All Covid restrictions lifted in England as experts warn of disastrous consequences

[RuralSukhothai]

Recalling what Gandhi had quipped about when asked what he thought of Western Civilisation. 

His reply: "That would be nice"

 

 

[JohninDublin]

14 minutes ago, vlad said:

I do not doubt your integrity John and no one is. I simply remarked you constantly criticize the UK every time you post on this thread. You are also wrong about Russia being the first to inject the Covid jab. Im surprised you didn't mention the worlds first patient to have the Covid jab was in fact originally from Enniskillen  her name was Margaret Keenan in Coventry Hospital.

I never suggested you were challenging my integrity. In fact quite the opposite. You never shot the message, just the mesenger. I'll come back to that. 

The first vaccination was with the Sputnik V vax in Russia on December 5th. Mz Keenans was on Dec 7th. If you look at the news reports you will see headlines like "First to receive Pfizer jab. First in UK" etc. Then there is this this: https://www.rferl.org/a/sputnik-v-vaccine/31133608.html . To save you reading all the way through it, it is shown on a timeline. I also recall seeing the story on Sky News https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-vaccine-clinics-open-across-moscow-to-start-issuing-sputnik-v-jab-12151770

Regarding my criticism of the UK gov, I've said this mutiple times and I'll say it again. England has an 800 year of hearing of strange deadly diseases to the east of them, and two years later, they arrive in England killing hundreds of thousands. Nowadays, with air travel, we know that these diseases can circle te globe in weeks. Regardless, how stupid does someone have to be, to not see that like all the other diseases, this was going to be brought in by foreign travellers?

So what does the gov do? People who are repatriated from Wuhan and an infected cruise ship are taken straight to quarantine for 14 days. No infectious spread?  Excellent job. Whie we are wating for that to conclude, we get the first recorded case in the UK. A TRAVELLER who has just returned from a skiing holiday in the Swiss Alps. Within days there are other reported cases. Two of these include Chinese Students from WUHAN returning to York from Chinese New Year. I am watching these stories asking myself "Am I the only person who recalls that previous plagues etc, have always been brought in by travellers"? And for five months, the gov does nothing about using border controls to sctreen for infected people. Just aboiut this time, I am boarding a plane in BKK, and I have mutipe temp checks from the time I enter the airport until I reach the waiting area for my flight. 

During the meantime, the gov announces that in order protect the NHS, they have bought up 8k bed spaces at private hospitals. I think, "Fantastic"! Suddenly tey are deluged with patients so tey start looking to empty NHS beds. There are people, particularly the elderly who are being discharged. Do they use the BUPA beds? No! They send them off to care homes and thousands are infected and die, including care home staff. When they are taken t task over this, they claim to have put a "ring of steel" around care homes. This is rapidly contradicted by the owners and staff of the homes, while at the same time, it comes to light there is a massive shortage of PPE, in hospitals and even more so from care homes.This dumping is estimated to have led to an extra 20k lives being lost.

So the gov start rumaging all over the planet to find PPE. Eventually they announce "1 Billion pieces of PPE". It turns out that this includes millions of boxes of tissue, and that each pair of latex gloves is counted as two pieces. It's as if they want us to believe that all hospital workers have had an arm amputated in order to get the job.

Near the start of the epidemic, Thailand develops a test to detect CV. The gov immediately announcesthat they are going to fight the disease with a policy of, "Test, track and trace". Good idea. Very rapidly, theey run out of test kits. Then they abandon the policy. The reason given is that so many tests were coming back negative, they thought they were not getting enough bang for their buck. After a few weeks, SAGE persuade them that they must restart testing. They do so. Within days, there is a complaint about lack of testing kits. The gov responds that this is because of shortage of test facilities in labs. Suddenly labs all over the country are contacting the media to say, "We have capacity. Nobody has contacted us. What do they need"? Within days, the gov's narrative changes to "We can't produce enough test kits because there is a shortage of re-agent chemicals". Immediately, the chemical manufacturers contact the media and  say, "We have chemicals. Nobody has contacted us. What do they need".

Then Hancock, who Bojo referred to as "effing hopeless", makes his promise, "100k tests a day by the end of April. The tests are all being carried out at designated sites. That in in itself raises eyebrows when some people are told that they need to make a 200 mile round trip when there are nearer options. The suspicion is thar the gov are trying to discourage these people, who are mainly front-line workers in order to be able to say, "The reason why testing is so low is because not sufficient people atre coming forward". The figures are not loking good and on April 29th it seems highly the 100k target will not be reached. In order to boost the numbers, sends out 10's of 1000's of test kits by post. At this stage it becomes clear that the gov are fighting on two fronts, and the more important battle is PR.

In early April, Shaps is asked why there are no preventative measures on the borders? This is three months after the first reported cases in the UK.  Shaps replies, "Because the virus is already here".

I am at early May now. Shall I go on? Do you really think that my criticism of the gov is unfair? Did you see that I did praise them when they got something right? Did you notice how quickly they when they did get something right, they abandoned it? Do you think that I have been unfair in what I've written? Do you want me to write Part 2 of thus?

[vlad]

So in your opinion Margaret Keenan was NOT  the first to receive the Covid jab ? even though everyone around the World Acknowledges she was. 

[JohninDublin]

14 hours ago, vlad said:

So in your opinion Margaret Keenan was NOT  the first to receive the Covid jab ? even though everyone around the World Acknowledges she was. 

I am sorry to say, but it looks like your post has become an exercise in face saving. I am correcting my mistake in an earlier post, the Russians were not a month ahead but two days ahead of Mz Keenan.

Regarding your question, everyone around the world does not acknowledge that she was the first. If they do, then they are clearly wrong. Regardless, did you not bother to  follow the two links in the second Para of my previous post? 

The first is from a Russian site, which I suppose people might want to dismiss as propaganda. In it, they state  that the first vax was administered on Dec 5th. If you think that is propaganda, how do you explain that Sky News also reports the story on the same day, showing a woman in Russia being vaxxed. That is shown in the second link. 

And if you look at all the links surrounding Mz K, they all say the same thing, "First to receive Pfizer vax". 

Can I take it that we are done with this argument? 

Can I also presume that as you have not answered any of the questions in the final paragraph of my previous post, that you have stopped shooting the messenger regarding my criticism of Bojo?

[vlad]

yes the Worlds wrong you correct crack on. im not prepared to read half a page on one thread move on.

[JohninDublin]

1 hour ago, vlad said:

yes the Worlds wrong you correct crack on. im not prepared to read half a page on one thread move on.

More face saving.

No the world is not wrong, but you are. I've given you the incontroverible evidence. I strongly suspect that you've seen it, but need to say otherwise to continue to save face. 

I notice on another thread that following immediately on from a comment of mine, you suggest that someone needs to move on there as well, I strongly suspect the comment was meant for me. I notice you no longer directly link your replies to my posts. Could it be that this is yet another face saving tactic by you, where you hope that I don't see your comment, and then embarrass you yet again.

Presuming that the post on the other post was aimed at me, can I ask why you think I should move on, but nobody else should? What is about you and your attacking my right to free speech. 

There is a very simple solution here. If you don't like what I have to say, you can ignore me, block me,  prove me wrong or take it up with the mods. During the meantime, I think it's time you moved on from the obvious and unreasoned antipathy you have towards me. 

[vlad]

1 hour ago, JohninDubin said:

More face saving.

No the world is not wrong, but you are. I've given you the incontroverible evidence. I strongly suspect that you've seen it, but need to say otherwise to continue to save face. 

I notice on another thread that following immediately on from a comment of mine, you suggest that someone needs to move on there as well, I strongly suspect the comment was meant for me. I notice you no longer directly link your replies to my posts. Could it be that this is yet another face saving tactic by you, where you hope that I don't see your comment, and then embarrass you yet again.

Presuming that the post on the other post was aimed at me, can I ask why you think I should move on, but nobody else should? What is about you and your attacking my right to free speech. 

There is a very simple solution here. If you don't like what I have to say, you can ignore me, block me,  prove me wrong or take it up with the mods. During the meantime, I think it's time you moved on from the obvious and unreasoned antipathy you have towards me. 

your sounding like  Troll or your deliberately looking for an Argument i told you im not interested in your threads yet you carry on. 

[JohninDublin]

49 minutes ago, vlad said:

your sounding like  Troll or your deliberately looking for an Argument i told you im not interested in your threads yet you carry on. 

No I am not looking for an argument. It is you that has exuded hostility ever since you questioned my less than fawning posts about the way the UK. My own suspicion about that first post is that you thought i was some sort of sort of card carrying anti-Brit Paddy.

I don't suppose i've helped my own cause with you when I've corrected your factual errors, Now you resort to suggesting I'm a troll.

Where do you get off telling me what I can and can't post and where I post it. That's hardly indicative of someone who is not interested in my posts. I think your  real issue is that you don't like being held responsible for your own posts.

 

[KaptainRob]

8 hours ago, vlad said:

your sounding like  Troll or your deliberately looking for an Argument i told you im not interested in your threads yet you carry on. 

Kindly IGNORE this member, we are reviewing his recent posts including one now deleted.

[JohninDublin]

5 hours ago, KaptainRob said:

Kindly IGNORE this member, we are reviewing his recent posts including one now deleted.

Reviewing my posts? Wow?

I hope you will start with the post that gave rise to this. This came out from a post that I made criticising the UK's handling of CV. Everything I wrote in it was correct. His response was that I should not be making such posts. I told him at the time, that this was a decision for the mods. I'd be interested to hear your opinions on his attempt at censoring me?

I responded to that post including correcting a couple of errors he had made in his post. I then made a lengthy post including proving that the first person in the world to receive a vax, was not Mz Keenan. But a unnamed Russian. I also listed all the actions by the UK gov that I could recall, as well as praising them for the rare occasions they got things right. My post only covered the period up till May 2020. My presumption was that should be enough to convince most reasonable that I had valid reasons for my posts, but do offer to write more if he still wants me to.

His response was to attack me over the Keenan vax, telling me that the whole world knew she was first. This is in spite of the fact that I provide a link of a video from Skynews showing that the Russian was vaxxed first. He claims that he can't be bothered to read my post, but continues to mock me. How does that make me the villain in this piece?

Since then, I am involved in a debate regarding vaxxing. Directly beneath one of my posts, he writes saying to "move on". I ask if that post is intended for me. My thoughts are, "Is this him again indulging in his role as censor". I get no reply. I am left thinking that he is anti-vaxxer who doesn't like what I have written I then find a post from him AGAIN mocking me over Mz Keenan.

This morning I start reviewing overnight activity on here, and I come across a post from him to someone else regarding a scenario that he raises that if someone is facing death, and an experimental vax is the only thing that will save them, that they would take the vax. So clearly he is not an anti-vaxxer.I even vote for his post. So now the question is why when I am defending vaxxing, is he telling me alone, to "move on"? I can only conclude that he only wants to have an unwarranted dig at me.

I believe that this all started out because he thought I was a "card-carrying anti-brit Paddy" because of my uername and therefore should not be allowed to criticise the UK. I would mention that there are plenty on this forum who are not Thais who criticise the the Thai gov. I asked him should that be allowed if I can't be allowed to criticise the UK? I also pointed out that I am a dual-national who can and does vote in UK elections, and that most of my family still live in the UK. I think that gives me every right to be critical, as long as my posts are honest and in good faith.

During the meantime, I have contacted the mods about this issue, not as formal complaint but in the hope of putting this matter to rest, to ask what are the consequences of blocking another member. I've yet to receive a reply at time of writing. I don't particulary want to engage in any hostility with him, but I also don't want to be mocked by him when that mockery is based on an untruth.

Now I see your post to my antagonist which does not look as objectivity is in abundance. I even see that you've told him that you've deleted one of my posts, though I've yet to discover which one or why. Not looking good for me I think. 

For me the issue is extremely simple. In the absence of a reply from the mods to my query about blocking, should I be allowed to defend myself from my antagonists mockery which is based wholly on an untruth from him? Was Mz Keenan the first in the world to receive a vax? 

Take a look at this from Dec 5th https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-vaccine-clinics-open-across-moscow-to-start-issuing-sputnik-v-jab-12151770

Then take a look at this from Dec 8th https://news.sky.com/video/covid-19-vaccine-moment-uks-covid-vaccine-rollout-began-12154835

Once you've seen both of those, please tell me whether I have the right to defend myself against my antagonists mockery in these circumstances?

[JohninDublin]

11 hours ago, JohnG said:

Back in April Thailand and the UK were at about the same number of infections. the UK is now at 30,000+ daily. 60% of those in hospital with Covid are not vaccinated.

to my way of thinking this lifting of the restrictions should have been slow, so that it can be gauged as to what is acceptable and yet keeping a lid on infections 

I heard on the radio yesterday, that Bojo has not ruled out the use of vax passports to allow people to use pubs, discos etc. He will apparently make a decision on this next month.

That raises the question, that if thinks it might need to be implemented in the future, why is he not acting  now? If anyone is aware of the South Korea experience, they managed to get numbers down to one active case. They then allowed the reopening of night spots. One person who was asymptomatic at the time, visited  3 discos and there were 21 new infections from this. Now. SK has nearly 19k active cases. During the meantime the UK,  with over 1 mill active cases, and 8 straight days of reporting 40k new infections has out the "welcome sign" up at all disco/clubs/pubs etc.

[KaptainRob]

27 minutes ago, JohninDubin said:

Reviewing my posts?

No.

Look again and see who I was quoting/referring to.

[JohninDublin]

2 minutes ago, KaptainRob said:

No.

Look again and see who I was quoting/referring to.

WADR: Thanks for the reply, but your reply was to the other party telling him to ignore another members posts as I read it. 

I understand you now, but it wasn't clear. 

My apologies for the misunderstanding. If you'd care to delete both this post and my prior one to you, I'd have no objections.

Best wishes

[TobyAndrews]

On 7/20/2021 at 4:10 PM, RuralSukhothai said:

Recalling what Gandhi had quipped about when asked what he thought of Western Civilisation. 

His reply: "That would be nice"

Yes Churchill referred to him as the half naked fakir. He spent his whole life protesting about the white races.

He slept with his nieces to prove his celibacy, fair enough but for months?

When he visited England he stopped at the Seaman's Mission in the East End, the cheap half naked fakir.

[Guevara]

1 hour ago, JohninDubin said:

I heard on the radio yesterday, that Bojo has not ruled out the use of vax passports to allow people to use pubs, discos etc. He will apparently make a decision on this next month.

That raises the question, that if thinks it might need to be implemented in the future, why is he not acting  now? If anyone is aware of the South Korea experience, they managed to get numbers down to one active case. They then allowed the reopening of night spots. One person who was asymptomatic at the time, visited  3 discos and there were 21 new infections from this. Now. SK has nearly 19k active cases. During the meantime the UK,  with over 1 mill active cases, and 8 straight days of reporting 40k new infections has out the "welcome sign" up at all disco/clubs/pubs etc.

Who or what is 'Bojo'?

[JohninDublin]

9 minutes ago, Guevara said:

Who or what is 'Bojo'?

Boris Johnson.

[King Cotton]

6 minutes ago, Guevara said:

Who or what is 'Bojo'?

Sorry, Guevara, but having got to know you as a fairly knowledgeable poster since TT's early days, I'm not going to answer your question, being fairly sure that you asked it purely facetiously . . . right?

But, if a clue would help, this thread is about England and the decisions made by that country's Prayuth clone'

Get it?

[JamieT]

Im seriously considering moving back to the UK. Thai gov is so messed up!

[JohninDublin]

37 minutes ago, TobyAndrews said:

Yes Churchill referred to him as the half naked fakir. He spent his whole life protesting about the white races.

He slept with his nieces to prove his celibacy, fair enough but for months?

When he visited England he stopped at the Seaman's Mission in the East End, the cheap half naked fakir.

Would it be fairer to say that he spent his whole life protesting about the misconduct of the white races in oppressing the non-white races?

[Poolie]

2 minutes ago, JohninDubin said:

Would it be fairer to say that he spent his whole life protesting about the misconduct of the white races in oppressing the non-white races?

Aren't they both long dead now? He and Churchill?

[JohninDublin]

8 minutes ago, JamieT said:

Im seriously considering moving back to the UK. Thai gov is so messed up!

I suspect that nothing is ever going to change in TH. Since 1912, there have been 21 coups or attempts. 

[JohninDublin]

6 minutes ago, Poolie said:

Aren't they both long dead now? He and Churchill?

So is Henry VIII, but we still talk about him, for better or for worse.

[Poolie]

1 minute ago, JohninDubin said:

So is Henry VIII, but we still talk about him, for better or for worse.

I don't.

[JohninDublin]

3 minutes ago, Poolie said:

I don't.

Maybe I should have originally asked, "And your point is? Why are you directing that question to me when @TobyAndrews made the first mention of the pair"?

[King Cotton]

36 minutes ago, JamieT said:

Thai gov is so messed up!

And how about the UK . . . isn't that equally messed-up since Johnson's suicidal coming to power?

I left in 2012, since when things have grown steadily worse in my view - nothing to do with my leaving, of course! I'm just glad my kids are all career-achievers, with their financial security reasonably safe, since in BoJo's hands, I fear that nothing is safe.