News Forum - Bar employees in Indonesia accused of blasphemy over new drink scheme

[Thaiger]

Indonesia’s religious blasphemy law is growing more dangerous, according to rights groups. Police have charged 6 bar employees in the country with blasphemy over a new drink scheme. Under the scheme, bar-goers get free drinks if their names are Mohammad, or Maria. Mohammad is the name of the prophet of Islam, although it’s also a common men’s name in Muslim-majority countries. The bar and restaurant chain, ironically named Holywings, offered a free bottle of gin every Thursday for men named Mohammed, and women named Maria. But after religious party-pooper groups complained about the new promotion, police investigated the chain. One […]

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[Smiler]

Blasphemy laws? This is the 21st century is it not? Some countries are stuck in the Middle Ages.

[Stevejm]

38 minutes ago, Smiler said:

Blasphemy laws? This is the 21st century is it not? Some countries are stuck in the Middle Ages.

You would think that such laws would be extinct by now wouldn’t you? But there are a surprising number of countries that still have them.

https://end-blasphemy-laws.org/countries/

[palooka]

How dare they name their children after the prophet making it a 'common' name.

Who is Maria in Islam?

[Guest1]

30 minutes ago, palooka said:

How dare they name their children after the prophet making it a 'common' name.

Who is Maria in Islam?

A virgin gave birth to the son of God 

God has chosen her over all other woman in the world

Yes, it is the same god, just a different name (my bad, they gave god a name,we did not)

So Maria /maryam is the model woman: clean untouched and god worthy. 

 

[BigHewer]

I believe in pushing back against accepted norms that shouldn’t be so, but there are limits. Surely they must have known the promotion would draw fire? 

It may well turn out to be a master stroke if the chain is allowed to reopen. Now a lot more people have heard of “Holywings”.

[vlad]

Not just there in Indo Big H here in Blighty nursery and junior schools have had the Christmas Nativity shows  stopped because the Muslim parents got offended because their kids were subjected to Christianity values going against the teachings of Islam.

[Stevejm]

36 minutes ago, vlad said:

Not just there in Indo Big H here in Blighty nursery and junior schools have had the Christmas Nativity shows  stopped because the Muslim parents got offended because their kids were subjected to Christianity values going against the teachings of Islam.

Wrong! Plays were only stopped during Covid.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3420779-Nativity-play-banned-in-schools

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2021/nov/23/angels-delight-nativity-plays-make-cautious-comeback-in-uk-schools

Some muslim parents stopped their kids from participating which is a different matter

Edited June 29, 2022 by Stevejm

[Grumpish]

35 minutes ago, vlad said:

Not just there in Indo Big H here in Blighty nursery and junior schools have had the Christmas Nativity shows  stopped because the Muslim parents got offended because their kids were subjected to Christianity values going against the teachings of Islam.

There have also been cases in the UK of Muslim shop staff refusing to sell alcohol to people, and the stores bending over backwards to accommodate them. I can respect someone's culture and ethics, but I can't respect "because my sky fairy said so" any more than I can respect the irrational beliefs of, say, flat earthers and anti-vaxxers.  

[Stevejm]

33 minutes ago, Grumpish said:

There have also been cases in the UK of Muslim shop staff refusing to sell alcohol to people, and the stores bending over backwards to accommodate them. I can respect someone's culture and ethics, but I can't respect "because my sky fairy said so" any more than I can respect the irrational beliefs of, say, flat earthers and anti-vaxxers.  

Really? Have you got a link to that or is it more fake news off Facebook. It would seem unlikely that someone who objected so strongly to alcohol would apply for a job in a shop selling alcohol

Update.

 I found the story and it was a girl working at Tesco who said in the interview that she didn’t want to serve alcohol and she was assigned to a kiosk where alcohol wasn’t normally served but a customer brought alcohol for checking out. She apologized afterwards and the manager instructed her to call another staff member if it happens again.

Edited June 29, 2022 by Stevejm
Update

[Grumpish]

2 minutes ago, Stevejm said:

Really? Have you got a link to that or is it more fake news off Facebook. It would seem unlikely that someone who objected so strongly to alcohol would apply for a job in a shop selling alcohol

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2013/dec/23/marks-and-spencer-muslim-alcohol

https://metro.co.uk/2016/12/28/man-complains-to-tesco-because-muslim-woman-couldnt-sell-him-wine-6348011/

[vlad]

31 minutes ago, Stevejm said:

Wrong! Plays were only stopped during Covid.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3420779-Nativity-play-banned-in-schools

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2021/nov/23/angels-delight-nativity-plays-make-cautious-comeback-in-uk-schools

Some muslim parents stopped their kids from participating which is a different matter

This was happening years before Covid Steve some schools in Birmingham and Oldham are 95% Muslim with muslim only teachers. One school in Birmingham was caught hate preaching in assembly by a local Imman.

[vlad]

Like this 1 Steve

 

[Stevejm]

19 minutes ago, Grumpish said:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2013/dec/23/marks-and-spencer-muslim-alcohol

https://metro.co.uk/2016/12/28/man-complains-to-tesco-because-muslim-woman-couldnt-sell-him-wine-6348011/

I found it and updated my post already 

[Stevejm]

7 minutes ago, vlad said:

Like this 1 Steve

Interesting but no mention of nativity plays 

[Stevejm]

31 minutes ago, vlad said:

This was happening years before Covid Steve some schools in Birmingham and Oldham are 95% Muslim with muslim only teachers. One school in Birmingham was caught hate preaching in assembly by a local Imman.

Obviously hate teaching by anyone has to be stopped. Spreading hatred against muslims is also dangerous you end up with violence like that encouraged by idiots like Tommy Robinson. Are the majority muslim schools required to put on nativity plays?  

Edited June 29, 2022 by Stevejm

[Saunk]

5 hours ago, Grumpish said:

There have also been cases in the UK of Muslim shop staff refusing to sell alcohol to people, and the stores bending over backwards to accommodate them. I can respect someone's culture and ethics, but I can't respect "because my sky fairy said so" any more than I can respect the irrational beliefs of, say, flat earthers and anti-vaxxers.  

< Personal offensive comment removed >

Moderator.

[vlad]

7 hours ago, Stevejm said:

Obviously hate teaching by anyone has to be stopped. Spreading hatred against muslims is also dangerous you end up with violence like that encouraged by idiots like Tommy Robinson. Are the majority muslim schools required to put on nativity plays?  

I'm no fan of Tommy Robinson but if it was not for him a grooming gang that was in the court we would not have known as it was hushed up and a gagging order was placed Why ?? these were British-born Pakistanis why was it hushed up? and Tommy Robinson questioned if you would be happy seeing Jihadists living in your area without you being informed they had just been released from Prison.

[Guest1]

11 hours ago, vlad said:

and Tommy Robinson questioned if you would be happy seeing Jihadists living in your area without you being informed they had just been released from Prison

Wait, they are planning to release them before they are dead? When is the christian world learning? You almost never get ideology out of people.  This is true, regardless of religious believes. But religious ideology is the worst. Imho

[Stevejm]

14 hours ago, vlad said:

I'm no fan of Tommy Robinson but if it was not for him a grooming gang that was in the court we would not have known as it was hushed up and a gagging order was placed Why ?? these were British-born Pakistanis why was it hushed up? and Tommy Robinson questioned if you would be happy seeing Jihadists living in your area without you being informed they had just been released from Prison.

That’s the narrative that he and his supporters were touting but as I recall there was a temporary reporting gag in place for the duration of the trial only and by breaching it he almost handed the defendants a mistrial. Despite his claims to be doing the right thing TR is a career thug and convicted fraudster who moved from football to “politics” and makes money out of spreading hate.

Edited June 30, 2022 by Stevejm

[Stevejm]

3 hours ago, Guest1 said:

Wait, they are planning to release them before they are dead? When is the christian world learning? You almost never get ideology out of people.  This is true, regardless of religious believes. But religious ideology is the worst. Imho

One of them got 39 years and others various sentences including life ( minimum 18 years) depending on their involvement.They are not getting out anytime soon. I agree that extreme religious ideology is a bad thing. You don’t have to go back far in history to see when Christians led the way in bad behavior.

Edited June 30, 2022 by Stevejm

[Guest1]

48 minutes ago, Stevejm said:

You don’t have to go back far in history to see when Christians led the way in bad behavior.

But they, somehow, moved on, evolved out of the dark ages. 

minimum one other religions is hundreds of fundamental  years behind

[vlad]

Well the Rochdale grooming gangs got jail and promised deportation the do gooders stopped that now they're free and still in Rochdale.

[Stevejm]

3 hours ago, vlad said:

Well the Rochdale grooming gangs got jail and promised deportation the do gooders stopped that now they're free and still in Rochdale.

It’s not over yet!

https://www.itv.com/news/granada/2022-06-30/calls-for-home-secretary-to-deport-grooming-gang-members

[Stevejm]

4 hours ago, Guest1 said:

But they, somehow, moved on, evolved out of the dark ages. 

minimum one other religions is hundreds of fundamental  years behind

I agree but some recent news from USA shows how fragile progress can be. I don’t like the fact that the west lets certain countries get away with murder ( literally) if it suits their economic self interest ( KSA and Qatar come to mind.