Collapse of China

[Fester]

  On 10/12/2021 at 8:55 AM, Rain said:

Hence the term: South China Sea 

...and have dominated the region for centuries. 

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What does that mean?

[mickkotlarski]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:27 AM, Fester said:

OK. You meant the 1.4 billion Chinese. If China's supply routes were to be blocked then the Chinese would have good reason to be pissed off.

The smaller neighbours only claim small parts of water nearset to them. But the Chinese claim to almost the entire South China Sea (ranging more that 1000 miles from mainland China) would effectively isolate, or partially isolate, these smaller countries, from a maritime perspective. 

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Actually this was another poorly phrased comment. Blockage is the wrong word. Policing naval reminiscence is closer. As you stated the vast offshore territory that China claims is just that. Hence the naval response as the partial isolation and territory loss is a stark reality. 

[gummy]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:31 AM, Fluke said:

Although Hong Kong is a separate jurisdiction and isn't governed by Chinese law and still has a certain amount of independence and the population oppose Chinese rule and they would side with the Allies when there's a war 

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Think you need to catch up with the times 

[mickkotlarski]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:31 AM, Fluke said:

Although Hong Kong is a separate jurisdiction and isn't governed by Chinese law and still has a certain amount of independence and the population oppose Chinese rule and they would side with the Allies when there's a war 

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Yes. I think many would.

[Fluke]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:34 AM, gummy said:

Think you need to catch up with the times 

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My information is current and up to date 

[gummy]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:37 AM, Fluke said:

My information is current and up to date 

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I think even your water bottle lady may understand that  the Chinese National Security law now takes precedence over Hong Kong law since last year. Hence any dissent is firmly dealt  with the prospect of dissidents being sent for trial in mainland China. So a very few of the 7 million + population may oppose it but it will be stamped on in no time at all hence negating any worthwhile challenge.

[Fester]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:18 AM, mickkotlarski said:

The way China is going it may be less than 10%.

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This is the continuous red line - the "9 dashes":

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/18105/production/_90356589_south_china_sea_spratlys.png

[Poolie]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:37 AM, Fluke said:

My information is current and up to date 

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Well, it might be wise to say that from 6.8m people, the majority being ex-mainlanders, the bulk of people in HK would NOT support an uprising.

[Fester]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:18 AM, longwood50 said:

They do have that leverage but it is like nuclear war.  If they start to demand repayment they will collapse the worth of their own investments at the same time.  I think it more likely that at some point in time China stops buying U.S. debt knowing it will never be repaid and if it is repaid it will be in dollars that are ravaged by inflation.  When or if that occurs it will signal to everyone that there is loss of faith in the U.S. dollar and there will be a stampede to sell and convert dollars to something tangible like real estate.  

If that does occur it will make the great depression look like the good old days. 

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Looks like they put the brakes on already.

[Fluke]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:44 AM, gummy said:

I think even your water bottle lady may understand that  the Chinese National Security law now takes precedence over Hong Kong law since last year. Hence any dissent is firmly dealt  with the prospect of dissidents being sent for trial in mainland China. So a very few of the 7 million + population may oppose it but it will be stamped on in no time at all hence negating any worthwhile challenge.

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I need to be very careful , speaking out against China can get me arrested and jailed for life if I ever transit through Chinese territory ever again as Chinese laws apply to everyone on the planet . 

   Goodbye free speech, they are watching and listening 

[mickkotlarski]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:44 AM, Fester said:

This is the continuous red line - the "9 dashes":

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/18105/production/_90356589_south_china_sea_spratlys.png

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Thanks Fester.

[Rookiescot]

  On 10/12/2021 at 7:11 AM, AussieBob said:

Around the wrong way. The problem is not capitalism - the problem is lack of measured control.  It is the greed that make capitalism work - it is the incentive - but it needs to be 'controlled'.  Take away capitalism and leave it its place control, and nothing much new will develop and everything will slowly decay = USSR.

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I do not intrinsically disagree with you. However Thatcher and Reagan were the ones who removed the legislation/controls which resulted, ultimately, in the 2008 crash. 

[Fluke]

  On 10/12/2021 at 11:02 AM, Rookiescot said:

I do not intrinsically disagree with you. However Thatcher and Reagan were the ones who removed the legislation/controls which resulted, ultimately, in the 2008 crash. 

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Wasn't it Hilary forcing the banks to give loans to people who were unable to pay the money back 

[Poolie]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:55 AM, Fluke said:

I need to be very careful , speaking out against China can get me arrested and jailed for life if I ever transit through Chinese territory ever again as Chinese laws apply to everyone on the planet . 

   Goodbye free speech, they are watching and listening 

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I think you'll find that that's America re: Huawei's CEO and Alstom's director.

[Rookiescot]

  On 10/12/2021 at 9:21 AM, Convert54 said:

India is having same problem due to a lag in locally available stockpiles for energy consumption.  There is no shortage in production capacity. Just mistaken management of the coal resource and a failure to respond to a rebound in end use demand that the pandemic had disrupted and stifled.

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Indeed India is also struggling with coal reserves. But ironically its because of China. China started its trade war with Australia because it was asking questions about where the covid virus had come from. This meant China stopped importing coal from Aus.

Australia started selling more coal to India. Sure as eggs are eggs India then started reselling that coal to China . 

Australia figured this out and slowed supply to India in order to stop this. Now India is running short and stopped selling to China who have even smaller stockpiles of coal.

Hence the power outages.

[Fluke]

  On 10/12/2021 at 11:11 AM, Poolie said:

I think you'll find that that's America re: Huawei's CEO and Alstom's director.

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I have no idea who you are talking about . 

Why dont you just face the facts , rather than pointing fingers at someone else .

Chinese law states that anyone who criticizes China can be jailed for life , never seen again , that applies to every person on this planet 

[Fester]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:30 AM, palooka said:

I always thought it to be the South of China Sea, which geographically it is.

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Various names for it, yours might be right but not on the list.

Edited October 12, 2021 by Fester

[Fester]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:34 AM, mickkotlarski said:

Actually this was another poorly phrased comment. Blockage is the wrong word. Policing naval reminiscence is closer. As you stated the vast offshore territory that China claims is just that. Hence the naval response as the partial isolation and territory loss is a stark reality. 

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Well, um, you got me there with that one!

[mickkotlarski]

  On 10/12/2021 at 11:21 AM, Fester said:

Well, um, you got me there with that one!

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Yep. Fester 1 : Mick 0

[Fester]

  On 10/12/2021 at 11:11 AM, Rookiescot said:

Indeed India is also struggling with coal reserves. But ironically its because of China. China started its trade war with Australia because it was asking questions about where the covid virus had come from. This meant China stopped importing coal from Aus.

Australia started selling more coal to India. Sure as eggs are eggs India then started reselling that coal to China . 

Australia figured this out and slowed supply to India in order to stop this. Now India is running short and stopped selling to China who have even smaller stockpiles of coal.

Hence the power outages.

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Indians have historically always quick to see good business opportunites.

[Rookiescot]

  On 10/12/2021 at 8:55 AM, Rain said:

Hence the term: South China Sea 

...and have dominated the region for centuries. 

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OK so the Irish own the Irish sea? England owns the Channel? India owns the Indian ocean? Japan owns the sea of Japan? Iran owns the whole of the Persian gulf? Mexico owns the gulf of Mexico?

I could go on. But I guess at this point even you will have managed to get the picture.

Just because China produced a map claiming it was all theirs does not make it true.

[Rookiescot]

  On 10/12/2021 at 11:07 AM, Fluke said:

Wasn't it Hilary forcing the banks to give loans to people who were unable to pay the money back 

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I have no idea if that is right or not but certainly the banks in the UK needed no such encouragement from her. They were offering loans of up to 115% of the properties value when it came to mortgages. 

[Poolie]

  On 10/12/2021 at 11:14 AM, Fluke said:

I have no idea who you are talking about . 

Why dont you just face the facts , rather than pointing fingers at someone else .

Chinese law states that anyone who criticizes China can be jailed for life , never seen again , that applies to every person on this planet 

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Pointless, if someone who professes to know all the news about China has never heard of Meng Wanzhou.

[longwood50]

  On 10/12/2021 at 10:47 AM, Fester said:

Looks like they put the brakes on already.

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You could be correct.  Consider what good does it do them to invest money at rates that after inflation yields them a negative return.  Also money invested in U.S. treasuries is nothing more than an IOU from the U.S. government.  Investing in the U.S. stock market or in something tangible like real estate would provide them not only with a better return but a hedge against inflation and an asset the rises in value when the U.S. dollar sinks in purchasing power. 

[Poolie]

  On 10/12/2021 at 12:00 PM, longwood50 said:

You could be correct.  Consider what good does it do them to invest money at rates that after inflation yields them a negative return.  Also money invested in U.S. treasuries is nothing more than an IOU from the U.S. government.  Investing in the U.S. stock market or in something tangible like real estate would provide them not only with a better return but a hedge against inflation and an asset the rises in value when the U.S. dollar sinks in purchasing power. 

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Yup, down $3.8bn last month.