News Forum - Public Health Ministry defends October 1 reopening

[Thaiger]

It’s been nearly an hour since The Thaiger has published an article on the potential/definite/impossible reopening of Thailand and it’s various provinces, so it’s time for an update. The Public Health Ministry has responded to criticism that the reopening of Bangkok and 4 other provinces on October 1 is premature and ill-advised. Public Health Minister Anutin Charnvirakul responded to charges from academics that the risks and methods for reopening have not been properly assessed. He says that, in cooperation with the Department of Medical Affairs and the Department of Disease Control, the Ministry of Public Health has been conducting Emergency […]

The post Public Health Ministry defends October 1 reopening appeared first on Thaiger News.

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[DoUKnowWhoIAm]

11 minutes ago, Thaiger said:

he says it is essential to reopen

Yes, of course. But WHEN??? 

[Bob20]

Ah, now I understand.

That's okay then. 

They were 177 "mild" fatalities.

[Griff1315]

8 minutes ago, yetanother said:

"Anutin points to a win where Thailand’s daily new Covid-19 infections have finally fallen below 15,000 in the past few days, down from a high of nearly 25,000 last month. He urged people not to be worried that the Covid-19 number are still unreasonably high,"

this is from one of 'our leaders' ? 

you have to be kidding;

this is just another "all is well" from a guy that we have grown to distrust in everything he says and does

It's a shame that when he pointed to a win in reduction of case numbers someone didn't ask him to quote the test numbers and maybe the antigen tests that are not included in the numbers.

Scared too upset him or what?

[ThailandRyan]

And yet if you were a foreign reporter looking from the outside in and saw what the rest of the world is seeing you would be skeptical as well for an October 1 Opening.

Apparently I can not use the paper I linked to which the following information came from:

"Adding to the stupidity was the fact that Phiphat met with Aswin on Monday but Anutin was not there, which allowed him to simply brush the issue aside later.

Aswin also came out on Friday to denied that he had agreed with Phiphat on the date.

The Bangkok Metropolitan Administration “never said” the capital would reopen by 15 October, he said. “We have to fully vaccinate more than 70 per cent of the population then we can talk.”

“No one else can make this decision for me and my decision is final,” he said.

Aswin said Friday the capital is on track to reach 70-per-cent vaccination level by October 22, but might get there as early as October 10 if efforts are accelerated.

Seeing this mess, it’s easy to see that both Anutin and Aswin are basically trying to avoid being blamed in case the reopening plan backfires and leads to a fourth wave.

There is a lot riding on this issue, so it is getting a lot of attention. The entire tourism industry is dying, and this could be another lifeline after the Phuket Sandbox.

It would be a start for the two ministers and the governor to agree on a reopening date in order to build confidence, but this government is unable to do even that.

No wonder they are laughing at us."

 

Edited September 17, 2021 by Faz
link removed

[Manu]

1 hour ago, Bob20 said:

Ah, now I understand.

That's okay then. 

They were 177 "mild" fatalities.

In the articles it says "reminding that the majority of new infections are very mild or asymptomatic, and infection numbers are trending downward"... so "the majority", not ALL!!

People need to start to understand that vaccinated or not, covid will continue to kill. Once this is admitted, le's concentrate on the most vulnerable and get on with our lives.

14 Sept. in the UK (last numbers available currently), which has roughly the same amount of population than Thailand: 185 deaths, 29 873 new cases, over 70% vaccinated: looks like now this is the best we are going to get unless we just stay home never to go out again forever.

[Bob20]

8 minutes ago, Manu said:

In the articles it says "reminding that the majority of new infections are very mild or asymptomatic, and infection numbers are trending downward"... so "the majority", not ALL!!

People need to start to understand that vaccinated or not, covid will continue to kill. Once this is admitted, le's concentrate on the most vulnerable and get on with our lives.

14 Sept. in the UK (last numbers available currently), which has roughly the same amount of population than Thailand: 185 deaths, 29 873 new cases, over 70% vaccinated: looks like now this is the best we are going to get unless we just stay home never to go out again forever.

Hi Manu, most recognise my ironic/sarcastic comments. It was a play of words on "mild". Nothing mild about death.

And no, you can't compare us with the UK. Yes, similar numbers of deaths as Thailand, but in the UK society is free again. Everything is open and people are living their lives more as less like before Covid. I

f you did that here in Thailand with low vaccination levels, the deaths would be in the thousands every day!

BTW the hospitals in the UK are not as busy as before. And the ones that are in hospital are mostly the unvaccinated.

[Poolie]

8 minutes ago, Manu said:

In the articles it says "reminding that the majority of new infections are very mild or asymptomatic, and infection numbers are trending downward"... so "the majority", not ALL!!

People need to start to understand that vaccinated or not, covid will continue to kill. Once this is admitted, le's concentrate on the most vulnerable and get on with our lives.

14 Sept. in the UK (last numbers available currently), which has roughly the same amount of population than Thailand: 185 deaths, 29 873 new cases, over 70% vaccinated: looks like now this is the best we are going to get unless we just stay home never to go out again forever.

Yup, that's the way it's going to go.

So, what are you going to do? I'll go for it.

[Soidog]

Reading through all these articles in reopening and many of the informative and amuzing posts from members, has left me dizzy. A few times I was going to post something, only to find I had already said it many times before, or many other members had done so. 
 

There are simply NO words to express my feelings about all of this. It is staggering how a reasonably well developed, middle income country such as Thailand can function with such imbeciles in charge. The way they function and communicate is beyond shameful. It’s beyond embarrassing. It’s beyond incompetent and it’s beyond a joke. Your poor average Thai has to tolerate the ineptitude these people inflict on them on a daily basis.
 

Most of us here are focused on travel, tourism and things that directly affect the tourist or expat life. Can you imagine having to live with this utter shambles from the day you are born or when you are trying to raise a family, educate your children and provide a future for them? Trying to establish and run a business and invest your money and depend on healthcare provided by state. Is it any wonder most Thais just close their mind to what is going on around them and in other parts of the world and just get on with thier life? To open their minds and look at other developed nations and what they achieve must be so so painful. It’s easier to shut your mind down and tell yourself everything is wonderful.  
 

My god, those of us who hold a passport from a developed country should think ourselves extreamly lucky. I for one will never place my future entirely at the mercy of these bafoons. 

[AdvocatusDiaboli]

43 minutes ago, Manu said:

In the articles it says "reminding that the majority of new infections are very mild or asymptomatic, and infection numbers are trending downward"... so "the majority", not ALL!!

In the same article … 

The Health Minister concedes that, from a medical perspective, it may be too early and inappropriate to push forward with reopening the country, as Covid-19 is increasing in many areas and still problematic even in places where infections are decreasing.

But just today, they are trending upwards in the correctional facilities. 
So as per normal, the Thai statistics are provided to the media by the TAT (sarcasm). Learn to live with a grain of salt when reading their figures and statistics.

[DrPhibes]

About says it:

 

[Andrew Reeve]

Several post and images have been removed as they were not on the subject of the thread

Public Health Ministry defends October 1 reopening

 

[Manu]

2 hours ago, Bob20 said:

Hi Manu, most recognise my ironic/sarcastic comments. It was a play of words on "mild". Nothing mild about death.

And no, you can't compare us with the UK. Yes, similar numbers of deaths as Thailand, but in the UK society is free again. Everything is open and people are living their lives more as less like before Covid. I

f you did that here in Thailand with low vaccination levels, the deaths would be in the thousands every day!

BTW the hospitals in the UK are not as busy as before. And the ones that are in hospital are mostly the unvaccinated.

Yes, it is recognised by myself too, do not worry, I took this sentence out to make a point.

I do not see why 2 countries with almost the same amount of population cannot be compared. I know how it is in the UK cause that is where I have been since July. I am back to Thailand next month via the Phuket Sandbox cause, yes, I will be fully vaccinated then.

I very doubt that the current restrictions in Thailand are the reason why deaths are not going already in the 1000s. I do not think they make any difference, I do not think deaths would be much higher if everything would be open (not talking about the borders, there I do not have an opinion). I believe it would be pretty much the same. Last winter the 10 000s deaths in the UK for example can be explained different ways, the main one being the bad health of british people generally where 1 in every 4 adults and around 1 in every 5 children are obese. And it was a different variant, the current Indian one in the UK and Thailand being described by so many scientists as not as lethal that is not even an argument anymore. But it is very transmissible hence the outbreak all over SE Asia, and by the way, regardless if you are vaccinated or not.

In the UK, if you have covid, even with symptoms, you are sent home with paracetamol, not in Thailand. You cannot even see a GP, you just wait until you are very bad or it just goes away, which it does for 95% of them and has from the start, vaccinated or not. In Thailand, you go to hospital where you are treated.

Finally, NOT true at all and as those vaccines are getting weaker after a few months, more and more vaccinated people indeed end in hospital. And the ones who die are always the same ones: the ederlies, the obese people and people with severe comorbidities. VACCINATED OR NOT. Hence the 3rd jab / boost for these exact groups of people, in the UK but also Isreal, US, etc.... As for the hypothetical "herd immunity", even mainstream media do not even mention it anymore...

So my point being, again and again: vaccinate the most vulnerable (and leave the kids and young people alone), treat all patients with early treatments and let's get on with lives. Now!! It is not about being pro/anti whatever, it is about being rational again in order to stop this madness that has killed and will kill far more people if life (social, economic, human, ...) does not get back to normal.

[Bob20]

24 minutes ago, Manu said:

Yes, it is recognised by myself too, do not worry, I took this sentence out to make a point.

I do not see why 2 countries with almost the same amount of population cannot be compared. I know how it is in the UK cause that is where I have been since July. I am back to Thailand next month via the Phuket Sandbox cause, yes, I will be fully vaccinated then.

Because the UK has a high level of vaccination and Thailand has a low level of vaccination.

And both use mostly very different vaccines.

I very doubt that the current restrictions in Thailand are the reason why deaths are not going already in the 1000s. I do not think they make any difference, I do not think deaths would be much higher if everything would be open (not talking about the borders, there I do not have an opinion). I believe it would be pretty much the same. Last winter the 10 000s deaths in the UK for example can be explained different ways, the main one being the bad health of british people generally where 1 in every 4 adults and around 1 in every 5 children are obese. And it was a different variant, the current Indian one in the UK and Thailand being described by so many scientists as not as lethal that is not even an argument anymore. But it is very transmissible hence the outbreak all over SE Asia, and by the way, regardless if you are vaccinated or not.

Thailand had 80 (YES EIGHTY) deaths until April this year. Then they let go of the restrictions... Then reinstated them and eased them a bit again recently. In the first 14 months we had 80 deaths. In the last 5 months e had 15.000 deaths. You don't think that letting go of the restrictions and letting people move and spread the virus made a difference? The facts say differently...

In the UK, if you have covid, even with symptoms, you are sent home with paracetamol, not in Thailand. You cannot even see a GP, you just wait until you are very bad or it just goes away, which it does for 95% of them and has from the start, vaccinated or not. In Thailand, you go to hospital where you are treated.

That's not correct. You can find all info on the Forum. Different regions deal with it differently.

Finally, NOT true at all and as those vaccines are getting weaker after a few months, more and more vaccinated people indeed end in hospital. And the ones who die are always the same ones: the ederlies, the obese people and people with severe comorbidities. VACCINATED OR NOT. Hence the 3rd jab / boost for these exact groups of people, in the UK but also Isreal, US, etc.... As for the hypothetical "herd immunity", even mainstream media do not even mention it anymore...

Sorry, but that simply isn't true. In the UK most people in hospital are UNvaccinated and nearly all deaths occur in UNvaccinated people.

Here in Thailand you need to take into account that they used Sinovac, which according to the manufacturer has a maximum effectiveness of 51% two weeks after the second shot and is less effective against Delta variant. In the UK you've had better vaccines, more effective to Delta as well.

And herd immunity won't happen at all, but if most are vaccinated, fewer people get sick or die.

So my point being, again and again: vaccinate the most vulnerable (and leave the kids and young people alone), treat all patients with early treatments and let's get on with lives. Now!! It is not about being pro/anti whatever, it is about being rational again in order to stop this madness that has killed and will kill far more people if life (social, economic, human, ...) does not get back to normal.

I agree with your point about children, although in the UK they have the option for vaccination too, as it has a small overall positive effect.

The rest really is nonsense. You can not move on with life and create large people movements in a country like Thailand where most people are UNvaccinated. Movements spread the virus and the unvaccinated now have the same chance of getting seriously sick or die as last year.

The movements, just as in the UK, are only possible when most have had the jabs and spreading the virus does not have a large effect on the people anymore, because they received the vaccine.

As I said, we discussed this here many times already, so I'm not going into further discussion, but you can find everything I wrote confirmed in the forum.

 

[Bob20]

3 hours ago, Soidog said:

Reading through all these articles in reopening and many of the informative and amuzing posts from members, has left me dizzy. A few times I was going to post something, only to find I had already said it many times before, or many other members had done so. 
 

There are simply NO words to express my feelings about all of this. It is staggering how a reasonably well developed, middle income country such as Thailand can function with such imbeciles in charge. The way they function and communicate is beyond shameful. It’s beyond embarrassing. It’s beyond incompetent and it’s beyond a joke. Your poor average Thai has to tolerate the ineptitude these people inflict on them on a daily basis.
 

Most of us here are focused on travel, tourism and things that directly affect the tourist or expat life. Can you imagine having to live with this utter shambles from the day you are born or when you are trying to raise a family, educate your children and provide a future for them? Trying to establish and run a business and invest your money and depend on healthcare provided by state. Is it any wonder most Thais just close their mind to what is going on around them and in other parts of the world and just get on with thier life? To open their minds and look at other developed nations and what they achieve must be so so painful. It’s easier to shut your mind down and tell yourself everything is wonderful.  
 

My god, those of us who hold a passport from a developed country should think ourselves extreamly lucky. I for one will never place my future entirely at the mercy of these bafoons. 

Yes, it's on/off, 1 October / 15 October / no I didn't say anything / who said that?

It really doesn't look like they have a clue what's going on.

Or it's masterfully orchestrated to look like that.

No, I'll go with the first option

[ace035]

Mr. Anutin has no clue what's going on & seems like he panicked already before the reopening but I am sure that it will delay the reopening till Oct 15 as per announced by PM. Very slow on mass vaccination. Even though Thailand reach it's 70% vaccination by December, that does not mean there will be no cases anymore.

[PapayaBokBok]

Dear Thailand, The World is Watching......your true colors are showing....as the well runs even drier...

[pascal]

well ....what ever they say or do, when ever they reopen .... what will be the tourists minds????? do they expect a rush? and billion of devise ? this virus will be there for quite sometimes, peoples will think twice before to travel, even vaccinated you can catch this crap .....  maybe in a plane on your way to holidays and you are sick at arrival and spend your off weeks unwell and most likely go back in same conditions ...... as far as i saw with phuket trial, the idea has failed .... it should be wise to know the real impact of 70 or 80 % of the population vaccinated. Referring to Israel which did reach this quota ....... it does not sounds good ...... some wise peoples said almost 2 years ago, it might take more than 2 years to recover and see the sky open again to travel, i did not want to believe at that time, but it means it is exactly what is going to be , even more maybe.

[JamesE]

14 hours ago, Bob20 said:

Ah, now I understand.

That's okay then. 

They were 177 "mild" fatalities.

Asymptomatic, in the end.

[HiuMak]

17 hours ago, Thaiger said:

It’s been nearly an hour since The Thaiger has published an article on the potential/definite/impossible reopening of Thailand and it’s various provinces, so it’s time for an update. The Public Health Ministry has responded to criticism that the reopening of Bangkok and 4 other provinces on October 1 is premature and ill-advised. Public Health Minister Anutin Charnvirakul responded to charges from academics that the risks and methods for reopening have not been properly assessed. He says that, in cooperation with the Department of Medical Affairs and the Department of Disease Control, the Ministry of Public Health has been conducting Emergency […]

The post Public Health Ministry defends October 1 reopening appeared first on Thaiger News.

Read the full story

He who swings with praise when there is little achievements, while recedes into a hole when the tide is strong. A rider with the wind of change. His words has no strength on me and his remarks betray an utter contempt for the truth. 

[Poolie]

3 hours ago, HiuMak said:

He who swings with praise when there is little achievements, while recedes into a hole when the tide is strong. A rider with the wind of change. His words has no strength on me and his remarks betray an utter contempt for the truth. 

Was that Frank Bruno?

[Jason]

The opening by October 1 was very optimistic. In fact, it's irresponsible when you consider how frail the Thai hospital system. It would overwhelmed by the case load. Interestingly, this pandemic is now the pandemic of the unvacccinated in many countries and the real issue is being able to hospitalise the unvaccinated who contract the virus.

[DiJoDavO]

I wonder what would happen if everyone just opened up their stores and not listen anymore. What are they going to do? Put everyone in jail? 

[Bob20]

Just now, DiJoDavO said:

I wonder what would happen if everyone just opened up their stores and not listen anymore. What are they going to do? Put everyone in jail? 

Do you really think people only comply because of fear for the authorities?

Or you think maybe they realise that there's a reason 5m people have died of this virus, that it's not so harmless and it may just be a good idea to avoid catching it?

[DiJoDavO]

7 minutes ago, Bob20 said:

Do you really think people only comply because of fear for the authorities?

Just wait for the moment everything opens up. Then you'll see who still cares. The only reason Covid is so scary, is the media reporting it. 

If I would believe the news, I'd crawl under my bed with a baseball bat, being afraid of literally everything. 

If the news was right, I'd have had covid 20x already and died 25x of it. Apart from a mask, I didn't do anything to prevent getting Covid. 

Have you watched the news? Haven't you seen how many of their claims have been debunked (before by "conspiracy theorists" ) but nowadays actually by themselves. And everyone is acting like it's just fine.

Look at people who got better from Covid thanks to certain medicines. They say these people are terrible for taking medicines that make them feel better. Literally. 

They are not like, hey! Wow! We have solved this pandemic now! 

No, instead they are telling reasons why you shouldn't take it and ridicule it. 

Also,no one is teaching people how to keep your immune system up to date. That's literally the most important thing here, and nobody talks about it.