three of us, the test took 1.5 hours, I passed, the other two were sent home...Food for thought..

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I agree.

I had to go to the office to pay the annual 'road tax' in Phuket a few years ago.

There were driving licence tests going on, it was on a small circuit which took a few minutes to complete once the applicants had reversed into a parking spot large enough to park a bus in, if they did not get it right the first time they could have a few goes at it.

They were processing one driver every few minutes.

On the circuit there was a small roundabout, a small bridge and a few hundred yards of test track with no other cars on it, a monkey with brain damage could have passed the test.

As you mention in the UK the tests are difficult, the test for a car lasts about 45 minutes and involves all sorts of manoeuvres on real roads with normal traffic, most people do not pass first time.

Road deaths UK about 1750 a year, Thailand 25,000.

Just make the tests more difficult.

Also the MOT (annual car check) in the UK takes an hour, they cover brakes and all other essential components, I have my car annual check in Phuket done every year and it takes three minutes as all they check are the brakes on a rolling wheel machine, it is funny to see.

Don't get me wrong, I love Thailand but what I have said are facts and it is a pity so many people die on the roads when it could easily be remedied. 

[cowslip]

  On 1/9/2022 at 2:27 AM, Transam said:

You're 'avin a laugh.....This country issues driving licences, have you taken a driving test here, or been present at one, well I have, it is a joke, a non-event from a department that should know what they are doing, a reason why the road carnage is like it is, nobody knows what they are doing from the start...

PS. 51 years back, 1971,I took a HGV driving test in the UK, there were three of us, the test took 1.5 hours, I passed, the other two were sent home...Food for thought..

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You're barking up the wrong tree...

“You're 'avin a laugh.....This country issues driving licences, have you taken a driving test here, or been present at one,

I have held a Thai driving licence for 20 years.

I have been present or observed dozens of tests, as part of my job was to take foreigners to the local DLT for their licences. 

Only one took the test himself.

You overlook that one there is  a theoretical test as well as the practical.

On one occasion my friends wife had to call him into the licence office as he had wandered out to the practical ground and was laughing so loudly that people were beginning to notice. He then failed the colour blind test.

So yes I have seen terrible driving – but I have also seen it elsewhere. And you are trying to say that the test is the reason for the bad road safety record in Thailand.

Yet they still only have similar number of crashes to the UK – how do you explain that?

BTW – when I went for my HGV 1 assessment in the early 1980s, I was told I didn’t need a training course and they would put me straight in. I was also told by another instructor that if I went to such-and-such test centre I could “knock down every bollard in the place” so long as there was a £50 note folded into my licence.

The point is there are idiots all over the world.

And driving tests (90 minutes for HGV is a joke) taken by most of the people on these forums were a joke when they took them.

 

Do you seriously think that the test is the be-all and end-all for road safety.

It is part of driver education which is one of the 5E – so it is part of a part of.

Telling personal anecdotes is not a valid way of discussing Road safety.

“TIT” - There’s a tone and an attitude amongst foreigners in Thailand. A combination of personal experience, arrogance and cynicism that leads to a lot of wild and inaccurate comments about Thailand, the people and Thai life;.

A series of false syllogisms – corruption, incompetence and an alien logic are noted and with a touch of racism, misinterpreted. ….and the wrong conclusions are made

The reason why road safety is so poor from the start is because the authorities, like yourself have no idea what road safety is,

PS. 51 years back, 1971,I took a HGV driving test in the UK, there were three of us, the test took 1.5 hours, I passed, the other two were sent home...Food for thought..”  - why is that food for thought?