Aung San Suu Kyi appears in closed court on corruption charges

[Viggen840]

5 hours ago, 9S_ said:

How convenient of you. Do you always reject arguments based on incredulity?? Just asking

Wow and you’re still giving excuses for her. She was absolutely quick to speak out! Speak out to those who disagreed with the genocide. Speak out to those who tried to cover the genocide. Speak out to those who were raped during the genocide. She spoke out alright, you just turn a blind eye to what she really said. 
 

She is a war criminal responsible for the deaths of nearly 40,000 innocent people and is directly responsible for the massive refugee crisis of 400,000 people fleeing Myanmar’s genocide when she was in power

To deny so is to agree with Ann Suu Kyi that those girls weren’t being raped (because she did accuse the victims of staging “fake rapes”)

To deny so is to agree that there was no genocide (because guess what she downplayed it too)

To deny so is to affirm Myanmar’s right to extinguish the Rakhine State (because she too blamed them she too regards them as invaders she too never recognized them)

Is she the leader of Myanmar? Yes she is

Does she control 4 key ministries with the ability to deprive the military? Yes she is

Did she give citizenship to the Rohingya? No she did not

Did she provide basic medical care, education, infrastructure? No she did not

Has she ever recognized the Rohingya as fellow Burmese? Never

Did she defend the genocide? Yes she did

Did she downplayed the genocide? Yes she did

Did she say that the rapes were “fake rapes”? Yes she did

Did she bar UN investigators into the Rakhine state? Yes she did

So is she innocent, if she doesn’t deprive the military, doesn’t grant citizenship, doesn’t recognize the Rohingya, doesn’t provide basic human rights, doesn’t denounce the genocide, doesn’t stop defending the genocide, doesn’t stop downplaying the genocide????

Of course not shes guilty plain as day. Why are you defending her? Nobody is defending this woman. Do you love her? 

Why didn’t she grant the Rohingya citizenship? 

Why didn’t she build roads, basic infrastructure in the Rakhine State?

Why didn’t she provide education to the Rohingya?

Why did she say there were fake rapes there?

Why is she closely aligned with Ultra-Nationalist Buddhists?

Why didnt she change the view that the people of the Rakhine State are NOT foreign invaders but people who’ve been there for centuries, they’re just Muslim?

If she did all that would the Rohingya people still be here today? Absolutely. 

LOL you should look it up yourself. You’d be surprised what she said, who she aligns herself with and her own policies towards the Rohingya. 

Uh huh surrreee we believe you. I mean surely she didn’t defend the generals who would do that? Oh yea Ann Suu Kyi defended the generals. She even denounced those reporting on the genocide including the UN, the US and Turkey!

Compared to the cities in Myanmar they do seem better than the Stone Age fishing villages of the Rakhine State. 

Well why didn’t she give citizenship?

Well why didn’t she giver education?

Well why did she block UN investigators into her own country?

Why did she denounce Islam?

Why did she called videographic evidence of rapes as fake?

Why did she say it’s Muslim terrorists doing the burning looting and Murdering?

Does an innocent person do these things? I’m just asking questions here. Answers you know, answers I know and answers we all know. 
 

She is the leader of Myanmar.

She didn’t even denounce the genocide. 

She defended the generals

She blocked UN investigators

She called the Turkey delegation investigating the genocide liars

She burned families alive

Don’t take my word for it, take the word of everybody in the world:

-Her Nobel Peace prize winners cohorts

-US State Department

-UN

-Holocaust survivors

-Hundreds of investigative journalists

-400,000 Rohingya survivors (you can ask them who they blame I bet you they’ll say Ann Suu Kyi)

It’s the UN’s job to stop genocide NOT the US. 

And what did Ann Suu Kyi do about it about Rohingya people? Nothing

Well I hope she now feels the same suffering she imposed on the Rohingya people karma is a certain word

That’s nice of you. Of course giving citizenship to the Rohingya is impossible. Of course recognizing them as human beings is impossible. Of course using key ministries that you control with the ability to stop the military is impossible. Of course sending in UN investigators is impossible. Of course giving aid is impossible. Of course not saying fake rapes is impossible. Of course not calling the Turkey delegation liars even though they have  videographic evidence is impossible. Of course!

I guess the Myanmar people who cheered on the massacre of the Rohingya will feel the same as they did. 

I have read your diatribe with interest and conclude that you are a person with a) strong anti-Myanmar sentiment, b) misplaced islamic sentiment, or c) just a bleeding heart with nothing better to do. "ask the Rohingya who they blame"? Of COURSE they are blameless! Just ask them! Who is always the first to pull the victim card (hint: it rhymes with muslims). Video of Buddhists being shot and burned, Myanmar civilians being murdered... SHE condoned all that? And then you bring out your glowing chestnut - the US State Department (rolled around on the floor laughing when I read that). Next you will be saying this was in concert with the CIA!

 

[Viggen840]

On 10/2/2021 at 8:28 PM, Bob20 said:

Just because there's nothing in the press here...

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/01/aung-san-suu-kyi-appears-closed-court-corruption-charges

Ahh! The Guardian! Keeper of the truth to the people! Able to report the happenings from within a closed court! And with accuracy and without bias, of course!

[Viggen840]

On 10/2/2021 at 9:15 PM, Convert54 said:

A step forward in performing the expected parody ?

Theatre for the world stage

 

[Poolie]

3 minutes ago, Viggen840 said:

I have read your diatribe with interest and conclude that you are a person with a) strong anti-Myanmar sentiment, b) misplaced islamic sentiment, or c) just a bleeding heart with nothing better to do. "ask the Rohingya who they blame"? Of COURSE they are blameless! Just ask them! Who is always the first to pull the victim card (hint: it rhymes with muslims). Video of Buddhists being shot and burned, Myanmar civilians being murdered... SHE condoned all that? And then you bring out your glowing chestnut - the US State Department (rolled around on the floor laughing when I read that). Next you will be saying this was in concert with the CIA!

Stop smoking that illegal crap - it will get you in serious trouble!

Not as impossible or risible as you'd imagine.

https://www.ned.org/region/asia/burma-2020/

 

[Bob20]

1 minute ago, Viggen840 said:

Ahh! The Guardian! Keeper of the truth to the people! Able to report the happenings from within a closed court! And with accuracy and without bias, of course!

I guess you'd prefer full press-silence instead...

[stevenkongju]

14 minutes ago, 9S_ said:

Are you the one who ran to a mod asking for help? Is that you do, you can’t win so you ask a mod to delete my posts??

No I did not?  But your new post is just as empty of relevant facts as your last three. 

 

15 minutes ago, 9S_ said:

She controls 4 key ministries with the ability to prevent genocide!

Please tell me which ministries these were that could have forced the military to stop. No citation at all.

[Viggen840]

3 minutes ago, stevenkongju said:

Are you the one who ran to a mod asking for help? Is that you do, you can’t win so you ask a mod to delete my posts??

If I thought that would work, I would have been the one...

[9S_]

40 minutes ago, stevenkongju said:

No I did not?  But your new post is just as empty of relevant facts as your last three. 

Please tell me which ministries these were that could have forced the military to stop. No citation at all.

Ahem it took me less than one second to find this. We’re you even looking?? 
 

Her anti-Islam stances in deeds and words:

 

She purged her party of all Islamic representatives by barring them from running for office. Why?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/03/no-vote-no-candidates-myanmars-muslims-barred-from-their-own-election

When being interviewed by a Muslim, Ann Suu Kyi said: “Nobody told me I was going to be interviewed by a muslim!” What kind of person says this?

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/aung-san-suu-kyi-reportedly-said-no-one-told-me-i-was-going-be-interviewed-muslim-after-tense-exchange-bbc-presenter-mishal-husain-a6951941.html

She has repeatedly denied the existence of ethnic cleansing. She isn’t really praising Islam is she?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-24651359

Going so far as to represent Buddhist fears as caused by some “global muslim power” scarrrryyy

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/burmas-aung-san-suu-kyi-a-human-rights-icon-is-criticized-on-anti-muslim-violence/2013/12/23/c7acb0f4-633e-11e3-a373-0f9f2d1c2b61_story.html?utm_term=.6a64000fb510

According to Maung Zarni, a prominent Burmese History scholar of the Free Burma Coalition and personal friend of Suu Kyi, argues that she: “holds genocidal views towards the Rohingya” because “she denies Rohingya identity and history.” According Zarni Genocide, “begins with an attack on identity and history. The victims never existed and … will never exist.” A position Suu Kyi strongly holds even before her rise to power and evidenced in her actions or non-actions in the Rakhine State

According to analysis by the Intercept:

“The State Counselor [Ann Suu Kyi], from this perspective, is not simply standing by as genocide occurs; she is legitimizing, encouraging and enabling it. When a legendary champion of human rights is in charge of a government that undertakes military operations against “terrorists,” smearing and discrediting the victims of gang rape and loudly denying the burning down of villages and forced expulsion of families, it makes it much harder for the international community to highlight those crimes, let alone intervene to halt them. In recent years, in fact, Western governments have been rolling back political and economic sanctions on Myanmar, citing the country’s “progress“on democracy and pointing to the election victory of Aung San Suu Kyi and her NLD.”

 

Please show me proof where the UN does NOT blame Ann Suu Kyi for the tens of thousands of girls (18,000-40,000) raped, the tens of thousands of people (36,000 innocent Rohingya) of being thrown into the fire and the tens of thousands of people systemically and genocidal murdered (25,000-40,000). “Through their acts and omissions, the civilian authorities have contributed to the commission of atrocity crimes”

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/326912213_Forced_Migration_of_Rohingya_The_Untold_Experience

https://www.ohchr.org/Documents/HRBodies/HRCouncil/FFM-Myanmar/A_HRC_39_64.pdf

Please show me proof where banned human rights campaigners (banned from Myanmer because Ann Suu Kyi exiled them for daring to bring up human rights) does NOT blame Ann Suu Kyi. According to Yanghee Lee Human Rights activist exiled from Myanmar (because of Ann Suu Kyi) “She can’t be not accountable. Complicity is also part of accountability [She needs to be indicted for war crimes]”

https://theintercept.com/2019/08/24/aung-san-suu-kyi-rohingya-genocide/

Please show me proof where the Free Burma Coalition does NOT blame Ann Suu Kyi for the tens of thousands of girls raped, the tens of thousands of people systematically murdered and the tens of thousands of people burned alive. Because according to Muang Zari of Free Burma Coalition: “[Saying that Suu Kyi does not have control of the military] is a complete mischaracterization of Suu Kyi’s role” further elaborating:

Zarni points out that she controls four civilian ministries that have long been involved in repressing the Rohingya — the information, religious affairs, immigration, and foreign affairs ministries — not to mention her own high office of state counselor. [Which has] “accused Rohingya women of fabricating stories of sexual violence and put the words ‘fake rape’ — in the form of a banner headline, no less — on its official website.

Zarni also states that Suu Kyi is directly responsible for the deprivation of  access to education, health services, due process, livelihoods opportunities, factual information about Rohingya history, legal status, past citizenship activities and citizenship

Please show me proof where the author of The Rohingyas: Myanmar’s Hidden Genocide does NOT blame Ann Suu Kyi because the author does blame her: “[Suu Kyi] without a doubt played an important role in the genocide, by providing the Burmese generals with “cover at every step.” It was her presence at the top of government, as the Nobel Peace Prize-winning face of Myanmar to the world, which “emboldened and encouraged the military to undertake the final solution”

https://theintercept.com/2019/08/24/aung-san-suu-kyi-rohingya-genocide/

I’m waiting

[AussieBob]

1 hour ago, Viggen840 said:

The UN? Don't hold your breath waiting. Now nothing but a Middle-East-sponsored upper-class business club with no real clout in world affairs but with dreams of being the seat of one world government. 

Exactly - I am not saying Trump was good, but he was right about the UN - they are basically a bloated bureaucracy that should have its funding drastically cut.  They are about as effective as the Pope - they both do not solve the problem. If ever there was a good reason for the UN to 'get off their fat arses and do something' then Myanmar is it. 

[9S_]

1 hour ago, Viggen840 said:

I have read your diatribe with interest and conclude that you are a person with a) strong anti-Myanmar sentiment, b) misplaced islamic sentiment, or c) just a bleeding heart with nothing better to do. "ask the Rohingya who they blame"? Of COURSE they are blameless! Just ask them! Who is always the first to pull the victim card (hint: it rhymes with muslims). Video of Buddhists being shot and burned, Myanmar civilians being murdered... SHE condoned all that? And then you bring out your glowing chestnut - the US State Department (rolled around on the floor laughing when I read that). Next you will be saying this was in concert with the CIA!

Yes she did according to the UN’s own Human Rights fact finding mission: 

Concluding: “Through their [Suu Kyi’s Government] acts and omission, the civilian authorities have contributed to the commission of atrocity crimes”

I dont have anti-Myanmar bias. I actually prefer Myanmar women over Thai women or any other women in general. They possess exotic oriental looks, they retain traditional feminism values (not the modern independent feminist values) and I prefer their university uniforms over Thai ones! Tradition is sexy ASF!

Who doesn’t love progressive Islamic Indonesian women? First time going out with a Muslim who looks Chinese!

I hate genocide. Those who commit it. Those who are silent when it happens and those who contribute to it like Ann Suu Kyi. She’s just as guilty as the generals and to say she is innocent is reckless

[stevenkongju]

10 minutes ago, 9S_ said:

She purged her party of all Islamic representatives by barring them from running for office. Why?

Pragmatism sucks sometimes. I disagree with the NLD's decision. You ask why they did it. First, the NLD, the party that Suu Kyi leads has many Muslims in it, was she secretly anti-Islam the whole time? Win Mya Mya, the Muslim member of the NLD who was wounded, nowhere says she thinks Aung San Suu Kyi is anti- Muslim. In fact, nowhere in your Guardian article does anyone accuse Aung San Suu Kyi of being anti-Muslim.

Post election politics is why the choice was made. This decision to not to run Muslim candidates should be seen in that context. Already facing what will almost certainly be bruising negotiations with the army in the post-election period, the NLD decided not to pick a fight with any of the monks.

 

Next, The Independent Article:  

24 minutes ago, 9S_ said:

When being interviewed by a Muslim, Ann Suu Kyi said: “Nobody told me I was going to be interviewed by a muslim!” What kind of person says this?

First, it was "reported that she said that", "it has been claimed" that she said it, not, "it was recorded that she said that". Who heard her say it?

And according to an excerpt in the book by Peter Popham, The Lady And The Generals: Aung San Suu Kyi And Burma’s Struggle For Freedom, Suu Kyi was so incensed about being challenged that she reportedly said off-air: “No one told me I was going to be interviewed by a Muslim.“

32 minutes ago, 9S_ said:

She has repeatedly denied the existence of ethnic cleansing.

Yes, she denied "ethnic cleansing". She never denied that muslims were being murdered and attacked. I think she was wrong. There was ethnic cleansing by the military, which, once again, she has no control over. And again my point. If she accused the military of ethnic cleansing the NLD very well could have been banned again.

And what do you even mean when you say, "Please show me proof that..." some organization or group that blames Aung San Suu Kyi for genocide, doesn't blame Aung San Suu Kyi for genocide.

Regarding the Free Burma Coalition and Zarni:  From Wikipedia (which I do not take as gospel):  

In 2003, Zarni started to express publicly his growing disillusionment with Aung San Suu Kyi's leadership and her policy of sanctions and boycotts. He also attacked what he viewed as the "self-serving ways" of many of his former fellow activists in the Free Burma Coalition and the movement in general. Newspapers inside Burma documented that Zarni had met with members of the military junta during this time. Because, even prior to his perceived coziness with the military and USDP (the political party of the military), Zarni had been regarded by the core network of democracy activists inside Burma as largely an opportunistic fraud, who had not even been in Burma during the 1998 protests, it led to strained relationships between Zarni and other activists. It was unclear whether Zarni expressed his supposed disillusionment of Aung San Suu Kyi's policy only after he was largely ostracized by democracy activists inside the country. It is also unclear whether his meetings with the military fed into his change of heart about sanctions and what relationship he continues to have with the military and its main political party. 

Zarni and a group of Western-educated Burmese dissidents explored alternatives to what they termed as "the sanctions and boycott orthodoxy." In 2003, Zarni switched his position and started to claim that economic sanctions and political pressure by Western countries on Burma was counter-productive and futile as long as China, India, Thailand and other Asian countries continued to do business with and provide political support to the ruling regime.

Following Zarni's change in policy, the staff and virtually all the group's supporters and funders left the Free Burma Coalition and founded the U.S. Campaign for Burma, which maintains the Free Burma Coalition's mission and policies.

More recently, Zarni has recreated himself as an activist, who is the leading voice on social media, in the various transnational campaigns and movements, which claim to advocate for the Rohingya. He has, once again, switched his position, and now advocates for new sanctions to be placed on Burma. 

The Free Burma Coalition is now largely moribund, with Zarni as the organization's sole spokesperson. Moreover, Zarni now advocates to have Aung San Suu Kyi and other democracy activists inside the country be put on trial in international criminal court for crimes against humanity against the Rohingya. The same individuals and groups that he advocated to "free" previously are now, in his opinion, "genocidal", and deserving of being imprisoned.

 

[stevenkongju]

9 minutes ago, 9S_ said:

There is no proof of genocide in Rohingya.

I certainly never said the was no proof of genocide. As a matter of fact, I said there was genocide and ethnic cleansing.

 

 

I said the perpatrators where the Myanmar military (Tatmadaw) which Aung San Suu Kyi does not control.

You argue in circles my friend.

Edited October 4, 2021 by stevenkongju
No change