News Forum - Final arguments Tuesday on dual pricing suit against Health Ministry

[Bob20]

1 minute ago, AdvocatusDiaboli said:

Hey your taking your job as assistant health minister way to seriously . I may have to do a government move on you and push you to the back benches closer to the door, and loo

Ah, but I've got friends here now. Better hope it's only Sinovac in that shot

[Stonker]

44 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

Could it be that Dimitri is simply confusing "immigrant" and "resident"?

No,  he's confusing "living in" and "resident".  As I said.

35 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

But if for 30 years this is his "home" then he is definitely a resident here.

100% "definitely" incorrect, @Bob20.

Regardless of whether he's been here for 30 years and this is his "home", he is NOT "a resident here" as that doesn't make him "resident" or give him residency here or in any other country.

To be classed as "a resident" you need residency status, and you don't get that just by living somewhere - at least not on this planet.

[AdvocatusDiaboli]

2 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

but I've got friends here now

But aren’t ALL your Friends all on your ignore list?

[AdvocatusDiaboli]

2 minutes ago, Stonker said:

To be classed as "a resident" you need residency status, and you don't get that just by living somewhere - at least not on this planet.

There are a few in Thailand that will be here years without a visa, without residency, and with citizenship. Just so happens though that their accommodation in the correctional facilities stink. The sort of residency you have without really having residency.

[Bob20]

1 minute ago, AdvocatusDiaboli said:

But aren’t ALL your Friends all on your ignore list?

No, the ignored clan members don't like any vaccine, not even Sinovac (oh hell, now I said it 3 times, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice ) nor do they like the government... 

[Stonker]

41 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

Well, reread it again

In England the NHS is free at point of delivery, but any foreign visitor can't expect the same and otherwise call it discriminatory.

.

Foreigner: I want free treatment same as the UK residents

NHS: No! You have to pay!

Foreigner: That's discrimination!!

.

I can explain it with LEGO too

Sorry, @Bob20, I've no idea what language you're speaking but forum rules specify English only.

The NHS is NOT "free at point of delivery" as you clearly wrote, with no caveat.

Sorry, but I'm not interested in playing puerile ping-pong over your mistakes.

[gummy]

11 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

No, the ignored clan members don't like any vaccine, not even Sinovac (oh hell, now I said it 3 times, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice ) nor do they like the government... 

The possibly don't like anybody other than themselves anyway

[Bob20]

21 minutes ago, Stonker said:

Sorry, @Bob20, I've no idea what language you're speaking but forum rules specify English only.

The NHS is NOT "free at point of delivery" as you clearly wrote, with on caveat.

Sorry, but I'm not interested in playing ping-pong over your mistakes.

You have yet once to give in to your own misunderstandings and that's why it's been so quiet, because I blocked you like many others.

Not because you don't make valid points, but do so in an often thoroughly unpleasant way even if you're on the same team.

It is completely clear what I mean, and it is yet again clear that we agree as well. But you simply must pick at anything at all or in the end blame the other party while everyone else is laughing their heads off and understood it immediately from the first post.

NHS treatment is free to UK residents at the point of delivery (some things like elective surgery, dental treatment etc. excluded)

It is not free to foreigner visitors (even the previous reciprocal E111 for EU members was retracted after Brexit)

And if they claim that it is discrimination to have to pay they are deluded.

It's better quiet with you blocked.

[Stonker]

3 hours ago, Bob20 said:

... because I blocked you like many others.

Yours must be a very limited forum view with so many other posters blocked.

... and since nobody's quoted me on anything you've replied to here, if you had indeed blocked me you wouldn't have seen any of those posts.

Sadly, that has to add a rather obvious question mark over your  honesty to your other issues.

[sputnik]

On 9/18/2021 at 6:23 AM, Stonker said:

Andy Hall vs Thailand's Natural Fruit Co springs to mind.

https://www.lrwc.org/thailand-supreme-court-clears-andy-hall-in-natural-fruit-case/

hope he got the funds...doubt it as a sheppard

[mickkotlarski]

On 9/17/2021 at 8:34 PM, Marc26 said:

A couple things
You choose to live in a country with real no status. I think of a "public" hospital as a hospital for people who pay into the system and are residents/citizens.

As for the never-ending dual pricing complaint.............we have it in all our countries. Every country has resident pricing vs non-resident pricing

Strange how you say ALL our countries. Kindly think again because I have worked/traveled/lived in over 32 nations and the only in your face dual pricing was in Gabon and Kenya. As for "no real status" on this I agree. Unlike the so called "ALL our countries" Thailand does not allow dual citizenship. Unless you pay millions to acquire that status have a very close friend in Immigration then  "no real status" goes hand in hand with the dual pricing and automatic transfer of inheritance % to Thai spouse relatives should your Thai spouse die.

But again that is not because of discrimination but because I am Farang.  As I said Mr.Buse has lost already even before entering the courtroom to fight for a constitutional right. 

[Soidog]

On 9/17/2021 at 10:07 PM, Marc26 said:

There is dual pricing all over the world 

Residents and citizens get all sort of discounts on museums, parks, transportation, ski mountains

Pick any country and I guarantee you will find instances where they have resident/city discounts at all types of attractions

I’ll pick the U.K.  I’m not aware of any dual pricing. Foreigners even get in to large museums and many other attractions such as public art galleries for free. I’ve never seen a price board showing a price for British nationals and one for “Aliens”. 

[Soidog]

8 hours ago, mickkotlarski said:

But again that is not because of discrimination but because I am Farang.  As I said Mr.Buse has lost already even before entering the courtroom to fight for a constitutional right.

I think it depends on the context of lost. Technically he may not get the judgement he maybe hopes for. In that sense he has lost. But if he knows this already, and his real objective is to raise the profile of this discriminatory practice, then he’s already won. It’s a shame more high profile visitors don’t challenge this. Bill Gates managed to get a fair few kilometres of underground cable installed (until they lost interest) just for making a negative comment about the overhead infrastructure. 

[Soidog]

15 hours ago, Bob20 said:

You have yet once to give in to your own misunderstandings and that's why it's been so quiet, because I blocked you like many others.

Not because you don't make valid points, but do so in an often thoroughly unpleasant way even if you're on the same team.

It is completely clear what I mean, and it is yet again clear that we agree as well. But you simply must pick at anything at all or in the end blame the other party while everyone else is laughing their heads off and understood it immediately from the first post.

NHS treatment is free to UK residents at the point of delivery (some things like elective surgery, dental treatment etc. excluded)

It is not free to foreigner visitors (even the previous reciprocal E111 for EU members was retracted after Brexit)

And if they claim that it is discrimination to have to pay they are deluded.

It's better quiet with you blocked.

It is indeed a shame this person has not learned to disagree without being disagreeable. I also find he can make some very valid and informative points. But there’s a right way and a wrong way to do that in a civilised conversation. I’ve also had to block him just to get the background noise under control.
 

Come on @Stonker, give the attitude a rest and let’s all get along. I for one would like to hear what you have to say, without the constant nitpicking and deliberate dissection and inane point scoring.  Please. 

[mickkotlarski]

3 hours ago, Soidog said:

I think it depends on the context of lost. Technically he may not get the judgement he maybe hopes for. In that sense he has lost. But if he knows this already, and his real objective is to raise the profile of this discriminatory practice, then he’s already won. It’s a shame more high profile visitors don’t challenge this. Bill Gates managed to get a fair few kilometres of underground cable installed (until they lost interest) just for making a negative comment about the overhead infrastructure. 

Agreed Soidog. Although the result of the case may be a loss. But increased exposure will bring more pressure to those that discriminate. Many Thais disagree with the over pricing and those that do overcharge feel embarrassment when their actions go public.

You raised a good point.

[Stonker]

12 hours ago, mickkotlarski said:

...Thailand does not allow dual citizenship. 

I don't want to appear to disagree for the sake of it, but 'yes' it does, whether you're Thai by birth or naturalised.

[Stonker]

4 hours ago, Soidog said:

I’ll pick the U.K.  I’m not aware of any dual pricing. 

Sorry to disagree if it offends you so much, but "resident / city discounts", which you quoted @Marc26 saying, are standard practice across the UK - Transport for London passes are an obvious example.

The NHS is another example of dual pricing but by nationality, not residency. The requirements for proof of being "ordinarily resident" are very different for British nationals to foreigners, with far less required from Brits, and Brits don't face the same mandatory "surcharge" many foreigners do even if they're paying UK taxes and they never use the NHS. 

I hate to think how crowded the outrage bus would be if Thailand charged all foreigners working here another 30,000 baht every year for health coverage, on top of their taxes, payable in advance with their visa application, but that's exactly what the UK does.

https://www.gov.uk/healthcare-immigration-application

https://www.londoncouncils.gov.uk/services/freedom-pass

[Griff1315]

4 hours ago, Soidog said:

I’ll pick the U.K.  I’m not aware of any dual pricing. Foreigners even get in to large museums and many other attractions such as public art galleries for free. I’ve never seen a price board showing a price for British nationals and one for “Aliens”. 

Your right spot on dual pricing for entry to any attractions would be classed as racist and with the UK falling over itself trying to show there is no inbeded racism within the UK.

[Stonker]

Perfectly legal and acceptable for restaurants in Bruges to add 10% to the bill for foreigners -

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jun/27/the-chips-are-up-bruges-cafes-charge-tourists-extra-10

- imagine the crowds on the outrage bus if that happened here!

[Stonker]

22 minutes ago, Griff1315 said:

Your right spot on dual pricing for entry to any attractions would be classed as racist and with the UK falling over itself trying to show there is no inbeded racism within the UK.

Except he's not !

You're also confusing "racism" with nationalism / nationality although the two are very different.

[Griff1315]

14 minutes ago, Stonker said:

Except he's not !

You're also confusing "racism" with nationalism / nationality although the two are very different.

You will never see a Entry board to an attraction like this in the UK...

[Stonker]

35 minutes ago, Griff1315 said:

You will never see a Entry board to an attraction like this in the UK...

On a board, open, honest and clear for all to see?

Possibly not.

Clearly spelt out rather less publicly, though ...

https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/congestion-charge

 

https://www.gov.uk/healthcare-immigration-application

https://www.londoncouncils.gov.uk/services/freedom-pass

... and those are all gov.uk sites, like many others.

Edit:

as for "attractions" such as museums

https://ticketfeed.ltmuseum.co.uk/en-GB/memberships/annual pass/info

 

 

[Yinn]

1 hour ago, Stonker said:

I hate to think how crowded the outrage bus would be

Outrage bus!!! 5555555555 

So funny!!! 55555555

[Fluke]

1 hour ago, Griff1315 said:

You will never see a Entry board to an attraction like this in the UK...

Does the U.K have a park called Khao Sok ?

[Griff1315]

28 minutes ago, Stonker said:

On a board, open, honest and clear for all to see?

Possibly not.

Clearly spelt out rather less publicly, though ...

https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/congestion-charge

https://www.gov.uk/healthcare-immigration-application

https://www.londoncouncils.gov.uk/services/freedom-pass

... and those are all gov.uk sites, like many others.

Edit:

as for "attractions" such as museums

https://ticketfeed.ltmuseum.co.uk/en-GB/memberships/annual pass/info

Congestion charge is paid by all except residents not really dual pricing is it.

Healthcare as part of a visa or residency application is not really dual pricing is it. We all pay for our health care through taxes and national insurance so if your new to the country it's only reasonable to ask for something. Although do you think all the economic migrants landing on the beaches in Dover or the thousands of Afghans that have come pay for healthcare. No.

Travel passes for London and the museum entry are residential based discounts based on council tax paid from being a resident of that borough.

We can all seek and discover cases of what might be deemed as dual pricing but not as blatant as here in Thailand. Weather it's an official all upfront and honest sign or the skin tax that is widely used by some not all Thais against foreigners.