IMMIGRATION BANK ACCOUNTS

[Faz]

6 hours ago, Ivo_Shandor said:

This is very interesting. 

Sorry if I ask for double-check, so whether one wants to show money in bank account to apply for certain non-o visas, and such money come from overseas,  the statement from bangkok bank is sufficient, whereas for other banks one will need that additional receipt, right?

You can only apply for the Non O type in Thailand.
The Non 0-A and 0-X visa types can only be applied for at a Thai Embassy.
There are also different financial requirements depending on whether you intend to use the 400/800K funds in a Thai bank account, or 40/65K per month overseas transactions, and whether you're applying for the Non O, or a 1-year extension of stay.

Whether transfers are 'tagged' as International can depend on the method of transfer and to which bank.

A friend and I after extensive research sometime ago drafted a document model on monthly transfers through Wise to various Thai banks and any extra documents required as proof of an overseas transaction.

TransferWiseandprovingtheforeignoriginsofyourtransfers_rev3dd2020-10-31.pdf 

[Faz]

10 hours ago, longwood50 said:

Last year I went to a branch that was not the office I opened the account at.  They automatically did it despite the assertions that 12 month statements and such a letter could only be done at the branch the account was opened at.  

This year they repeatedly said they didn't do it, until I provided a sample from Chonburi immigration that clearly was on Bangkok bank stationary.  Now of course that letter could not be generated until the statement came in.  I went to the branch which is not close and of course now, was told I would have to come back yet again because such a letter would not be available until the next day.  I went to the office found that the letter did not detail the prior 12 months but rather 12 months ending on December 31, 2021 which would not be acceptable to immigration.  They did change it while I waited.  Now the end of the story is that when I got to immigration and presented the letter the immigration officer pointed out that though it was my name, the account number on the letter was not.  Hence another trip back to Pattaya Klang to correct that.  

In summary, after 4 years of dealing with this, I changed to Kasikorn. 

You can request the standard account letter and a statement from any branch of your chosen bank, but once again I find staff poorly trained and incompetent at times, so appreciate the issues you've had.
However, you appear to be laying the problem with your bank, when in effect it's your IO that is creating the issue.

[Faz]

10 hours ago, longwood50 said:

As we all know what is written in Immigration Orders and what is required at various immigration offices is not the same.  As said, what was I to do, argue with him that the request was rogue and risk having "other errors" be found in my extension.  Was he being difficult, yes. But for all I know that was the request being made by the authorities in charge of Chonburi immigration. 

Have you even question their 'rogue' request and challenged it?
Personally, other than my very first extension application after entering on a Non O, where the IO insisted I required the 800K funds in an account for 3 months, against the 2 months the orders stated, I've never had a problem since. If I hadn't challenged the IO at that time, though, I would have had to depart Thailand.

As previously mentioned, I also submit extension applications on behalf of certain disabled expats, one of whom uses the 800K in the bank method and that has never raised any issues.
The other two use the monthly income method, that has raised issues, and had I not challenged the IO's, they also would no longer be in Thailand. From my own experiences, IO's actually show more respect, when for want of another word, 'you know your onions' (their orders) and go above their head.

[longwood50]

12 hours ago, Faz said:

However, you appear to be laying the problem with your bank, when in effect it's your IO that is creating the issue.

No not really, 

I asked for a 12 month statement.  I got a 6 month statement so I had to request and pay again.  I then had to wait for the 12 month statement.  I had to call to see if it arrived.  They promised to call when it arrived but did not call.  I asked for the detailed letter.  They said they didn't do it.  I had to show them the sample.  They told me to come back tomorrow.  I came back and the letter was wrong.  They had to re-do it.  I went to immigration and the letter contained someone elses account number. 

In all 6 trips to Pattaya Klang to do something that any bank and frankly any branch should be able to do immediately. 

I am certainly not the only retireee that banks at Bangkok Bank.  Yet each time I go in and make a very simple request for a 12 month bank statement and a confirming letter, I get this deer in the headlight look from bank personnel that suggests I am the first one who has ever asked for such a thing. 

 

[longwood50]

12 hours ago, Faz said:

Have you even question their 'rogue' request and challenged it?

After a series of unflattering news articles someone suggested to I believe Harry Truman if he would stand up to the newspapers.  He is quoted as saying, I never argue with someone who buys ink by the barrel and paper by the ton. 

I would say the same with immigration.  The only thing accomplished would be to have the person who I confronted be more confrontational and find other ways to make my life miserable. 

In my case, easiest thing to do was suffer through this year and change to Kasikorn Bank. 

[Faz]

2 hours ago, longwood50 said:

I asked for a 12 month statement.  I got a 6 month statement so I had to request and pay again. 

They issue a receipt for payment, which should clarify the service you applied for.
Whenever I've applied for a 12-month statement, the receipt clearly stated '12 month statement'.
However, I've also experienced them issuing a 6-month statement on arrival to collect, which they could have printed on the day, which is frustrating.
When I stood my ground, they were 'miraculously' able to print a 12-month statement within 20 minutes, which I insisted was at no additional charge.

[Faz]

2 hours ago, longwood50 said:

In my case, easiest thing to do was suffer through this year and change to Kasikorn Bank. 

I'm not convinced that will resolve your issue.
Surely from what you've stated, a 12-month statement is immaterial, if Immigration are requesting a letter detailing your monthly transfers, or do they request both, and why?

I don't know by what method you transfer monthly income, but if through Wise, and it's paid through their Bangkok bank account, it won't appear as 'International' even on the HQ's statement.
Kasikorn can trace the origin of the transfer, but will they bother.

Did they confirm they can provide the detailed letter that Chonburi request?

[Faz]

3 hours ago, longwood50 said:

I would say the same with immigration.  The only thing accomplished would be to have the person who I confronted be more confrontational and find other ways to make my life miserable. 

As stated previously, if I hadn't been 'politely' confrontational with an IO, when applying for my very first extension, and just accepted his word as gospel, then I wouldn't be here today.
I questioned that the 800K had to be in an account for 3 months prior to the first extension, as he stated, and offered him a copy of their orders, which stated otherwise.

He flipped, throwing my documents back across the desk and tearing some in the process, insisting I leave as others were waiting. I politely refused and insisted on seeing his commanding officer. With that, he snatched the documents out of my hand, some of which I'd picked up from the floor, and stomped off to a back office.
Moments later, he returned and without a word, but obviously in a huff, granted my extension.

Yeah, it wasn't exactly a great first experience with Immigration, but surprisingly I occasionally come into contact with the same IO, who now smiles and treats me with the greatest of respect.

[longwood50]

1 hour ago, Faz said:

They issue a receipt for payment, which should clarify the service you applied for.
Whenever I've applied for a 12-month statement, the receipt clearly stated '12 month statement'.
However, I've also experienced them issuing a 6-month statement on arrival to collect, which they could have printed on the day, which is frustrating.
When I stood my ground, they were 'miraculously' able to print a 12-month statement within 20 minutes, which I insisted was at no additional charge.

1. While I commend you for standing your ground with immigration, it is my experience that becoming confrontational with them is not the best option.  Could I have questioned it.  Sure, however as mentioned I suspect he would have then fly specked everything else to find fault with also.

2. As to the bank, they handed me  a statement as requested.  When I got home I noted it was only a 6 month and not a 12 month statement.  The manager said oh the 6 month is only 100 baht which is what I paid and the 12 month is an additional 100 baht.   One way or another it required three trips to Pattaya Klang. 

3. I showed the letter to the assistant manager at Kasikorn.  She indicated that yes they prepare such a letter upon request at the bank.  I also asked her about the FTT codes.  She said Kasikorn does code foreign deposits but the code is something other than FTT.

4. One thing I immensely dislike about Bangkok Bank is that if you do not go religiously to the bank to update your passbook every couple of weeks.  Transactions including FTT transfers are just lumped together in a "net" transaction amount.  So other deposits, payments and withdrawals are grouped together with the overseas transfer.  When they do that, it does not record as an FTT and of course it is impossible to identify it. 

Now, could I still encounter problems next year.  Of course.  However the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.  After 4 years of continual hassle with Bangkok Bank requiring multiple trips and multiple sitting in line, I elected to try something different.  

On a positive note I did my first transfer this month with Kasikorn.  With Bangkok Bank it was always the following business day.  Kasikorn was in my account in less than 5 seconds. 

[Faz]

8 minutes ago, longwood50 said:

1. While I commend you for standing your ground with immigration, it is my experience that becoming confrontational with them is not the best option.  Could I have questioned it.  Sure, however as mentioned I suspect he would have then fly specked everything else to find fault with also.

Unfortunately, Immigration personell are also misinformed or not informed at all.
I recall after the US, UK and Australian Embassies ceased issuing income letters, the first time I provide proof of an expat's income via monthly transfers on a Thai bank statement, they laughed and insisted on an Embassy letter. I produced their order amending order 138/2557 accepting overseas transfers to a Thai bank as an alternative, and they became more interested in how I'd obtained the document as if it was a classified secret. One IO took it into the commanding officer's office.
Within minutes, the CO appeared, apologising for the misunderstanding. It appears that although he had received notification of the new order, he hadn't informed the staff of the change.

It was at that point I realised not all IO's are informed of changes, only the CO receives an email, and they rely on the CO informing them. Lack of communication is the source and cause of many issues in all government departments and banks, IMO.

Another lesson learned was if having problems with an IO, request to see his superior.
I've also found the 1178 helpline very informed and useful in these situations.

33 minutes ago, longwood50 said:

2. As to the bank, they handed me  a statement as requested.  When I got home I noted it was only a 6 month and not a 12 month statement.  The manager said oh the 6 month is only 100 baht which is what I paid and the 12 month is an additional 100 baht.   One way or another it required three trips to Pattaya Klang. 

Had you been aware of the charges beforehand, then alarm bells should have sounded when they only charged 100 baht. Indeed, the fee for requesting a statement from HQ is 200 BHT.
We can quickly and easily blame others for our own ignorance, and I don't mean that in an offensive manner. You've learnt something from that experience.

38 minutes ago, longwood50 said:

3. I showed the letter to the assistant manager at Kasikorn.  She indicated that yes they prepare such a letter upon request at the bank.  I also asked her about the FTT codes.  She said Kasikorn does code foreign deposits but the code is something other than FTT.

That depends on the method of transfer, as I previously explained.
If the HQ statement, which should state 'International', doesn't, then you have a problem.

41 minutes ago, longwood50 said:

4. One thing I immensely dislike about Bangkok Bank is that if you do not go religiously to the bank to update your passbook every couple of weeks.  Transactions including FTT transfers are just lumped together in a "net" transaction amount.  So other deposits, payments and withdrawals are grouped together with the overseas transfer.  When they do that, it does not record as an FTT and of course it is impossible to identify it. 

If you update via an ATM, then transactions are 'lumped' to fit the page.
In branch and I only update my passbook annually, where they can manually turn the pages, every transaction is itemised. I simply request they update for the previous 12 months.
On the contrary, I used to have a Kasikorn account, but they could only update if I made a deposit or withdrawal on that day.

48 minutes ago, longwood50 said:

Now, could I still encounter problems next year.  Of course.  However the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.  After 4 years of continual hassle with Bangkok Bank requiring multiple trips and multiple sitting in line, I elected to try something different.  

Going insane in Thailand is par for the course. 
The "no habs", or "no can do" when you discover otherwise is extremely frustrating.
It's not just non Thais that have this problem, my wife often speaks of it, but they are frequently more laid back and try again on a different day with a different person until they achieve their goal.
It's inbuilt into their culture to just accept things as they are, rarely questioning or being confrontational for fear of loss of face.

[longwood50]

18 hours ago, Faz said:

Had you been aware of the charges beforehand, then alarm bells should have sounded when they only charged 100 baht. Indeed, the fee for requesting a statement from HQ is 200 BHT.
We can quickly and easily blame others for our own ignorance, and I don't mean that in an offensive manner. You've learnt something from that experience.

Yes I did learn   CHANGE BANKS 

[Faz]

6 hours ago, longwood50 said:

Yes I did learn   CHANGE BANKS 

Good luck!