News Forum - Australia and New Zealand consider just living with Covid-19

[Thaiger]

With Covid-19 on the rise in Australia and New Zealand, officials in both countries have hinted at moving away from a strategy of eliminating the virus and instead learning to live with it. Australia has daily infection numbers nearing 1,000, setting new records each day and, while New Zealand had long avoided Covid-19 outbreaks, today the country reported 62 new cases, 210 total cases in the current outbreak there. The numbers are relatively low compared to many parts of the world but still cause for concern for the countries that had been reasonably successful in containing and avoiding Covid-19 outbreaks. […]

The post Australia and New Zealand consider just living with Covid-19 appeared first on Thaiger News.

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[HappyExpat]

I reported earlier that the Spanish Flu eventually mutated to a "kinder, gentler" virus. A successful virus doesn't kill off all its hosts, though viruses are not technically alive so this isn't a conscious process. There was never an ultimate cure.

Having said that, I got my first Pfizer jab yesterday, will get the 2nd 15 Sep and will get a booster if available. Covering all my bets!

[9S_]

8 hours ago, Thaiger said:

Australia has daily infection numbers nearing 1,000, setting new records each day

It’s because they had that dumb protests during the delta wave. It’s like the BLM’s deadly riots. Cases shot up after their deadly rampage. 
 

You gather in large groups during a pandemic against limiting social distancing orders, you’re going to see cases rise. 

[BraveNewFahrenheit]

LoL, they are in so far deep with zero covid it will be fun to see how they try to worm out of that strategy. Maybe destroying everyone's life to save a few people at the end of theirs is not such a great idea after all. Worst part of all of this is the vaccines they thought would be their savior are losing effectiveness every day.

[Shark]

10 minutes ago, HappyExpat said:

Having said that, I got my first Pfizer jab yesterday, will get the 2nd 15 Sep and will get a booster if available. Covering all my bets!

congrats.

I'll get a full cocktail as well as I've worked as a bartender in the past, AZ(2shots)+Pfizer(1 shot)+J&J sounds like a good mix to me.

[AussieBob]

15 minutes ago, HappyExpat said:

I reported earlier that the Spanish Flu eventually mutated to a "kinder, gentler" virus. A successful virus doesn't kill off all its hosts, though viruses are not technically alive so this isn't a conscious process. There was never an ultimate cure.

Having said that, I got my first Pfizer jab yesterday, will get the 2nd 15 Sep and will get a booster if available. Covering all my bets!

Yep - we both have said the same thing before - a virus only survives if it is able to coexist with the hosts, with the occasional flare up that comes and goes. Covid will be like Influenza A and B - it aint ever going away and the only strategy (besides avoiding sick/coughing children when very old) is to get the annual vaccine dose. Oh and of course 'clean living'

 

[AussieBob]

7 minutes ago, Shark said:

congrats.

I'll get a full cocktail as well as I've worked as a bartender in the past, AZ(2shots)+Pfizer(1 shot)+J&J sounds like a good mix to me.

Yep - get the AZ done first 8-12 weeks apart - and then 12+ weeks later get the Pfizer. 

By the following year there will be a combined vaccine dose covering most of the bases.

[Shark]

1 minute ago, AussieBob said:

Yep - get the AZ done first 8-12 weeks apart - and then 12+ weeks later get the Pfizer. 

By the following year there will be a combined vaccine dose covering most of the bases.

I'm actually in the AZ cycle which should be done in 4 weeks.
I seriously don't have a problem getting vaccinated, perhaps it even adds 5 years to my life :-).

[HiuMak]

15 minutes ago, 9S_ said:

It’s because they had that dumb protests during the delta wave. It’s like the BLM’s deadly riots. Cases shot up after their deadly rampage. 
 

You gather in large groups during a pandemic against limiting social distancing orders, you’re going to see cases rise. 

I don't see the protest in Bangkok and other parts of Thailand soar cases, in fact new cases went down. Must be the smoke bombs 

[AussieBob]

4 minutes ago, Shark said:

I'm actually in the AZ cycle which should be done in 4 weeks.
I seriously don't have a problem getting vaccinated, perhaps it even adds 5 years to my life :-).

5 years - or an extra head/leg - all good.  4.3 million dead from Covid, but if you get a needle to prevent serious illness in case you get Covid, apparently that is far too dangerous and could kill you.  And I am not driving in Thailand ever again either - 20,000+ die every year and over 500,000 end up in hospital. Etc etc etc.  Your life only has one ending - everything is a risk - and some risks are worth it. IMO a covid vaccination is a no brainer - so is having a life saving operation - just because some people die when under anaesthetic is not going to stop me.  But up to you - it is not compulsory (yet?).

[AussieBob]

9 minutes ago, HiuMak said:

I don't see the protest in Bangkok and other parts of Thailand soar cases, in fact new cases went down. Must be the smoke bombs 

The current cases are from the Songkran screw-up - millions of people travelling and being together in April. 

The cases from the current protests will get lost of the numbers overall over the next 2-6 weeks.

When all those large protests were held before, there was no outbreak as such in Thailand.  The country was doing very well with few cases (like in Aust) - and then the Delta mutation arrived

If the Aust total lockdowns and exclusions didnt stop the Delta mutation - then nothing will. Singapore did the same strategy - they are also now struggling.  Aust and Singapore do not have the huge numbers of Thailand, but their strategy is no longer working as well as it did before. Drop them completely and let it all go - no way because that will swamp the medical system. The only solution is to continue forward and get everyone vaccinated ASAP because they cannot hold back the floodwaters like they could before - but they still have to try and slow them down.  

 

[9S_]

22 minutes ago, HiuMak said:

I don't see the protest in Bangkok and other parts of Thailand soar cases, in fact new cases went down. Must be the smoke bombs 

You guys didn’t have full blown riots where people burned, murdered and looted for months or have unsafe massive protests seen in Australia. 
 

I’ll give credit where credit is due at least the thai protestors were smart enough to protest in their traffic jams. Or those few brave enough to speak out their discontent outside of that one monument. 

[noosard]

Australia has said after 70-80% vaccinated it will open up

but even those numbers have restrictions on what will happen

Much like everywhere else

[Zool]

Enough already. The entire world is in the grip of a death-cult, locked down for over a year and destroyed countless lives and businesses. Open up the world. Let the people who are afraid stay home and cry and hide under the covers but let the rest of the world go back to living. You would have to have the intelligence of a potato to think more of what hasn't worked so far, is going to work now.

[Ttalk]

8 minutes ago, noosard said:

Australia has said after 70-80% vaccinated it will open up

but even those numbers have restrictions on what will happen

Much like everywhere else

Australia and NZ want to follow in Israel's footsteps huh?  Vaccinate as many people as possible, then see cases and death go up in a few months  of a heavily vaccinated population (when antibodies wane), then tell everyone they need boosters while clamping down on freedoms.  Fantastic, keep those spikes coming.

At least these two countries are coming to their senses and realize that zero covid is imposible and their draconian measures are futile and pissing off the population.

[noosard]

Just read what NZ government thinks

Speaking on Monday, however, Jacinda Ardern was clear that New Zealand was sticking with the elimination strategy, an approach that the advisory group chaired by epidemiologist Sir David Skegg earlier this month urged the government to stick with as it inched towards reopening to the world.

[HiuMak]

23 minutes ago, noosard said:

Australia has said after 70-80% vaccinated it will open up

but even those numbers have restrictions on what will happen

Much like everywhere else

For a first world country, Australia and New Zealand's vaccination rate is pathetic, at 25% and 20% respectively. 

[Stardust]

1 hour ago, AussieBob said:

Yep - we both have said the same thing before - a virus only survives if it is able to coexist with the hosts, with the occasional flare up that comes and goes. Covid will be like Influenza A and B - it aint ever going away and the only strategy (besides avoiding sick/coughing children when very old) is to get the annual vaccine dose. Oh and of course 'clean living'

I agree on what you said but not with the clean living because I read reports from studies that this hyper disenfections and cleans destroy the imun system and can be very dangereous to get more sickness or even to get faster and a more heavy covid infection. You imun system should be trained all the time especially for the kids. So this hyper clean has a opposite effect and also people can get chronical allergies (low imunsystem) from that. Specialist warning already that this also can trigger in future heavy flu pandemics or other sickness.

[BlueSphinx]

1 hour ago, AussieBob said:

... The only solution is to continue forward and get everyone vaccinated ASAP because they cannot hold back the floodwaters like they could before - but they still have to try and slow them down.  

 

28 minutes ago, Ttalk said:

Australia and NZ want to follow in Israel's footsteps huh?  Vaccinate as many people as possible, then see cases and death go up in a few months  of a heavily vaccinated population (when antibodies wane), then tell everyone they need boosters while clamping down on freedoms.  Fantastic, keep those spikes coming. ...

@AussieBob > Imo @Ttalk nailed it perfectly.  Indeed, just look at what is happening in Israel, with almost 80% of the eligible population and 60% of the total population fully vaccinated.  Or Gibraltar with +99% of their population fully vaxxed. 

The uncomfortable truth - long known and warned for by virologists/epidemiologists, but over-ruled by Big Pharma greedy for making Big Bucks in this crisis - is that mass-vaccination actually triggers new variants that are more resistent or even immune to the vaccines. 

So not only can the vaccines not provide a permanent solution (hence the need for booster shots, that will once again trigger new variants), but they put the vaccinated at ever bigger risk with every new jab.  And this on top of the long-term vaccine adverse effects that nobody knows how that will pack out (but it sure does not look good...).

[KaptainRob]

1 minute ago, Stardust said:

I agree on what you said but not with the clean living because I read reports from studies that this hyper disenfections and cleans destroy the imun system and can be very dangereous to get more sickness or even to get faster and a more heavy covid infection. You imun system should be trained all the time especially for the kids. So this hyper clean has a opposite effect and also people can get chronical allergies (low imunsystem) from that. Specialist warning already that this also can trigger in future heavy flu pandemics or other sickness.

You are correct although clean living can also refer to diet and exercise.

We stopped buying those 'disinfectant' soaps and liquid hand washes such as Dettol, due to the chemical composition as they are seriously harmful.  I've also taught the wife not to use soap when showering 2 times out of 3 per day as that destroys too many necessary bacteria on the skin.  She still tastes and smells just as good. 

[BlueSphinx]

39 minutes ago, noosard said:

Just read what NZ government thinks

Speaking on Monday, however, Jacinda Ardern was clear that New Zealand was sticking with the elimination strategy, an approach that the advisory group chaired by epidemiologist Sir David Skegg earlier this month urged the government to stick with as it inched towards reopening to the world.

They cannot deny the reality forever, and I am pretty sure that behind their 'strong support for the impossible Zero-Covid approach' they are currently holding secret crisis-meetings on how they can sell to the population that their approach was a total failure without losing too much face. 

[BlueSphinx]

33 minutes ago, HiuMak said:

For a first world country, Australia and New Zealand's vaccination rate is pathetic, at 25% and 20% respectively. 

Maybe they start slowly realizing how lucky they are, that they only have a 25% and 20% vaccination rate.   Looking at what's happening in the highly-vaxxed countries and listening to the almost daily new bad news about the failure of the covid-vaccines, only a fool would not reconsider whether the approach chosen is the right one.

[Zool]

3 minutes ago, BlueSphinx said:

Maybe they start slowly realizing how lucky they are, that they only have a 25% and 20% vaccination rate.   Looking at what's happening in the highly-vaxxed countries and listening to the almost daily new bad news about the failure of the covid-vaccines, only a fool would not reconsider whether the approach chosen is the right one.

Yes, and that's not even considering the long term "side-effects" which could be quite serious, based on current information.

[SnapDragon]

59 minutes ago, HiuMak said:

For a first world country, Australia and New Zealand's vaccination rate is pathetic, at 25% and 20% respectively. 

If these figures are correct; 25 and 30%, the people should be applauded.

I've seen the footage of the police behaviour. It's not so good. But these countries (modern history) were built on dissenters; people who went against the narratives, and these traits are passed down the generations.

The actions of the authorities have been beamed all around the world now. There is no hiding the fact that these wonderful people are being ordered what to do by numpties, and the police thugs are doing their dirty work.

Ned Kelly will have a wistful smile on his face.

 

Edited August 26, 2021 by snapdragon

[Zool]

Just now, snapdragon said:

If these figures are correct; 25 and 30%, the people should be applauded.

I've seen the footage of the police behaviour. It's not so good. But these countries (modern history) were built on dissenters, and people who went against the narratives, and these traits are passed down the generations.

The actions of the authorities have been beamed all around the world now. There is no hiding the fact that these wonderful people are being ordered what to do by numpties, and the police thugs are doing their dirty work.

Ned Kelly will have a wistful smile on his face.

Not sure if you've seen the reports from Oz, the truckers are planning a countrywide strike to protest the draconian measures. They are possibly going to park thousands of trucks in places that will stop all traffic and will take 2 weeks to clear all the trucks. It's great to see Australia waking up.