News Forum - “The Rescue” – What really happened inside Tham Luang caves?

[Thaiger]

We all followed the events of the cave rescue. We think we know what happened. But we don’t. “The Rescue”, by directors Elizabeth Chai Vasarhelyi and Jimmy Chin, has peered behind the heroic narrative that was cultivated at the time of the Chiang Rai Tham Luang cave rescue in July 2018. 13 young men – 12 teenagers and their 24 year old soccer coach – rode their bikes to the Tham Luang Caves in Chiang Rai, Northern Thailand, for a quick excursion following training of the Mu Pa (wild boars) team. It was Saturday, June 23, 2018. Following torrential monsoonal […]

The post “The Rescue” – What really happened inside Tham Luang caves? appeared first on Thaiger News.

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[Shade_Wilder]

"“We were brutally honest, we promised multiple fatalities.”"

This is still the most incredible aspect of the whole story; If I am to be honest, I would have wagered a very large sum of cash that some of the boys would die.

I am still extremely pleased that I was wrong.

Now, I just hope that the boys see some of the cash from the various films and that the government doesn't 'eat' it all through committees, honorariums, "protecting' the youths, etc.

 

[janchangtha]

Great review. But if you recommend it, maybe also tell readers where they can watch it.

[AussieBob]

I will be watching out for this one - will definitely be worth the download. 

[gummy]

1 minute ago, AussieBob said:

I will be watching out for this one - will definitely be worth the download. 

But someone spoiled it as we know the ending 

[JamesE]

3 minutes ago, gummy said:

But someone spoiled it as we know the ending 

There's a new twist...

 

[Saltire]

I am keen to see this having watched the documentary below. I think the film may go into the politics of the event a bit more as I recall there was lots of posturing amongst the different factions. Should be a good movie,

And yes, a real life miracle.

 

[Stonker]

6 hours ago, Thaiger said:

We all followed the events of the cave rescue. We think we know what happened. But we don't.

Rather more than a little bit unpleasantly condescending.

Most of those I know who followed it were only too well aware at the time of just how "tenuous and complicated" the rescue would be, as well as of how much of "a mess of Thai politics, misplaced pride and incompetence" it was on all sides, with the only exception being those very few with the appropriate experience of cave dive rescues - including those whose specific international job was rescues, who were supposed to be the world's experts, who were unbelievably poorly trained, equipped and prepared.

<deleted>

Edited October 9, 2021 by KaptainRob
Off topic

[Rain]

3 hours ago, gummy said:

But someone spoiled it as we know the ending 

It's all about the unneeded attention.

[gummy]

Not of course I have seen this movie yet, nor will probably bother to watch it but I do wonder if in the pursuit of making money, the producers, the Thai government and all those that will profit from it in some way will clearly state the inherent dangers of entering caves. This was an incredible achievement to save those young lives and a crying shame that somebody died in the process. But caving is not without its dangers and I hope the dangers of exploring are pointed out to the audiences in the leading and trailing credits to whom may see this movie, hopefully to avoid a repetition of this in the future.

[Stonker]

5 hours ago, Thaiger said:

Another revelation is the rescue, a few days before the effort to extract the team began, of a smaller rescue of four adults stuck inside the cave.

If that was a "revelation" to the Thaiger, it explains a great deal since this was widely reported at the time, including all the details of how that rescue was carried out, including reporting by the Bangkok Post.

 https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1547094/british-divers-rescued-thai-adults-before-wild-boars-report

[Stonker]

15 minutes ago, gummy said:

Not of course I have seen this movie yet, nor will probably bother to watch it but I do wonder if in the pursuit of making money, the producers, the Thai government and all those that will profit from it in some way will clearly state the inherent dangers of entering caves. This was an incredible achievement to save those young lives and a crying shame that somebody died in the process. But caving is not without its dangers and I hope the dangers of exploring are pointed out to the audiences in the leading and trailing credits to whom may see this movie, hopefully to avoid a repetition of this in the future.

Hopefully so.

Everyone who ventures into the dragon's mouth, whether caving, climbing, or countless other activities takes a risk - unfortunately many fail to realise or consider the risk they put others to when they have to help them out.

In some cases that's excusable because of their youth or circumstances, as to some extent happened here, but in all too many cases there's simply no excuse at all.

Respect to all those who put their lives at risk to save others, in every rescue organisation.

[Smithydog]

1 hour ago, Stonker said:

Rather more than a little bit unpleasantly condescending.

Most of those I know who followed it were only too well aware at the time of just how "tenuous and complicated" the rescue would be, as well as of how much of "a mess of Thai politics, misplaced pride and incompetence" it was on all sides, with the only exception being those very few with the appropriate experience of cave dive rescues - including those whose specific international job was rescues, who were supposed to be the world's experts, who were unbelievably poorly trained, equipped and prepared.

Trashing Thais wholesale, though, is unfortunately what's now expected from the Thaiger and the insinuations here live down to those expectations.

I personally think you are being a bit harsh on The Thaiger who are reporting on a Theatrical release, albeit a "documentary". "Condescending" could be an early judgement. After all they are likely working off a press statement or another report. I don't think they intend to trash Thailand with this report or such a pattern has been established. 

Perhaps you may be proven right. Perhaps the film will back you up. But when you hear the line in the trailer "The Thai Navy Seals put everything they had into it", it suggests I don't think the film has any massive intent itself to "trash" Thailand.

If I recall correctly, National Geographic gained the rights for the divers’ story, and so of course that’s where the focus of “The Rescue” will come from. I also think it was Netflix who received the rights to the boys’ perspective. I wouldn't be surprised in such a case that there were limitations on who they could speak to, so rights were protected.

But naturally, coming from different perspectives, I am sure there will be differences and even possible previously unseen footage and/or interpretations on the how the operation was observed by the most experienced, and especially skilled of the divers.

One could argue that being Thailand, would you not expect some possibility of unnecessary bureaucratic action! I think I will wait for the whole film before passing judgement on this and  whether the film itself trashes Thailand.

As to the Thaiger trashing Thailand. I simply just don't agree with your statement. But if their writing concerns you so much, then I would suggest you simply don't read it. You have that choice.

 

[Stonker]

7 hours ago, Thaiger said:

Rick Stanton was a retired British firefighter who had spent 40 years diving deep into lonely, claustrophobic caves around the world. Fortuitously, his girlfriend was a resident of Chiang Rai, so he heard about the search situation early on. Rick teamed with another cave diving mate, John Volanthen, to fly to northern Thailand to see if they could help.

Actually the initial British involvement from the BCRC was three divers, not two, with the third being Robert Harper who had been contacted by Vern Unsworth, and he then contacted Rick Stanton and John Volanthen.

[gummy]

Just now, Stonker said:

Actually the initial British involvement from the BCRC was three divers, not two, with the third being Robert Harper who had been contacted by Vern Unsworth, and he then contacted Rick Stanton and John Volanthen.

Oh, I hope facts are not going to spoil the story  for the movie makers

[Rain]

4 minutes ago, gummy said:

Oh, I hope facts are not going to spoil the story  for the movie makers

Might those be edited and censored facts or commentary.

I'd be relieved if Thaiger wasn't on the advisory board. 

[Stonker]

1 hour ago, Smithydog said:

I personally think you are being a bit harsh on The Thaiger who are reporting on a Theatrical release, albeit a "documentary". "Condescending" could be an early judgement.

Maybe I wasn't being clear, as that was my view of how the review saw other readers and the level of knowledge they had of the cave rescue, not the of the documentary.  I simply think that many readers are probably better informed about the rescue than the review gives them credit for; since the other rescue was a "revelation" to the author although it was very widely reported at the time and later,that seems to support that view.

 

1 hour ago, Smithydog said:

After all they are likely working off a press statement or another report.

Quite possibly very true, but as there are no sources given and the review ends with "Highly recommended" I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that the author had actually seen the documentary he's highly recommending.

 

1 hour ago, Smithydog said:

Perhaps you may be proven right. Perhaps the film will back you up. But when you hear the line in the trailer "The Thai Navy Seals put everything they had into it", it suggests I don't think the film has any massive intent itself to "trash" Thailand.

I'm sorry if that was the impression I gave and I may have phrased my comment badly, but I didn't intend to suggest in any way that "the film has any massive intent itself to "trash" Thailand." (my bold).

 

1 hour ago, Smithydog said:

One could argue that being Thailand, would you not expect some possibility of unnecessary bureaucratic action! I think I will wait for the whole film before passing judgement on this and  whether the film itself trashes Thailand.

Again, I'm sorry if that was the impression I gave, but I didn't intend to suggest in any way that "the film itself trashes Thailand". (my bold).

If that was the impression I gave, then I phrased my comment very badly as that was anything but my intention and I've no reason at all to suggest that, nor am I obviously in any position to since I haven't seen the film.

The criticism of Thailand it apparently has, which I think is a very fair one as it's been raised in virtually every book / film / article I've read on it isn't so much about Thai bureaucracy but about the initial reluctance of the military who were running the rescue to accept the Brits (and later others) as capable, which was mainly because of their age and that they were civilians.  John Volanten was 47, Rick Stanton was 57 and Robert Harper was 70, and the thirty six Americans who were at least military so easily able to dovetail into the Thai military system from 3!st Rescue Squadron and 353rd Special Operations Group had hardly impressed by arriving for a rescue with very few equipped with torches or head torches, which most people would think would be a rather obvious necessity for a cave rescue.

 

1 hour ago, Smithydog said:

As to the Thaiger trashing Thailand. I simply just don't agree with your statement. But if their writing concerns you so much, then I would suggest you simply don't read it. You have that choice.

 

Well, we all have our opinions but if I was to only read media I agreed with  that would probably give me a rather narrow and uninformed view of things.

[Stonker]

44 minutes ago, gummy said:

Oh, I hope facts are not going to spoil the story  for the movie makers

I'm sure the documentary has checked it's facts, and knows how many Brits were involved and when, who was the initial point of contact, and basic details such as that two of the twelve boys weren't "teenagers" as one was eleven and one was twelve  - probably more, given the Thai custom of counting age as the year that you're in rather than as westerners do. 

[Disenfranchised]

7 hours ago, janchangtha said:

Great review. But if you recommend it, maybe also tell readers where they can watch it.

The trailers are on youtube. Put 'The Rescue' in search box. National Geographic but no indication on where it will be presented.

[Stonker]

8 hours ago, Shade_Wilder said:

Now, I just hope that the boys see some of the cash from the various films and that the government doesn't 'eat' it all through committees, honorariums, "protecting' the youths, etc.

I think there were a lot of missed opportunities for the boys to profit from their experience, without it being seen as somehow "wrong".

I recall that soon after the rescue when in the hospital for observation they were asked what they were most looking forward to and Adul Samon, the young stateless boy from Burma who was the best known in the foreign press as he spoke the most English, replied "KFC".

Totally unprompted.

KFC would probably have paid him a fortune for an ad campaign and it's hard to believe nobody at KFC noticed, but it never happened.

[Stonker]

9 minutes ago, Disenfranchised said:

The trailers are on youtube. Put 'The Rescue' in search box. National Geographic but no indication on where it will be presented.

I wonder how the reviewer got to see it, then .....

[Disenfranchised]

This kind of thing happens everywhere, ill equipped people engaging in activities that they are not trained for. 

Those kids should have gone no further into those caves than light can penetrate. Due to the skill of a small number of people a tragedy was averted.

And don't forget the Thai Navy Seal whose life was lost in service to his community, Thailand.

[Stonker]

4 hours ago, Disenfranchised said:

And don't forget the Thai Navy Seal whose life was lost in service to his community, Thailand.

Actually he was a former Navy Seal, so a civilian at the time, working as security at Suvarnabhum Airport, and he volunteered to help as he was an experienced clearance diver  -   so even more respect to him.

One other Seal also died, but a year later, from an infection he caught during the rescue.

Edit:

and kids are kids - they didn't intend going anything like that far in, but they got caught by a freak flash flood further up in the hills and were just forced to go further and further back into the cave system.

It shouldn't have happened, but that area, like the area around me, is full of caves. These were due to be closed the following week, but the floods came early, although the rain wasn't in their area.

 

[Stonker]

4 hours ago, Disenfranchised said:

The trailers are on youtube. Put 'The Rescue' in search box. National Geographic but no indication on where it will be presented.

Just checked the release date.

Released in limited cinemas in the US on 8 October, followed by general release in cinemas in the US on 15 October.

No date set yet for either general release or for streaming.

[Bob20]

4 hours ago, Disenfranchised said:

The trailers are on youtube. Put 'The Rescue' in search box. National Geographic but no indication on where it will be presented.