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What is currently going on in highly-vaxxed countries?


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To understand that mass-vaccination is NOT the answer to the current covid health-crisis, it suffices to take a look at what is currently happening in highly-vaxxed countries.  Previously hailed as shining examples and big success-stories for their covid-vaccination approach, those front-runner countries are now confronted with the Broken Vaccine promise.   

Attached below a twitter post with a short video-cliip from Israel:

And here what is happening in Iceland:

This person from Iceland,  asked Tom WOODS to share with what's going on there:

The government of Iceland eased COVID restrictions progressively this spring until finally abolishing "all" of them on June 26. (Border controls and test/trace program remained in place.) The government had promised the easing of restrictions based on vaccination targets. At this time 85 percent of the eligible population has been fully vaccinated and another five percent have received one dose.

Cases being approximately zero, the government and public health establishment ran a victory lap this summer, having "defeated COVID." (The second time, actually -- they thought it had been defeated in the summer of 2020 and were awarded medals by the president for that.)

That lasted about a month. A few days ago cases started skyrocketing again. It looks like this will become the largest wave so far. The majority of cases are among the vaccinated.

Public health officials were not expecting this, and a frenzy ensued. Despite mortality/hospitalization percentages being down markedly as compared to previous waves the chief epidemiologist demanded border controls be tightened. The official rationale is that "someone could still get sick."

As usual the government did as it was told. The epidemiologist announced that he believed this would be enough to stop the rise in cases. The next day cases rose further, and having decided now that border controls would not suffice he demanded the government start reimposing restrictions, thereby breaking the promise they had made. The restrictions are somewhat mild as compared to before, a ban on gatherings larger than 200 persons, indoor mask mandate, early closure of bars and restaurants.

The government approved and as of this writing these restrictions are coming into effect in Iceland. (At this time Iceland is pretty much a dictatorship run by the epidemiologist; no politician dares to challenge his "expertise").

This turn of events is extremely demoralizing. If past experience is any indicator, over the next couple of weeks we will experience increasingly harsh restrictions/lockdowns as the imposed restrictions fail to reduce case numbers. Furthermore, the epidemiologist announced that the failure of the vaccine to provide herd immunity means that restrictions will likely be in place for the next five to fifteen years.

"The pandemic is not over," he said, "until it is over everywhere in the world." Given that the economy of tiny Iceland is extremely dependent on tourism, I can't see how this "plan" will end in anything other than hyperinflation down the road.

For the first time since the beginning of the pandemic public opinion is shifting slightly. It has been absolutely in favor of the restrictions so far but it seems that now a sizable minority does not support the imposed restrictions. I can't say I'm very optimistic that we will see any real resistance, though. The political class seems paralyzed by fear of the media/public health establishment.

I would very much appreciate if you can bring this to the attention of the world. It seems that at least in Iceland, high vaccination rates will not bring us back our freedom or save us from the dystopia of a permanent dictatorship run by the public health establishment.

Source: https://mailchi.mp/tomwoods/nowiceland?e=23a9263841

 

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And from this opinion piece in the Washington Times, jointly authored by dr Robert Malone and Peter Navarro, it looks that also mainstream-media in the US are waking up.  

Biden team’s misguided and deadly COVID-19 vaccine strategy  

Vaccination 'arms race' could prove dangerous to the American public  

The Biden administration’s strategy to universally vaccinate in the middle of the pandemic is bad science and badly needs a reboot.  

This strategy will likely prolong the most dangerous phase of the worst pandemic since 1918 and almost assuredly cause more harm than good – even as it undermines faith in the entire public health system.

Four flawed assumptions drive the Biden strategy. The first is that universal vaccination can eradicate the virus and secure economic recovery by achieving herd immunity throughout the country (and the world).  However, the virus is now so deeply embedded in the world population that, unlike polio and smallpox, eradication is unachievable. SARS-CoV-2 and its myriad mutations will likely continually circulate, much like the common cold and influenza.

The second assumption is that the vaccines are (near) perfectly effective. However, our currently available vaccines are quite “leaky.” While good at preventing severe disease and death, they only reduce, not eliminate, the risk of infection, replication, and transmission. As a slide deck from the Centers for Disease Control has revealed, even 100% acceptance of the current leaky vaccines combined with strict mask compliance will not stop the highly contagious Delta variant from spreading.

The third assumption is that the vaccines are safe.  Yet scientists, physicians, and public health officials now recognize risks that are rare but by no means trivial.  Known side effects include serious cardiac and thrombotic conditions, menstrual cycle disruptions, Bell’s Palsy, Guillain Barre syndrome, and anaphylaxis.

Unknown side effects which virologists fear may emerge include existential reproductive risks, additional autoimmune conditions, and various forms of disease enhancement, i.e., the vaccines can make people more vulnerable to reinfection by SARS-CoV-2 or reactivation of latent viral infections and associated diseases such as shingles.  With good reason, the FDA has yet to approve the vaccines now administered under Emergency Use Authorization.

The failure of the fourth “durability” assumption is the most alarming and perplexing.  It now appears our current vaccines are likely to offer a mere 180-day window of protection – a decided lack of durability underscored by scientific evidence from Israel and confirmed by  Pfizer, the Department of Health and Human Services, and other countries. 

Here, we are already being warned of the need for universal “booster” shots at six-month intervals for the foreseeable future.  The obvious broader point that militates for individual vaccine choice is that repeated vaccinations, each with a small risk, can add up to a big risk. 

It’s an arms race with the virus.

The most important reason why a universal vaccination strategy is imprudent tracks to the collective risk associated with how the virus responds when replicating in vaccinated individuals. Here, basic virology and evolutionary genetics tell us the goal of any virus is to infect and replicate in as many people as possible.  A virus can’t efficiently spread if, like with Ebola, it quickly kills its hosts.

The clear historical tendency for viruses crossing over from one species to another is to evolve in a way that makes them both more infectious and less pathogenic over time. However, a universal vaccination policy deployed in the middle of a pandemic can turn this normal Darwinian taming process into a dangerous vaccine arms race.

The essence of this arms race is this: The more people you vaccinate, the greater the number of vaccine-resistant mutations you are likely to get, the less durable the vaccines will become, ever more powerful vaccines will have to be developed, and individuals will be exposed to more and more risk.

Science tells us here that today’s vaccines, which use novel gene therapy technologies, generate powerful antigens that direct the immune system to attack specific components of the virus. Thus, when the virus infects a person with a “leaky” vaccination, the viral progeny will be selected to escape or resist the effects of the vaccine. 

If the entire population has been trained via a universal vaccination strategy to have the same basic immune response, then once a viral escape mutant is selected, it will rapidly spread through the entire population – whether vaccinated or not.

A far more optimal strategy is to vaccinate only the most vulnerable. This will limit the amount of vaccine-resistant mutations and thereby slow, if not halt, the current vaccine arms race.

Fortunately, those most vulnerable represent a relatively small number; and these cohorts have already achieved high levels of vaccine acceptance.  They include senior citizens, for whom the risk of serious disease or death increases exponentially with age, and those with significant comorbidities such as obesity, lung, and heart disease. 

For much of the rest of the population, there’s nothing to fear but fear of the virus itself.  This is particularly true if we have lawful outpatient access to a growing arsenal of scientifically proven prophylactics and therapeutics.

For example, there has been much controversy over ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine. Yet, with the emergence of a growing body of scientific evidence, we can be assured these two medicines are safe and effective in prophylaxis and early treatment when administered under a physician’s supervision.  Numerous other useful treatments range from famotidine/celecoxib, fluvoxamine, and apixaban to various anti-inflammatory steroids, Vitamin D, and zinc.  

The broader goal when administering these agents is to moderate symptoms and take death off the table, particularly for the unvaccinated. Unlike vaccines, these agents are generally not dependent on specific viral properties or mutations but instead mitigate or treat the inflammatory symptoms of the disease itself.  (Pfizer is now actively marketing its own antiviral therapeutic – tacit admission Pfizer’s own vaccine is incapable of eradicating the virus.) 

We are not “anti-vax.”  One of us (Dr. Malone) invented the core mRNA technology being used by Pfizer and Moderna to produce their vaccines and has spent his entire professional career developing and advancing novel vaccine technologies, vaccines, and other medical countermeasures. The other (Mr. Navarro) played a key role at the Trump White House in jumpstarting Operation Warp Speed and ensuring timely delivery of the vaccines.  

We are simply saying that just because you have a big vaccine hammer, it is not necessarily wise to use it for every nail. The American people deserve better than a universal vaccination strategy under the flag of bad science and enforced through authoritarian measures.

• Dr. Robert Malone is the discoverer of in-vitro and in-vivo RNA transfection and the inventor of mRNA vaccines while he was at the Salk Institute in 1988.  Peter Navarro served in the Trump White House as the Defense Production Act Policy Coordinator.

Source: https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/aug/5/biden-teams-misguided-and-deadly-covid-19-vaccine-/

 

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For the vaccines you need to dig deeper into the Phase 3 clinical trials and see where and when the trials were done. Pfizer and Moderna were mostly done in the US last year. Before any variants arrived in the US. So these vaccines may not be effective in preventing the disease

 

BUT thats not what vaccines are for. A certain current political leader foolishly implied that getting a vaccine reduces transmission of the disease. Rather vaccines are good at reducing hospitalization and deaths. Also he severely politicized the vaccines during last years presidential cycle. He’s the only politician on record stating he won’t get vaccinated if Trump had anything to do with it. 
 

TLDR: Phase 3 trials didn’t include other variants so it’s possible that vaccines may not be effective against delta. Vaccines were heavily politicized and mismanaged from the way top

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1 minute ago, 9S_ said:

For the vaccines you need to dig deeper into the Phase 3 clinical trials and see where and when the trials were done. Pfizer and Moderna were mostly done in the US last year. Before any variants arrived in the US. So these vaccines may not be effective in preventing the disease

BUT thats not what vaccines are for. A certain current political leader foolishly implied that getting a vaccine reduces transmission of the disease. Rather vaccines are good at reducing hospitalization and deaths. Also he severely politicized the vaccines during last years presidential cycle. He’s the only politician on record stating he won’t get vaccinated if Trump had anything to do with it. 
 

TLDR: Phase 3 trials didn’t include other variants so it’s possible that vaccines may not be effective against delta. Vaccines were heavily politicized and mismanaged from the way top

It's ongoing trial till 2023 isn't it.

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My friend from Dubai got app and weekly PCR tests to participate in society. His list of test is long u school through it till bottom. U test on Friday u negative u get green in app for a week, then again. He had few positives had to quarantine. Most things are for vaxxed

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2 hours ago, BlueSphinx said:

And here what is happening in Iceland:

I checked the sources, read the Icelandic papers and double-checked the claims made in the thread. It all checks out. And there’s more. Scary stuff.

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4 hours ago, BlueSphinx said:

To understand that mass-vaccination is NOT the answer to the current covid health-crisis, it suffices to take a look at what is currently happening in highly-vaxxed countries. 

 

 

This is pure mood-raising and shows an intellectual inability to interpret facts.

 

"To understand that mass-vaccination is NOT the answer to the current covid health crisis..."

and

"Despite mortality/hospitalization percentages being down markedly as compared to previous waves"

 

or

 

"At this time 85 percent of the eligible population has been fully vaccinated and another five percent have received one dose."

and

"The majority of cases are among the vaccinated."

 

 

Can't you see yourself posting nonsense?

 

 

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2 hours ago, BigHewer said:

I checked the sources, read the Icelandic papers and double-checked the claims made in the thread. It all checks out. And there’s more. Scary stuff.

 

What is so scary ?

 

"Despite mortality/hospitalization percentages being down markedly as compared to previous waves"

 

 

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5 hours ago, dimitri said:

This is pure mood-raising and shows an intellectual inability to interpret facts.

"To understand that mass-vaccination is NOT the answer to the current covid health crisis..."

and

"Despite mortality/hospitalization percentages being down markedly as compared to previous waves"

or

"At this time 85 percent of the eligible population has been fully vaccinated and another five percent have received one dose."

and

"The majority of cases are among the vaccinated."

Can't you see yourself posting nonsense?

In full denial > I suggest you read the Washington Times contribution by dr Robert Malone and Peter Navarro (see my 2nd post in this thread), where that 'nonsense' is fully confirmed. 

> https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/aug/5/biden-teams-misguided-and-deadly-covid-19-vaccine-/

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Being from Canada, I can say after vaccinations, everything was opening up and I don't know of anyone getting sick. Now I am in Thailand but I am pretty sure everything is open in Toronto now, malls were packed when I left. 

Pre-vaccinations I had plenty of friends with covid and a few of their parents/grandparents passed away, especially in the 2nd wave.

I'm not from the US but have a few friends there and they told me after vaccinations it was pretty much like pre-covid down there. Everyone was out and about.

These are personal experiences and not information from the media

 

I can't speak on Isreal, never been there and don't have any friends there.

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6 hours ago, dimitri said:

What is so scary ?

"Despite mortality/hospitalization percentages being down markedly as compared to previous waves"

Scary part is the new lockdowns, new restrictions. And Iceland thought they were home free. 

Scary is being stuck in this country for another year or more while the world sorts itself out.

I don’t give a rat’s cracker about the stats, probabilities and percentages. The scary part is the way that governments react to them, not the figures themselves.

Scary is the erosion of freedom of movement and associated tracking, reporting, authentication and so on. 

I had hoped and believed the vaccines would work. When governments start admitting that things aren’t working out, the next logical steps are “scary”.

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16 hours ago, BlueSphinx said:

To understand that mass-vaccination is NOT the answer to the current covid health-crisis, it suffices to take a look at what is currently happening in highly-vaxxed countries.  Previously hailed as shining examples and big success-stories for their covid-vaccination approach, those front-runner countries are now confronted with the Broken Vaccine promise.   

Attached below a twitter post with a short video-cliip from Israel:

And here what is happening in Iceland:

This person from Iceland,  asked Tom WOODS to share with what's going on there:

The government of Iceland eased COVID restrictions progressively this spring until finally abolishing "all" of them on June 26. (Border controls and test/trace program remained in place.) The government had promised the easing of restrictions based on vaccination targets. At this time 85 percent of the eligible population has been fully vaccinated and another five percent have received one dose.

Cases being approximately zero, the government and public health establishment ran a victory lap this summer, having "defeated COVID." (The second time, actually -- they thought it had been defeated in the summer of 2020 and were awarded medals by the president for that.)

That lasted about a month. A few days ago cases started skyrocketing again. It looks like this will become the largest wave so far. The majority of cases are among the vaccinated.

Public health officials were not expecting this, and a frenzy ensued. Despite mortality/hospitalization percentages being down markedly as compared to previous waves the chief epidemiologist demanded border controls be tightened. The official rationale is that "someone could still get sick."

As usual the government did as it was told. The epidemiologist announced that he believed this would be enough to stop the rise in cases. The next day cases rose further, and having decided now that border controls would not suffice he demanded the government start reimposing restrictions, thereby breaking the promise they had made. The restrictions are somewhat mild as compared to before, a ban on gatherings larger than 200 persons, indoor mask mandate, early closure of bars and restaurants.

The government approved and as of this writing these restrictions are coming into effect in Iceland. (At this time Iceland is pretty much a dictatorship run by the epidemiologist; no politician dares to challenge his "expertise").

This turn of events is extremely demoralizing. If past experience is any indicator, over the next couple of weeks we will experience increasingly harsh restrictions/lockdowns as the imposed restrictions fail to reduce case numbers. Furthermore, the epidemiologist announced that the failure of the vaccine to provide herd immunity means that restrictions will likely be in place for the next five to fifteen years.

"The pandemic is not over," he said, "until it is over everywhere in the world." Given that the economy of tiny Iceland is extremely dependent on tourism, I can't see how this "plan" will end in anything other than hyperinflation down the road.

For the first time since the beginning of the pandemic public opinion is shifting slightly. It has been absolutely in favor of the restrictions so far but it seems that now a sizable minority does not support the imposed restrictions. I can't say I'm very optimistic that we will see any real resistance, though. The political class seems paralyzed by fear of the media/public health establishment.

I would very much appreciate if you can bring this to the attention of the world. It seems that at least in Iceland, high vaccination rates will not bring us back our freedom or save us from the dystopia of a permanent dictatorship run by the public health establishment.

Source: https://mailchi.mp/tomwoods/nowiceland?e=23a9263841

This is insightful, Thanks.

The claim that Iceland "is a dictatorship run by the epidemiologist" is just someone's opinion. The fact is the coronavirus's first, really significant mutation has popped a whole lot of balloons around the world in the space of around six months. This suggests to me that the notion of this not being under control for another five to fifteen years needs to be seriously considered. IMHO, there have been far too many over-hyped medical breakthroughs and heralding of bright new dawns by self-serving heads of state and national governments. Maybe people need to ignore the politicians and those that still suggest it's just the flu and take stock on their personal situation and near-future plans. Vaccine nationalism has been disavowed by the leaders of the free world but they still haven't done much of anything to stop it. Doling out vaccine donations to certain countries who they think need help won't do much to create this much needed global herd immunity strategy.                                                                                                                     

How do you see Thailand this time next year?

How do you see your home country this time next year?

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16 hours ago, BlueSphinx said:

And from this opinion piece in the Washington Times, jointly authored by dr Robert Malone and Peter Navarro, it looks that also mainstream-media in the US are waking up.  

Biden team’s misguided and deadly COVID-19 vaccine strategy  

Vaccination 'arms race' could prove dangerous to the American public  

The Biden administration’s strategy to universally vaccinate in the middle of the pandemic is bad science and badly needs a reboot.  

This strategy will likely prolong the most dangerous phase of the worst pandemic since 1918 and almost assuredly cause more harm than good – even as it undermines faith in the entire public health system.

Four flawed assumptions drive the Biden strategy. The first is that universal vaccination can eradicate the virus and secure economic recovery by achieving herd immunity throughout the country (and the world).  However, the virus is now so deeply embedded in the world population that, unlike polio and smallpox, eradication is unachievable. SARS-CoV-2 and its myriad mutations will likely continually circulate, much like the common cold and influenza.

The second assumption is that the vaccines are (near) perfectly effective. However, our currently available vaccines are quite “leaky.” While good at preventing severe disease and death, they only reduce, not eliminate, the risk of infection, replication, and transmission. As a slide deck from the Centers for Disease Control has revealed, even 100% acceptance of the current leaky vaccines combined with strict mask compliance will not stop the highly contagious Delta variant from spreading.

The third assumption is that the vaccines are safe.  Yet scientists, physicians, and public health officials now recognize risks that are rare but by no means trivial.  Known side effects include serious cardiac and thrombotic conditions, menstrual cycle disruptions, Bell’s Palsy, Guillain Barre syndrome, and anaphylaxis.

Unknown side effects which virologists fear may emerge include existential reproductive risks, additional autoimmune conditions, and various forms of disease enhancement, i.e., the vaccines can make people more vulnerable to reinfection by SARS-CoV-2 or reactivation of latent viral infections and associated diseases such as shingles.  With good reason, the FDA has yet to approve the vaccines now administered under Emergency Use Authorization.

The failure of the fourth “durability” assumption is the most alarming and perplexing.  It now appears our current vaccines are likely to offer a mere 180-day window of protection – a decided lack of durability underscored by scientific evidence from Israel and confirmed by  Pfizer, the Department of Health and Human Services, and other countries. 

Here, we are already being warned of the need for universal “booster” shots at six-month intervals for the foreseeable future.  The obvious broader point that militates for individual vaccine choice is that repeated vaccinations, each with a small risk, can add up to a big risk. 

It’s an arms race with the virus.

The most important reason why a universal vaccination strategy is imprudent tracks to the collective risk associated with how the virus responds when replicating in vaccinated individuals. Here, basic virology and evolutionary genetics tell us the goal of any virus is to infect and replicate in as many people as possible.  A virus can’t efficiently spread if, like with Ebola, it quickly kills its hosts.

The clear historical tendency for viruses crossing over from one species to another is to evolve in a way that makes them both more infectious and less pathogenic over time. However, a universal vaccination policy deployed in the middle of a pandemic can turn this normal Darwinian taming process into a dangerous vaccine arms race.

The essence of this arms race is this: The more people you vaccinate, the greater the number of vaccine-resistant mutations you are likely to get, the less durable the vaccines will become, ever more powerful vaccines will have to be developed, and individuals will be exposed to more and more risk.

Science tells us here that today’s vaccines, which use novel gene therapy technologies, generate powerful antigens that direct the immune system to attack specific components of the virus. Thus, when the virus infects a person with a “leaky” vaccination, the viral progeny will be selected to escape or resist the effects of the vaccine. 

If the entire population has been trained via a universal vaccination strategy to have the same basic immune response, then once a viral escape mutant is selected, it will rapidly spread through the entire population – whether vaccinated or not.

A far more optimal strategy is to vaccinate only the most vulnerable. This will limit the amount of vaccine-resistant mutations and thereby slow, if not halt, the current vaccine arms race.

Fortunately, those most vulnerable represent a relatively small number; and these cohorts have already achieved high levels of vaccine acceptance.  They include senior citizens, for whom the risk of serious disease or death increases exponentially with age, and those with significant comorbidities such as obesity, lung, and heart disease. 

For much of the rest of the population, there’s nothing to fear but fear of the virus itself.  This is particularly true if we have lawful outpatient access to a growing arsenal of scientifically proven prophylactics and therapeutics.

For example, there has been much controversy over ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine. Yet, with the emergence of a growing body of scientific evidence, we can be assured these two medicines are safe and effective in prophylaxis and early treatment when administered under a physician’s supervision.  Numerous other useful treatments range from famotidine/celecoxib, fluvoxamine, and apixaban to various anti-inflammatory steroids, Vitamin D, and zinc.  

The broader goal when administering these agents is to moderate symptoms and take death off the table, particularly for the unvaccinated. Unlike vaccines, these agents are generally not dependent on specific viral properties or mutations but instead mitigate or treat the inflammatory symptoms of the disease itself.  (Pfizer is now actively marketing its own antiviral therapeutic – tacit admission Pfizer’s own vaccine is incapable of eradicating the virus.) 

We are not “anti-vax.”  One of us (Dr. Malone) invented the core mRNA technology being used by Pfizer and Moderna to produce their vaccines and has spent his entire professional career developing and advancing novel vaccine technologies, vaccines, and other medical countermeasures. The other (Mr. Navarro) played a key role at the Trump White House in jumpstarting Operation Warp Speed and ensuring timely delivery of the vaccines.  

We are simply saying that just because you have a big vaccine hammer, it is not necessarily wise to use it for every nail. The American people deserve better than a universal vaccination strategy under the flag of bad science and enforced through authoritarian measures.

• Dr. Robert Malone is the discoverer of in-vitro and in-vivo RNA transfection and the inventor of mRNA vaccines while he was at the Salk Institute in 1988.  Peter Navarro served in the Trump White House as the Defense Production Act Policy Coordinator.

Source: https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/aug/5/biden-teams-misguided-and-deadly-covid-19-vaccine-/

This isn't offering anything more than a poke at Biden and the Democrats. Anything that has Peter Navarro opening his yap is to be ignored. I bet he penned the nonsense paragraph hyperventilating about ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, famotidine/celecoxib, fluvoxamine, apixaban, various anti-inflammatory steroids, Vitamin D, and zinc. That's the cocktail that 'cured' Trump so I guess it works, no?

Pass me the bleach and the uv light please.

 

 

Before Trump gave him that fancy Defense Production Act Policy Coordinator title, he was a rather lackluster and markedly unqualified Director of Trade and Manufacturing Policy. Sort of an 'Anutin of the Adirondacks' if you will.

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22 minutes ago, cacadordemim said:

This isn't offering anything more than a poke at Biden and the Democrats. Anything that has Peter Navarro opening his yap is to be ignored. I bet he penned the nonsense paragraph hyperventilating about ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, famotidine/celecoxib, fluvoxamine, apixaban, various anti-inflammatory steroids, Vitamin D, and zinc. That's the cocktail that 'cured' Trump so I guess it works, no?

Pass me the bleach and the uv light please.

Before Trump gave him that fancy Defense Production Act Policy Coordinator title, he was a rather lackluster and markedly unqualified Director of Trade and Manufacturing Policy. Sort of an 'Anutin of the Adirondacks' if you will.

May I suggest that you read the content of the article, putting aside your opinion about its authors.  Saying that it isn't offering more than a pike at Biden and the Democrats, leaves me totally flabbergasted.

Despite it's title and one of its authors being a poltician, the article isn't a political hit-piece but exposes the flaws in the current mass-vaccination approach.  Ignoring the facts/evidence because of political polarization is plain stupid. It is irrelevant whether a Donkey or an Elephant is at the helm when the health of millions of people is at stake by doubling-down on an approach that will lead to disaster.

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2 hours ago, BlueSphinx said:

May I suggest that you read the content of the article, putting aside your opinion about its authors.  Saying that it isn't offering more than a pike at Biden and the Democrats, leaves me totally flabbergasted.

Despite it's title and one of its authors being a poltician, the article isn't a political hit-piece but exposes the flaws in the current mass-vaccination approach.  Ignoring the facts/evidence because of political polarization is plain stupid. It is irrelevant whether a Donkey or an Elephant is at the helm when the health of millions of people is at stake by doubling-down on an approach that will lead to disaster.

The banner starts with 'Biden...' and the opening stanza starts with, "The Biden administration's..." at which point I admit my eyes glazed over. But I persevered and I did read it twice, just in case I had overlooked something salient or noteworthy the first time. I was disappointed. Twice.

You have quoted a couple of items, the first one scraped from the Twittersphere and the second one from a Conservative rag. I can appreciate that your flabber is totally gasted but you can't have two gold medals.

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8 minutes ago, cacadordemim said:

The banner starts with 'Biden...' and the opening stanza starts with, "The Biden administration's..." at which point I admit my eyes glazed over. But I persevered and I did read it twice, just in case I had overlooked something salient or noteworthy the first time. I was disappointed. Twice.

You have quoted a couple of items, the first one scraped from the Twittersphere and the second one from a Conservative rag. I can appreciate that your flabber is totally gasted but you can't have two gold medals.

Kudos that you made the effort to read the article twice, and sorry to hear that it did not bring you some new insights.  Personally I appreciated dr Malone's clear explanation of the inevitable 'immune escape' phenomenon when vaccinating during a pandemic.  There are not many people that have an idea of the devastating consequences of that phenomenon which is already taking place.  It's not too late to reverse course, but it's less than 5 minutes to twelve...

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6 hours ago, BlueSphinx said:

Kudos that you made the effort to read the article twice, and sorry to hear that it did not bring you some new insights.  Personally I appreciated dr Malone's clear explanation of the inevitable 'immune escape' phenomenon when vaccinating during a pandemic.  There are not many people that have an idea of the devastating consequences of that phenomenon which is already taking place.  It's not too late to reverse course, but it's less than 5 minutes to twelve...

Or zero dark-thirty as we used to say in the special forces.

I'll grant you that your second article does make some points well. However, one could fairly easily substitute 'Biden' with 'Johnson' or 'Macron' or 'Morrison' when it comes to pointing a finger at western leadership that's getting it as hopelessly wrong as the muddling obfuscation we have here. It must be a bugger having to juggle their popularity against pressures from some powerful 'special interest' entities and alliances. It must be really tough when your home-grown popularity doesn't exist or is going up in teargas and rubber bullets.

PS: Do we really have to pay to have a conversation with Tom Wood's robust, uncensored and free-spirited enlightenment group?

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On 8/6/2021 at 6:19 AM, BlueSphinx said:

To understand that mass-vaccination is NOT the answer to the current covid health-crisis, it suffices to take a look at what is currently happening in highly-vaxxed countries.  Previously hailed as shining examples and big success-stories for their covid-vaccination approach, those front-runner countries are now confronted with the Broken Vaccine promise.   

Attached below a twitter post with a short video-cliip from Israel:

Israel publishes a lot of data. As of today, you can see that many more fully vaccinated people are testing PCR positive for SARS CoV-2, and among patients classified with a serious/critical status, fully vaccinated persons outnumber unvaccinated persons about 2:1. https://datadashboard.health.gov.il/COVID-19/general

But what about the denominator? When you adjust the numbers to take into account the larger number of vaccinated persons, the number of positive tests per 100K of the same vaccination status, and the number of serious/critical cases per 100K of the same vaccination status show the data in a different light. The figures likely would be far worse if these infected individuals had not been vaccinated.

To put that another way, if fully vaccinated people were getting seriously ill at the same rate as the unvaccinated -- 437 per 100,000 instead of 97 per 100,000 -- you would be seeing about 732 more serious/critical cases, tripling the current number from 324 to 1,056.

Vaccines are working in Israel. Obviously not perfectly, but then, what is perfect?

Of course, it is a different question whether non-pharmaceutical measures to control outbreaks are reasonable; that is for each country to decide for itself.

Israel 2021-08-07 PCR Positive.png

Israel 2021-08-07 PCR Positive per 100K status.png

Israel 2021-08-07 Severe.png

Israel 2021-08-07 Severe per 100K status.png

Israel 2021-08-07.xlsx

Edited by SomTum
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On 8/6/2021 at 5:37 AM, Xaos said:

COVID-19 in Iceland: Vaccination Has Not Led to Herd Immunity, Says Chief Epidemiologist

That is a good article but is basically what many countries have already seen.

While data shows vaccination is reducing the rate of serious illness due to COVID-19 in Iceland, the country’s Chief Epidemiologist Þórólfur Guðnason says it has not led to the herd immunity that experts hoped for

Sadly I am not even convinced of the first part "vaccination is reducing the rate of serious illness"

Because as I said before...The vaccination was always going to "look" successful.

Why? Because of course the initial waves of Covid thru each country will kill the most as there are many near death even before covid........ Covid was just the final straw

Of course death rates were going to drop after that initial sweep thru. Remember again that Covid is 99+% survivable by otherwise healthy folks

 

So where do we go from here? I do not believe boosters will enhance anything other than manufacturers bank accounts

At this point folks need to realize if Covid is 95% survivable then there is a chance x% of the population may perish...Especially the old/infirm population

Why that is so shocking is perhaps the biggest mystery of all. Are we now all gods that will live forever? If not covid would it not be something?

Edited by Meechai
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2 hours ago, SomTum said:

Israel publishes a lot of data. As of today, you can see that many more fully vaccinated people are testing PCR positive for SARS CoV-2, and among patients classified with a serious/critical status, fully vaccinated persons outnumber unvaccinated persons about 2:1. https://datadashboard.health.gov.il/COVID-19/general

But what about the denominator? When you adjust the numbers to take into account the larger number of vaccinated persons, the number of positive tests per 100K of the same vaccination status, and the number of serious/critical cases per 100K of the same vaccination status show the data in a different light. The figures likely would be far worse if these infected individuals had not been vaccinated.

To put that another way, if fully vaccinated people were getting seriously ill at the same rate as the unvaccinated -- 437 per 100,000 instead of 97 per 100,000 -- you would be seeing about 732 more serious/critical cases, tripling the current number from 324 to 1,056.

Vaccines are working in Israel. Obviously not perfectly, but then, what is perfect?

Of course, it is a different question whether non-pharmaceutical measures to control outbreaks are reasonable; that is for each country to decide for itself.

Israel 2021-08-07 PCR Positive.png

Israel 2021-08-07 PCR Positive per 100K status.png

Israel 2021-08-07 Severe.png

Israel 2021-08-07 Severe per 100K status.png

Israel 2021-08-07.xlsx 12.13 kB · 1 download

Thanks for posting these data.  It does show indeed that the unvaccinated are at greater risk of serious illness from covid-19 than the vaccinated.  Which is hardly surprising as any other outcome would prove that the vaccines do not work even for reducing serious illness and death (which was their only purpose). 

But of course the figures do debunk the lie that +95% that are now suffering serious covid-illness are unvaccinated, these Israeli figures seem to be more in the 1 vaxxed to 2 unvaxxed ratio (and also the age-aspect is quite revealing as the main risk for serious illness is in the +70 years of age bracket).

However, to put these figures in total perspective, you would also need to look at:

# whether those seriously ill unvaccinated people did take or were treated with covid-19 remedial drugs (like hydroxychloroquine, ivermectin, vit C and D3 supplements, zince, etc) - I suspect they were NOT but would be interesting; and

# also the serious adverse covid-vaccine side-effects should be taken into consideration, as these covid-vaccines are not 100% safe (e.g. the myocarditis cases, especially in young vaccinated males).

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16 minutes ago, BlueSphinx said:

But of course the figures do debunk the lie that +95% that are now suffering serious covid-illness are unvaccinated, these Israeli figures seem to be more in the 1 vaxxed to 2 unvaxxed ratio (and also the age-aspect is quite revealing as the main risk for serious illness is in the +70 years of age bracket).

However, to put these figures in total perspective, you would also need to look at:

# whether those seriously ill unvaccinated people did take or were treated with covid-19 remedial drugs (like hydroxychloroquine, ivermectin, vit C and D3 supplements, zince, etc) - I suspect they were NOT but would be interesting; and

Vaccines never promised 100% protection against serious illness or death, I think the original data from the U.S. testing was in the 90's. The data in the table are a snapshot in time, but if we take the number of severely ill divided by positive tests, it's 1.25% for the fully vaccinated and 1.87% for the unvaccinated. Everyone seems to be doing pretty well at avoiding severe disease by that measure.

I have not seen an updated figure for U.S. hospitalizations that departs from the previously reported 97%.

I'm not aware that the vitamins and drugs you listed are helpful to people who are already infected. Vitamin D supplements require a significant amount of time to be metabolized to the active form, so everyone should be taking those daily and not thinking it will help to take them after a positive test. Vitamin C is great for reducing oxidative stress, so that's a good recommendation for any viral illness, but it isn't directly antiviral. Also, you need to built up tolerance to avoid diarrhea with megadoses. Unless you are deficient in Zinc, I doubt that supplementing would help, but there probably is ongoing research on that. Hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin had promising results in lab tests, but haven't demonstrated much benefit in human studies. 

There is one treatment proven to be very effective in avoiding a bad case of COVID-19, and that is to take an antibody cocktail during the first 7 days after infection (either Regeneron, the one that saved Trump, or the most recent Eli Lilly polyclonal cocktail). If you know an unvaccinated person who tested positive, and they have a condition that puts them at high risk (such as over 65, high blood pressure, obesity, CVD, COPD, or asthma), try to get them that treatment early -- the EUA doesn't cover use in hospital or if oxygen is required. From what I've heard, it's in plentiful supply but front line doctors often don't know about it.

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Just playing devil’s advocate here, but is there any theory why the three Eastern European countries with the highest vaccination rates seem to have a low caseload now: Poland, Czechia, Hungary. All three were hammered with cases until vaccinations shot up. 

Seems to be against the grain?

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