News Forum - Thailand’s new tax twist: Overseas earners spending 180 days face income tax

[Thaiger]

Thailand’s tax policy, as declared by the Revenue Department, recently stipulated that an individual spending up to 180 days a year in the country and earning income from overseas will be liable for personal income tax. This decision, governed by Section 48 of the Revenue Code, is expected to primarily influence three groups: individuals involved … …

The story Thailand’s new tax twist: Overseas earners spending 180 days face income tax as seen on Thaiger News.

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[Ramanathan.P]

Does this includes those money which are being transferred into Thai mistresses and girlfriends accounts by their overseas partners? 

[buitterl]

Some tax is okay but to be hit with up to 35% on all worldwide income seems a little over the top considering we mostly already paid a lot of tax,  we have little or no rights to remain in this country, even not allowed to own our own patch of land... and now in addition we have to pay for the privilege... I like this country very much, but this rule will push me out. 

[ChrisS]

I am guessing this will drive out a lot of the wealthier ex pats who spend a lot of money in the country and leave only the ones living off their savings who are likely to spend far less. False economy?

[BigHewer]

Plain dumb but not surprising. The targets of the measures will have the means to avoid them or minimise them. And at least a few potential future investors or residents will think twice because of regulatory uncertainty.

[HolyCowCm]

We foreigners will not entirely put up with this and the Thai working on foreign lands will protest it. But the Thai stupid and poor sheep with the xenophobes will praise the sucking and rape and free money they can get. But they won’t know that they are all inline to be put into a tax system as well. 

They better come up with a more well thought out plan for this situation. I would pay an extra like 15,000 - 30,000 baht a year but I am not willing to have my money that is already cleared by the usa taxed again. And if I paid an extra 30,000 baht then I would want privileges like a long term visa and their health care system with a deductible. 
 

They are also talking and figuring out going after taxing inheritance. This has to be the work of the red shirt Master who just came back. Just the same BS he was up to before going into exile. Model Thailand like a Singapore and take money from whom you please. 

[TedG]

Governments are becoming unaffordable.  So, they have to look everywhere they can for revenue. 

[EdwardV]

“The principle of tax is that you must pay tax on income you earn from abroad no matter how you earn it and regardless of the tax year in which the money is earned.”

Wouldn't this apply to all income, pensions and such? Seems like it will increase the chances of double taxation. At the very least, increase in accounting fees to keep from being double taxed. 

Better to keep your offshore income offshore and just draw it as you need. 

[Grumpish]

The high earners that can afford to set up tax avoidance schemes will mostly just side step this, as usual. 

[Guest1]

I am still not sure, that it will cost ANYONE any Baht, who is getting a pension or such, which he is paying taxes for in her/his  / one of these countries:

Which countries have a double tax agreement with Thailand?

Thailand currently has concluded 61 double tax agreements with countries around the world.

Armenia	Hungary	Poland
Australia	India	Romania
Austria	Indonesia	Russia
Bahrain	Israel	Seychelles
Bangladesh	Italy	Singapore
Belarus	Japan	Slovenia
Belgium	Korea	South Africa
Bulgaria	Kuwait	Spain
Cambodia	Laos	Sri Lanka
Canada	Luxembourg	Sweden
Chile	Malaysia	Switzerland
China	Mauritius	Taipei
Cyprus	Myanmar	Tajikistan
Czech Republic	Nepal	Turkey
Denmark	Netherlands	Ukraine
Estonia	New Zealand	United Arab Emirates
Finland	Norway	United States of America
Germany	Oman	Uzbekistan
Great Britain and Northern Ireland	Pakistan	Vietnam
Hong Kong	Philippines

https://thailand.acclime.com/guides/double-taxation/#:~:text=The double tax agreement applies,days in a tax year

So living on a pension should be no reason, to pay taxes in Thailand, too.

"Just" the people , paying NO taxes  or earning money in one of the other 140 countries may have to pay.

The tricky part may be the "we can charge you for years back, in case you have no proof of paying taxes on this money you just about to transfer to Thailand"

But still, people with taxed income from US, Canada, most European countries, ...., can show tax payments on their  money.

On the other hand, like a friend of mine is doing it, sharing the year in Thailand and Indonesia (again, now after covid), plus 2 trips "home", is reducing the stay in every country under 180 days. 

Won`t help hubby with Thai wife, methinks.

  On 9/19/2023 at 8:52 AM, Ramanathan.P said:

Does this includes those money which are being transferred into Thai mistresses and girlfriends accounts by their overseas partners? 

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Interesting question. But i think, if money comes without person, probably not ;-)

Since the person  earning it is still in that country where the money comes from.

if not, the tax collectors would have to wait at every ATM and charge direct, in case someone is using a foreign card on it! And at western Union, ....

[Thaidup]

Doesnt, the USA do this already? Years ago I heard of US expats have to register their Thai bank acc or something like that, Caused some issues at THAI banks when US expats tried to open an account in Thailand.

[Thaidup]

What is going to happen to the Thai Hookers working overseas? Will they have to pay tax now?

[Marc26]

  On 9/19/2023 at 9:50 PM, Thaidup said:

Doesnt, the USA do this already? Years ago I heard of US expats have to register their Thai bank acc or something like that, Caused some issues at THAI banks when US expats tried to open an account in Thailand.

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Yes the US is very onerous against their expat citizens

And a US expat would also have to register any of his Thai wife's bank accounts as well

But the US also has a Foreign Earned Income Exclusion of $120k

So if you work in a non-tax country(say a lot of oil workers) or you can get companies to pay you as a consultant while you live elsewhere than you can make $120k tax free 

Now some countries don't follow you for tax reasons if you are truly not a resident (Like England)

[Ramanathan.P]

  On 9/19/2023 at 9:07 PM, Guest1 said:

Interesting question. But i think, if money comes without person, probably not ;-)

Since the person  earning it is still in that country where the money comes from.

if not, the tax collectors would have to wait at every ATM and charge direct, in case someone is using a foreign card on it! And at western Union, ....

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Then it would be good to give them a supplementary card with limited caps every month for their monthly living expenses and purchases. That way, there is no tax charged as all the transactions are recorded in the main card statement in a different country. 

[cowslip]

Let's face it...if you live in a country you should contribute in the same way as everybody else. I've paid taxes in Thailand for 20 years..... varying amounts and even had rebates. Glad to contribute.

I also feel happy to criticise as well.

I think most people are overreacting as we haven't  yet worked out what we will end up paying

[TWS60]

  On 9/19/2023 at 9:50 PM, Thaidup said:

Doesnt, the USA do this already? Years ago I heard of US expats have to register their Thai bank acc or something like that, Caused some issues at THAI banks when US expats tried to open an account in Thailand.

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Yes, that's been around for many years (assets as well), and I do remember when the US tightened the screws even further on foreign bank accounts around 2014 or 15 (something like that), requiring Thai banks to hand out IRS forms to Americans here to fill out.   It did create a bit of a fluff.  Recall a few UK/OZ guys saying on-line they were given US IRS forms by their Thai bank - I guess all us farangs look the same to Thais.  LOL.

[HolyCowCm]

  On 9/20/2023 at 8:24 AM, cowslip said:

Let's face it...if you live in a country you should contribute in the same way as everybody else. I've paid taxes in Thailand for 20 years..... varying amounts and even had rebates. Glad to contribute.

I also feel happy to criticise as well.

I think most people are overreacting as we haven't  yet worked out what we will end up paying

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I really don't follow you or see what you have posted on the whole or in the slighest about anything except you have some sort of position here that is in the first ( Uni-or Schools) or second (language school) education field..

And your paycheck taxes here were? I would bet laughable as minimal.

How much have you invested here? Do you have a wife? Do you have a family?

Have you bought a car? A Condo? A House? Do you have kids? Or does your partner or wife have a kid or kids? Do you take care of them?

I have contributed enough to still be a 3rd class non immigrant. Inequality like this prick in charge says is BS. If he wants to talk this walk then he should give up 98% of his earnings as well as his master who was in exlile who now is in a suite hospital room at the Police Hospital needs to toss all his wealth in as well. In equality? BS. BTW. Do you even know where the police hospital is in Bangkok?

[HolyCowCm]

There is an old saying. What is good for the goose, is good for the? I like the one, Put Up or Shut up. I am so tired of these no equal fuchs saying inequality when they are the top .05% - 1% - 5% of having everything. F-Them!

[cowslip]

  On 9/20/2023 at 11:46 AM, HolyCowCm said:

I really don't follow you or see what you have posted on the whole or in the slighest about anything except you have some sort of position here that is in the first ( Uni-or Schools) or second (language school) education field..

And your paycheck taxes here were? I would bet laughable as minimal.

How much have you invested here? Do you have a wife? Do you have a family?

Have you bought a car? A Condo? A House? Do you have kids? Or does your partner or wife have a kid or kids? Do you take care of them?

I have contributed enough to still be a 3rd class non immigrant. Inequality like this prick in charge says is BS. If he wants to talk this walk then he should give up 98% of his earnings as well as his master who was in exlile who now is in a suite hospital room at the Police Hospital needs to toss all his wealth in as well. In equality? BS. BTW. Do you even know where the police hospital is in Bangkok?

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more than you - pay up or leave, I'd say.

[Foolish_Farang]

So will my income from my superannuation (pension fund) which I have already been taxed on in Australia be classed as income in Thailand, and therefore be subject to Srettha's Farang Tax?

[TSS]

I don't keep lump sum in a Thai bank- do the monthly 65K thing. Last visa extension here, imm. required separate statements from my private pension and US social security showing  amount i received from each per year. Will those now be taxed here?

[Marc26]

  On 9/21/2023 at 4:25 AM, TSS said:

I don't keep lump sum in a Thai bank- do the monthly 65K thing. Last visa extension here, imm. required separate statements from my private pension and US social security showing  amount i received from each per year. Will those now be taxed here?

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No they are already taxed in the US and their is a tax treaty between the US and Thailand

You won't be double taxed

Thailand is in a weird situation because they let so many people live there on sort of transient visas

So it's going to he hard for them to implement taxing people, IMO

[ibgort]

Some income is not taxable. Such as "Compensation payments" from law suit settlements because they are not considered income. 

And one other issue arises. Taxation without representation. This comes from common law. Any tax lawyers care to jump in with your thoughts. If they tax you then you are also entitled to receive all the government services other taxpayers might receive. I'm sure a Court would agree.

[Foolish_Farang]

I came across this. 

There are many foreigners who make a living in Thailand. And also, the author is often asked about income tax of foreigners: Do you pay taxes or not  ? How ? People generally understand that If a foreigner resides in Thailand for less than 180 days in the year, no tax is required. 

First of all, we must know that Thailand collects personal income tax based on source of income and residence according to Section 41 of the Revenue Code. which can be summarized as follows:

The main source of money comes from 4 main sources:

1.Income from work done in Thailand*  by the person who has income working in Thailand, for example, a company in America sends Mr. A, an employee, to work in Thailand. Mr. A must bring the salary and wages incurred during the period. Working in Thailand must also submit a personal income tax form.

However, Mr. A may not have to pay personal income tax in Thailand. If the tax exemption conditions are met according to the double tax treaty.

2. Income from business done in Thailand*  such as Mr. Ek opening a shop. Selling food in Thailand Mr. Ek must submit the income generated for personal income tax.

3. Income from an employer's business in Thailand*  The recipient of the income may be working in Thailand or abroad. For example, Company B. Co., Ltd., a company under Thai law, sent Mr. Ek, an employee of the company, to work at a branch of A company in France, with Company B. Company Limited, paying the income every month. The employee must submit the income to pay personal income tax in Thailand.

4.Income from property located in Thailand*  This case is about income arising from property located in Thailand. Regardless of whether the owner of the property is a Thai or a foreigner, such as house rent, interest on deposits, dividends, etc.

Therefore, any person, whether Thai or foreigner, If you have income from the above income sources Income earners are required to pay personal income tax in Thailand. Regardless of whether the income is paid within or outside the country. and will be able to live in Thailand or not The law requires the collection of personal income tax on income generated.

residence principle Personal income tax will be collected when 3 conditions are met:

1. The income earner has income from work done abroad or from business. made abroad or from assets located abroad

2. Has brought income generated abroad into Thailand in that tax year and

3. The income earner has resided in Thailand for up to 180 days.

Therefore, whether Thai people or foreigners If there is income generated abroad By bringing the income generated into Thailand in that tax year. and have lived in Thailand for up to 180 days, must bring that money to pay personal income tax as usual In the case that all 3 conditions mentioned above are not met. Those who earn income do not have to pay personal income tax at all.

There are many people who can pay in Thailand. When you can pay to foreigners It is a misconception that foreigners who have lived in Thailand for less than 180 days do not have to pay personal income tax. or do not have to deduct withholding tax. In fact, if it is the case of the source of income occurring in Thailand Foreign recipients of income must pay personal income tax in Thailand. Unless it is exempt from income tax according to the double tax treaty that Thailand has made with the country where the income is earned. 

[TheDirtyDurian]

  On 9/21/2023 at 5:58 AM, Foolish_Farang said:

I came across this. 

There are many foreigners who make a living in Thailand. And also, the author is often asked about income tax of foreigners: Do you pay taxes or not  ? How ? People generally understand that If a foreigner resides in Thailand for less than 180 days in the year, no tax is required. 

First of all, we must know that Thailand collects personal income tax based on source of income and residence according to Section 41 of the Revenue Code. which can be summarized as follows:

The main source of money comes from 4 main sources:

1.Income from work done in Thailand*  by the person who has income working in Thailand, for example, a company in America sends Mr. A, an employee, to work in Thailand. Mr. A must bring the salary and wages incurred during the period. Working in Thailand must also submit a personal income tax form.

However, Mr. A may not have to pay personal income tax in Thailand. If the tax exemption conditions are met according to the double tax treaty.

2. Income from business done in Thailand*  such as Mr. Ek opening a shop. Selling food in Thailand Mr. Ek must submit the income generated for personal income tax.

3. Income from an employer's business in Thailand*  The recipient of the income may be working in Thailand or abroad. For example, Company B. Co., Ltd., a company under Thai law, sent Mr. Ek, an employee of the company, to work at a branch of A company in France, with Company B. Company Limited, paying the income every month. The employee must submit the income to pay personal income tax in Thailand.

4.Income from property located in Thailand*  This case is about income arising from property located in Thailand. Regardless of whether the owner of the property is a Thai or a foreigner, such as house rent, interest on deposits, dividends, etc.

Therefore, any person, whether Thai or foreigner, If you have income from the above income sources Income earners are required to pay personal income tax in Thailand. Regardless of whether the income is paid within or outside the country. and will be able to live in Thailand or not The law requires the collection of personal income tax on income generated.

residence principle Personal income tax will be collected when 3 conditions are met:

1. The income earner has income from work done abroad or from business. made abroad or from assets located abroad

2. Has brought income generated abroad into Thailand in that tax year and

3. The income earner has resided in Thailand for up to 180 days.

Therefore, whether Thai people or foreigners If there is income generated abroad By bringing the income generated into Thailand in that tax year. and have lived in Thailand for up to 180 days, must bring that money to pay personal income tax as usual In the case that all 3 conditions mentioned above are not met. Those who earn income do not have to pay personal income tax at all.

There are many people who can pay in Thailand. When you can pay to foreigners It is a misconception that foreigners who have lived in Thailand for less than 180 days do not have to pay personal income tax. or do not have to deduct withholding tax. In fact, if it is the case of the source of income occurring in Thailand Foreign recipients of income must pay personal income tax in Thailand. Unless it is exempt from income tax according to the double tax treaty that Thailand has made with the country where the income is earned. 

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Well that's clear then...