Vaccine hesitancy testing the patience of fully inoculated Americans

[MrStretch]

May I ask again, gentlemen, what your back and forth has to do with the topic at hand?

Can't you snipe and argue with each other in the spot on this form dedicated to such sniping and arguing, the CCC?

[SnapDragon]

25 minutes ago, Stonker said:

Well, actually it's around 15 piles of steaming BS but at least you've been more honest than the others have here admitting that, so I've got to give credit where it's due.

... and FWIW I can hardly have "lost on the MHRA quote" as I never said it.

I said that the head of the MHRA answered, to a question; what is the MHRA's important role:

Said first line, if I can recall. To enable access for medical products and devices to come into use.

You might not have heard it, but you shouldn't call it a lie. That implies that I wasn't being truthful in my post.

[Alavan]

56 minutes ago, Stonker said:

Well, the FBI and the US Attorney's Office could be wrong that (ex) Dr Richard Fleming was found guilty of 13 counts of fraud, which resulted in a ten year jail term and a $250,000 fine, and the subsequent indefinite suspension of his medical licence.

He's one of the reliable experts oft quoted by @BlueSphinx et al.

Rather like (ex) Dr Andrew Wakefield, struck off by the GMC.

Alternatively, you could look at Dr Johan Denis in Belgium, Dr Juli Mazi, Dr Simone Gold and Dr Jennings Staley in the US, but they're not quite as widely quoted.

Of course, those could just be "idiotic, unfounded claims" and (ex) Dr Richard Fleming may have just pled guilty to all 13 fraud charges to save the court any inconvenience .....

Dr Johan Denis has his license suspended in Belgium. He is no virologist or immunologist buth a homeopath. So far for his experience

 

[SnapDragon]

1 hour ago, Stonker said:

Well, actually it's around 15 piles of steaming BS but at least you've been more honest than the others have here admitting that, so I've got to give credit where it's due.

... and FWIW I can hardly have "lost on the MHRA quote" as I never said it.

Here is the UK's television medical expert advising the masses.

https://brandnewtube.com/watch/dr-hillary-jones-and-the-pointlessness-of-masks-before-he-changed-his-mind_swtOlle6V4oFDbP.html

[Stonker]

5 hours ago, MrStretch said:

May I ask again, gentlemen, what your back and forth has to do with the topic at hand?

Can't you snipe and argue with each other in the spot on this form dedicated to such sniping and arguing, the CCC?

Well, @MrStretch, the topic is "vaccine hesitancy" and the mods have evidently decided that this bears on that which is why the topic was re-opened.

FWIW I agree, as it all has to be different sides of the same coin. If you don't agree, well, maybe when you're a mod you can make a different choice.

[Stonker]

4 hours ago, snapdragon said:

Here is the UK's television medical expert advising the masses.

https://brandnewtube.com/watch/dr-hillary-jones-and-the-pointlessness-of-masks-before-he-changed-his-mind_swtOlle6V4oFDbP.html

Well ... umm ... he changed his mind!

That's what people do if they're open to new information and they don't bury their heads in the sand!

[KWOG]

The coronacoward propaganda is truly disgusting. 

  We're not ''here'' because you or I or Joe Blow didn't wear a mask, or didn't get vaccinated. 

We're here because China released a virus into the world which is being used and exploited for political,   financial, social engineering purposes.

   

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, KWOG said:

The coronacoward propaganda is truly disgusting. 

  We're not ''here'' because you or I or Joe Blow didn't wear a mask, or didn't get vaccinated. 

We're here because China released a virus into the world which is being used and exploited for political,   financial, social engineering purposes.

   

And Fauci funded gain of function apparently 

[KWOG]

Quote

And Fauci funded gain of function apparently 

Yes, the question is whether our nanny statists and medical industrial complex were partners in the creation and distribution of this exciting new product or were they just the lucky beneficiaries of a gift that fell into their laps.    I can't say I care all that much.....it's like the difference between being buried under 6 feet of bullsh8t or 7.   

Edited August 1, 2021 by KWOG

[MrStretch]

11 hours ago, Stonker said:

Well, @MrStretch, the topic is "vaccine hesitancy" and the mods have evidently decided that this bears on that which is why the topic was re-opened.

FWIW I agree, as it all has to be different sides of the same coin. If you don't agree, well, maybe when you're a mod you can make a different choice.

Actually, it is about "Vaccine hesitancy testing the patience of fully inoculated Americans" but the arguments are almost the same as in the CCC thread, where a majority of this conversation belongs.

[KWOG]

On 7/30/2021 at 7:50 AM, Soidog said:

I think people choosing not to get vaccinated fall in to a number of broad categories. 

Those that for medical reasons are advised not to.

 
Those who are genuinely concerned such as pregnant women or the very young. 
 
Those who are plain scarred about needles and vaccines.

 
Those who are just recalcitrant or belligerent and will not be told to do anything. They know their rights and will not follow convention.

 
And finally, NUTTERS

If you have the option to be vaccinated but chosen not to, which of the above are you? 

It's apparently unimaginable to you that there are people who simply aren't scared of the virus, and are content to rely on the immune system which has successfully protected them from it for 18 or 20 months....as it has for the vast majority of humanity , even those who've otherwise succumbed to the fearmongering and/or been put into poverty (or as is more likely in the US, a loooooong paid vacation at the expense of working people and our young/future generations ) by economic sabotage. 

[Soidog]

3 hours ago, KWOG said:

It's apparently unimaginable to you that there are people who simply aren't scared of the virus, and are content to rely on the immune system which has successfully protected them from it for 18 or 20 months....as it has for the vast majority of humanity , even those who've otherwise succumbed to the fearmongering and/or been put into poverty (or as is more likely in the US, a loooooong paid vacation at the expense of working people and our young/future generations ) by economic sabotage. 

I’m not scared of Covid or vaccines and  feel getting Covid under control and keeping hospitals clear for people with cancer and other illnesses is a social responsibility. I also want the world to open up and get economies working again. Despite a small majority of people who don’t believe vaccines are the answer (may well be right?), the vast majority of people, governments and scientists think they are. They won’t open economies while healthcare systems are being overrun.  If I can help by getting a vaccine then I will do it.  I feel that is a small price to pay. Good luck to you with the virus and any economic impact it may have.   

[billywillyjones]

Why should anyone be paricularly excited about vaccines after a report just came out indicating vaccinated are spreading Covid and the CDC has reversed it's mask mandate to include vaccinated?  

I think they better get their facts together before they bully people.  

[Soidog]

40 minutes ago, billywillyjones said:

Why should anyone be paricularly excited about vaccines after a report just came out indicating vaccinated are spreading Covid and the CDC has reversed it's mask mandate to include vaccinated?  

I think they better get their facts together before they bully people.  

I’m fairly sure a report didn’t just come out. It’s been known for months and months that vaccinated people can still contract and spread the virus. However…..

Having the vaccine does give you some protection from contracting the virus. A vast range of figures are out there on the internet just waiting to be debated. But even if it’s a 5% reduction, I’ll take it 
 

Having the vaccine also means that if you do contract it you are less likely to pass to others. Again, many figures out there to debate. What I do know is that 3 people I know who had the vaccine and contracted the virus did not pass it on to anyone in their family or friends. One of them had Healy any symptoms and freely moved around for several days before a routine test came back positive. Not a scientific test, but again, I’ll take it. 
 

Finally, if you have the vaccine and contract the virus you are far less likely to fall seriously ill and die from it. The numbers of infections compared to serious illness for vaccinated and unvaccinated are clear for all to see. Again I’m encouraged with the data.  
 

All in all, it’s well worth having the vaccines. 

[KWOG]

1 hour ago, Soidog said:

I’m not scared of Covid or vaccines and  feel getting Covid under control and keeping hospitals clear for people with cancer and other illnesses is a social responsibility. I also want the world to open up and get economies working again. Despite a small majority of people who don’t believe vaccines are the answer (may well be right?), the vast majority of people, governments and scientists think they are. They won’t open economies while healthcare systems are being overrun.  If I can help by getting a vaccine then I will do it.  I feel that is a small price to pay. Good luck to you with the virus and any economic impact it may have.   

I left Thailand in October for the US, been here ever since. Was shocked to see everyone wearing masks in public, guess I shouldn't have been.  How many people do I know well here...a few dozen...one count him 1 of them has tested positive for Covid to my knowledge, and he wouldn't have known it otherwise, had no effects.  My sister is an agency nurse, liable to be assigned anywhere...no facility she has been at for the last 18 months has ever been in any way 'overloaded', and you or I getting the shot wouldn't have UN-loaded any of them if they were. I have an 85 year old, 85 pound alcoholic relative with chronic pneumonia who is continually in and out of hospitals ( the most pathogen ridden environment available) for assorted ailments/issues, but covid hasn't even laid a glove on her.  I myself was in the hospital 6 weeks ago for a motor vehicle accident, got in on a Saturday  at noon and stayed overnight, business was very slow.  Staff vastly outnumbering patients in the ER for sure, and seemingly elsewhere as well.

So, thanks for the good luck but I haven't and won't be needing it against the virus,  the virus hasn't had the slightest impact on me or mine. All the negative impact I've experienced has been from political exploitation of it, from economic and social sabotage and 'wealth redistribution'.  From working to pay people via my taxes to cower at home, getting almost as much as I do for working. From seeing anyone who works or pays rent or paid student loans being made a chump. From seeing a generation of children who were and are at infinitesimally small risk from the virus cheated out of a proper education and their social activities, being indoctrinated with fear of exposing their faces or getting within six feet of each other, and being handed a umpteen trillion dollar tab for it by their loathsome elders, which they'll be paying down their entire lives. From seeing obese, unhealthy people assigning responsibility for their own health to everyone but themselves. From knowing that hundreds of thousands of illegal aliens (marketed as 'excluded workers') got 15,000 dollar lump sum corona-checks in my state (NY) (Don't believe it ? Neither did I until I read it. Pick any media source you like. Hundreds of thousands more illegal aliens, the  unlucky ones, those who couldn't properly document how long they've been squatting in our country, got only 3500 or so.)   From dismay, disgust and revulsion at how low my country and my countrymen/women have sunk.  Could have used some luck with that I guess.   That's what has 'tested my patience', to quote the title of the thread. Not healthy unafraid people who've declined medial treatment for a disease they don't have.  Not geriatric invalids and morbidly obese diabetics dying of natural causes either.     

As for the vaccine, I got it as well, very grudgingly and for one reason only, to get into the 'Phuket Sandbox' and avoid 2 weeks quarantine.  Though I've suffered no ill effects from it, if I had it to do over again, I wouldn't, since (besides other non-relevant reasons) 'freedom' in Phuket now seems barely more appealing than coronajail in Pattaya.   Having been through all the useless, punitive, poverty creating lockdowns in Pattaya from March to October last year (by which point covid had killed some 40 people in the kingdom, approximately the number of Thais killed by their own cows in a year)  I will say that I find it easier, less shameful to comply with coronapanic protocols as a guest in someone else's country than doing so in my own, and I followed the Thai rules more or less unfailingly and will do so again if I go.   I do believe, accept that things are worse there now, with the total number of covid fatalities approaching .007 percent of the population or one out of every 14000.  I don't believe lockdowns and travel restrictions and wearing masks for a few minutes or hours of the day will impede the progress of the organism.   It's already in every community and it's going to pick off a certain portion of the old and obese and sickly just as it has elsewhere.  Punishing the rest of the population, the vast majority who require nothing more than their own immune system to combat the virus, won't help.  Nor will my vaccination. The money I spend there, if when and where I'm allowed to, will have far greater impact.  Good luck to you as well and anyone else who read this mini-opus. 

[Stonker]

8 hours ago, KWOG said:

It's apparently unimaginable to you that there are people who simply aren't scared of the virus, and are content to rely on the immune system which has successfully protected them from it for 18 or 20 months...

I doubt that some people's ignorance is unimaginable to most people, even here.