Work Permit without Ltd Company?

[KhaoYai]

Many years ago on another forum a regular poster claimed that he was working in Thailand self-employed in partnership with his Thai wife and had a work permit. It was a long time ago and I seem to remember at the time that other members had heard of the same being allowed. I also seem to remember he claimed his status was only applicable to a husband/wife partnership.

Everyone else that I've seen start a business in Thailand, married or not has formed a Thai Limited Company and been a director of that company.

Has anyone else heard of these 'husband/wife' partnerships and if so, do you have any details?

[Guest1]

Can't give you legal advice on this, but I got told from a farang, that he changed his company to his wifes company

Because in the 100% wifes (Thai) company, it was a lot easier for him, to get the wp. 

A lot less hassle with the authorities.

You may check "wp for Farang in 100% Thai Company"

[Thai_Law]

9 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

Many years ago on another forum a regular poster claimed that he was working in Thailand self-employed in partnership with his Thai wife and had a work permit. It was a long time ago and I seem to remember at the time that other members had heard of the same being allowed. I also seem to remember he claimed his status was only applicable to a husband/wife partnership.

Everyone else that I've seen start a business in Thailand, married or not has formed a Thai Limited Company and been a director of that company.

Has anyone else heard of these 'husband/wife' partnerships and if so, do you have any details?

You can't get a work permit without a company hiring you in the situation you have described. If you are from the US, you don't need your wife to be involved in your Thai company because you have privileges under the treaty of Amity. However, most foreigners who are married to a Thai, put their wife as the majority share holder in the company. If you are married to a Thai, the company benefits in 2 ways in relation to work permits. The first way is the company only needs to register 1 million baht in capital instead of 2 million to qualify for the work permit, but they still need the 4 Thai staff. The second benefit is they do not need to deal with your visa. Visa extensions under companies are often very difficult. Any problems can easily be avoided if the visa is not sponsored by the company. You will just continue with your Thai wife visa and the company will only need to deal with your work permit. Hope this helps. For further legal advice, feel free to sign up for TLP. Learn more here: www.thailegalprotection.com

 

You can also watch this video to learn more:

 

[KhaoYai]

1 hour ago, TLP said:

You can't get a work permit without a company hiring you in the situation you have described...........................................................

Thanks but I know about the Ltd Co situation and in fact if you are married, you only need to have 2 Thai staff.  I'll ask my lawyer to check the Thai labour law because although its a long time ago, the person I mentioned that posted on the husband/wife partnership was a regular contributor.

[Thai_Law]

55 minutes ago, KhaoYai said:

Thanks but I know about the Ltd Co situation and in fact if you are married, you only need to have 2 Thai staff.  I'll ask my lawyer to check the Thai labour law because although its a long time ago, the person I mentioned that posted on the husband/wife partnership was a regular contributor.

The 2 staff thing is not entirely accurate as far as the info goes from my side. It used to be the way you describe more often than not, but now they are not doing that in every case, at least for the last while. We have experienced this. It's up to the labor office in the district you apply for your work permit at in the end, some may insist on 4, some will  allow 2 or even 1, if you are married to a Thai. If you want a chance at this reduced Thai staff ratio, you will need to be on your Thai wife visa. If you are married and you prefer the Non B visa instead, immigration won't extend the Non B visa unless you have 4 Thai staff. This is why I never mention or promote it in my posts. Why would you prefer that? if the marriage goes bad, your visa won't be impacted.

Anyways back to  your original question, you can't get a work permit without being hired in a company. If you are on the company DBD papers as the managing Director, you also need a work permit. Hence the term managing Director. 

 

Here are the unique siltations where a foriegner does not need a work permit.

 

• Holders of some of the LTR visa categories are eligible to receive a Digital Work Permit.
• SMART Visa holders are exempted from the work permit requirements.
• Representative Offices can hire foreigners with a ratio of 1 Thai employee per foreign employee.
• Companies that have received a BOI promotion, unlike other company structures, are not subject to any quotas when hiring foreign employees.
• Non profit organizations under an MOU with the Thai government where their employees hold F visas are not required to get these employees a work permit. 
• Foreigners from the US protected under the treaty of Amity are eligible to open a sole proprietorship and don't need a work permit. Foreigners often do this if they have a Thai Wife and they let their wife run the day to day. ****Perhaps this is what you are referring to? 

 

 

 

Good luck to you.

[KhaoYai]

1 hour ago, TLP said:

It's up to the labor office in the district you apply for your work permit at in the end,

Correct and my area allow 2 staff.

[KhaoYai]

2 hours ago, TLP said:

Foreigners from the US protected under the treaty of Amity are eligible to open a sole proprietorship and don't need a work permit. Foreigners often do this if they have a Thai Wife and they let their wife run the day to day. ****Perhaps this is what you are referring to?

That could well be what the historical poster was doing at the time - although I don't remember him mentioning that fact. Maybe he wanted to appear 'smart'?

Never mind, I'm not from the US so the company route it is then.

[Thai_Law]

2 minutes ago, KhaoYai said:

Correct and my area allow 2 staff.

Do you understand now about the work permit and managing Director? Here in Pattaya, most foreigners who have a company with their Thai wife don't even get a work permit, don't become the legal managing director on the DBD paperwork, and the company is run by their wife and the staff while the foreigner hangs back and manages in the background. In fact, most just run the business as a sole proprietor under their wife's name and don't even open a company. The very few that open a company and become the managing Director with a work permit and minority share holder with their wife as the majority share holder, unfortunately still don't hire the required staff. I think you can read between the lines to figure this out. 

[Thai_Law]

13 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

Many years ago on another forum a regular poster claimed that he was working in Thailand self-employed in partnership with his Thai wife and had a work permit. 

Has anyone else heard of these 'husband/wife' partnerships and if so, do you have any details?

For this example the way you ask the question, I think you are missing many details that I would need to know. I suspect he was working in a company with his Thai wife where she was the majority share holder and he was one of the minority share holders and he just worked on his own business at the same time. Back then they also needed a minimum of three share holders and three promotors and now you only require 2. This is my theory anyways. Why, because the way you describe things just doesn't sound right and back then the sole proprietorship option was not widely known. 

[KhaoYai]

13 minutes ago, TLP said:

For this example the way you ask the question, I think you are missing many details that I would need to know. I suspect he was working in a company with his Thai wife where she was the majority share holder and he was one of the minority share holders and he just worked on his own business at the same time. Back then they also needed a minimum of three share holders and three promotors and now you only require 2. This is my theory anyways. Why, because the way you describe things just doesn't sound right and back then the sole proprietorship option was not widely known. 

My memory of the matter is very scant - it was a long time ago but he definitely said there was no company involved.

[KhaoYai]

20 minutes ago, TLP said:

Do you understand now about the work permit and managing Director? Here in Pattaya, most foreigners who have a company with their Thai wife don't even get a work permit, don't become the legal managing director on the DBD paperwork, and the company is run by their wife and the staff while the foreigner hangs back and manages in the background. In fact, most just run the business as a sole proprietor under their wife's name and don't even open a company. The very few that open a company and become the managing Director with a work permit and minority share holder with their wife as the majority share holder, unfortunately still don't hire the required staff. I think you can read between the lines to figure this out. 

Yes I'm OK with company formation, I have a good Thai lawayer. According to my lawyer, whether or not a simple 'director' is allowed is considered to be a 'grey area' - especially for those on a retirment based visa/extension. Managing director would definitely need a work permit.

 

[Thai_Law]

11 minutes ago, KhaoYai said:

Yes I'm OK with company formation, I have a good Thai lawayer. According to my lawyer, whether or not a simple 'director' is allowed is considered to be a 'grey area' - especially for those on a retirment based visa/extension. Managing director would definitely need a work permit.

I won't comment on this simple "Director" as you put it or "share holder/promotor" being in a grey area, as I don't want to comment on your legal representation. However, what I will say is this, the Managing Director is all that matters. Why? They can manage the company, sign contracts on behalf of the company, and be given signing authority on the bank account. 

[KhaoYai]

4 minutes ago, TLP said:

However, what I will say is this, the Managing Director is all that matters. Why? They can manage the company, sign contracts on behalf of the company, and be given signing authority on the bank account. 

Exactly, hence the need for a work permit.