News Forum - Ukraine’s Zelensky defies Russia’s ultimatum to lay down weapons

[EdwardV]

Russia has been spending about a billion rubles—or around $15.5 million—per hour on the Ukraine war since Russian President Vladimir Putin's military campaign began nearly three months ago, according to Russian Ministry of Finance data released Tuesday.

In April, Russia's national defense budget ballooned to around 628 billion rubles. In April of 2021, that figure was 275 billion. From January through April, Russia spent a total of 1.681 trillion rubles on military expenses, according to The Moscow Times. This amount is three times more than the country spent on education (517 billion rubles) and health care (615 billion rubles), the Times said. With sanctions and oil embargoes taking a severe toll on Russia's economy, Finance Minister Anton Siluanov said in late April that the country's budget had gone from a surplus to a projected deficit of 1.6 trillion rubles. He also said the country's National Wealth Fund (NWF) would be used as the main source for financing the budget deficit, Reuters reported.

Russia's Spending $15.5 Million an Hour on Ukraine War (msn.com)

That's just the money going out the front door. It's not counting the increased spending to replace many of the weapon systems destroyed, or the extra cost to care for those injured soldiers, etc.  

 

[Fanta]

2 hours ago, EdwardV said:

Russia has been spending about a billion rubles—or around $15.5 million—per hour on the Ukraine war

Russia earns about $40 million per hour from oil and gas. Plus their exports of agriculture products, weapons and mail order brides. Russia won’t be declaring bankruptcy any time soon and Winnie the Pooh will sling Russia some yuan if need be.

“Russia's Donbas offensive has lost momentum and fallen significantly behind schedule.”

Who set the schedule? Seems rather unfair that Russia is supposed to deploy their tanks into mud fields in the middle of an artillery battle. If I was Russia I never would have agreed to that timetable as it almost seems unfair.
Britain’s Ministry Of Denial and the Institute of Stories for Washington are both quoted in the same article so it must be totally credible and unbiased /s ISW just reprints stories from Ukraine’s misinformation department and the MOD were winning in Northern Ireland. They are both full of shit. 90% of Luhansk is under Russian control and the rest of Donbas region will likely follow. And I wouldn’t waste my money on a metro ticket in Ukraine because the railway won’t be running for much longer.

[Fanta]

4 hours ago, Crazy-Ruskie said:

As more and more reveal the truth this horrific war Russia has started will eventually end as the leaders and war criminals In Russia eventually get held accountable.

held accountable? as in actually punished? You are so precious. 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_war_crimes

[EdwardV]

19 minutes ago, Fanta said:

Russia earns about $40 million per hour from oil and gas. Plus their exports of agriculture products, weapons and mail order brides. Russia won’t be declaring bankruptcy any time soon and Winnie the Pooh will sling Russia some yuan if need be.

Whatever they are clearing is not enough to cover their expenses. Hence why their balance sheet flipped negative. Keeping in mind April income was at record levels to boot and they blew through that like a Thai bar girl at Terminal 21. Lets not forget Russia is having issues finding people to buy it's oil, and having to discount at record levels for what they can find (India is just loving it). Now they are self sanctioning their own gas and electricity sales. I still say those pipelines running through Ukraine and Poland are living on borrowed time. All they need is now is a naval battle in the Black Sea and 80% of their agriculture sales go offline. Yes Russia isn't going to declare bankruptcy anytime soon, but don't count on uncle Pooh to bail you out when that day comes. If you haven't noticed, they are having a few issues of their own.  

 

19 minutes ago, Fanta said:

Seems rather unfair that Russia is supposed to deploy their tanks into mud fields in the middle of an artillery battle. If I was Russia I never would have agreed to that timetable as it almost seems unfair

I fully agree. What fool decided to invade in February? 

[vlad]

17 hours ago, Fanta said:

Armies cannot win battles without weapons and supplies. Ukraine’s oil refineries, fuel depots, manufacturing, supply & repair area are hit daily, bridges and railways are being destroyed to name the most obvious. Ukrainian is flying 5-10 sorties a day. 

Maybe Haw-Haw but there not dropping Bombs on Schools like your Comrades are.

[Fanta]

15 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

All they need is now is a naval battle in the Black Sea and 80% of their agriculture sales go offline

The UN dude was saying the he intends to get sales of Russian and Ukrainian agricultural products back on track so I doubt that Black Sea will be the scene of a naval battle. Clear out all those mines (that Ukraine absolutely positively didn’t lay there 555) out of the ports, give Russia a few megayachts or similar back and the foodstuffs will flow. 

[EdwardV]

1 minute ago, Fanta said:

The UN dude was saying the he intends to get sales of Russian and Ukrainian agricultural products back on track so I doubt that Black Sea will be the scene of a naval battle. Clear out all those mines (that Ukraine absolutely positively didn’t lay there 555) out of the ports, the Russia a few yachts or similar back and the foodstuffs will flow. 

Yes but he wants Russia to be part of the plan, even if it's just their approval. That's not happening. It's Russia's intention to cut off Ukraine's money, why in the world would they agree to the shipping if that's it's main source of revenue? The mines need to be cleared by Russia, since they are the one's who are controlling that part of the sea. Of course if they let NATO do so, I'm sure they would be more than happy to help. How did Ukraine lay the mines if they had no ships? Just curious. 

[Fanta]

13 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

How did Ukraine lay the mines if they had no ships? Just curious

Why would Russia lay the mines if Ukraine had no ships? This is the same Ukrainian Navy that scuttled their flagship frigate in port. 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-navy-frigate-sunk-mykolaiv-b2029108.html

In other news: 
“Russia on Wednesday said it was using a new generation of powerful lasers in Ukraine to burn up drones, deploying some of Moscow's secret weapons to counter a flood of Western arms.”

Zelenskky, as usual didn’t have a good thing to say about the Russians and called the lasers wonder weapons.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/russia-touts-new-generation-blinding-laser-weapons-2022-05-18/

[EdwardV]

4 minutes ago, Fanta said:

Why would Russia lay the mines if Ukraine had no ships? This is the same Ukrainian Navy that scuttled their flagship frigate in port.

That's called a softball. To stop all shipping in and out of Ukrainian ports. Before they can ship out grain or anything else, the mines have to be removed. Same with shipping things in ... 

Still don't see how Ukraine lays those mines without any ships.  

[EdwardV]

Seems the new American "lend-lease" law applies to more countries than just Ukraine: 

The U.S. Army is weighing options for fast-tracking the delivery of M1 Abrams tanks to Poland to boost the NATO nation’s armor capabilities and replace old tanks donated to Ukraine for use in the war against Russia. Through new pathways opened by Congress, including the recently revived Lend-Lease program, Poland could take possession of U.S.-built armor years ahead of current schedules, the Army’s chief weapon buyer told lawmakers yesterday.

Bush said the Army could deliver the tanks and other vehicles through the recently-passed Ukraine Democracy Defense Lend-Lease Act. That law provides explicit authority for transfers of U.S. arms to Ukraine, but also mentions helping other "Eastern European countries impacted by the Russian Federation’s invasion of Ukraine," which would include neighboring Poland. The stated goal of that assistance would be “to help bolster those countries' defense capabilities and protect their civilian populations from potential invasion or ongoing aggression by the armed forces of the Government of the Russian Federation," the legislation states.

U.S. Army Could Use New Lend-Lease Act To Speed M1 Abrams Tanks to Poland (msn.com)

Would allow the US to backfill Poland even faster, and in turn allow them to continue to send tanks to Ukraine. I think they still have about 350 more T-72s and the Polish variant the PT-91 left in it's stocks. Enough to outfit another three brigades (they have already donated 230 T-72s). 

[Fanta]

Just now, EdwardV said:

That's called a softball. To stop all shipping in and out of Ukrainian ports. Before they can ship out grain or anything else, the mines have to be removed. Same with shipping things in ... 

Still don't see how Ukraine lays those mines without any ships.  

Are you serious? Ukraine sunk their own ships and the balance were converted into submarines the day after the Russians invaded. What is the gain for  Russia to lay mines in waters they already control? It’s the same logic as laying landmines behind you to ensure you cannot retreat - madness. Shipping in and out of Ukraine ports is controlled by Russian warships. Ukraine has been as quiet about this sea mine business as they have about the total number of soldiers involved in their “special evacuation” from Mariupol.
https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2022/03/opinion-is-there-a-serious-sea-mine-threat-in-the-black-sea/

[EdwardV]

46 minutes ago, Fanta said:

What is the gain for  Russia to lay mines in waters they already control?

But they don’t control the waters do they? It takes a lot more than a frigate to sail around a few days to control a major sea lane. Besides the fact Ukraine didn’t have the ships or time to mine the area, I’m guessing they just magically appeared. 

[Fanta]

32 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

But they don’t control the waters do they? It takes a lot more than a frigate to sail around a few days to control a major sea lane. Besides the fact Ukraine didn’t have the ships or time to mine the area, I’m guessing they just magically appeared. 

If the Russian Black Sea Fleet doesn’t control the Black Sea  then it must be another navy that is not even there /s Russia does not need mines to control ship movements into the ports. Both Russia and Ukraine deny laying the mines. I’d bet money that a country that sunk their own ships on day 1 of the war had given up on controlling the sea and decided to turn the sea into a weapon. This was not a spur of the moment decision and the mines would have been laid well in advance. It just makes sense. 

One of the UN Chief’s proposal is for a 20 mile wide corridor that ships can traverse for grain shipments. That’s why they need Russian agreement to any naval plan to move grain. 

[EdwardV]

12 minutes ago, Fanta said:

This was not a spur of the moment decision and the mines would have been laid well in advance. It just makes sense. 

One of the UN Chief’s proposal is for a 20 mile wide corridor that ships can traverse for grain shipments. That’s why they need Russian agreement to any naval plan to move grain. 

So the country that called up its reserves a day before the invasion, mined its waters well in advance? Ok if you say so. 
 

They don’t need Russian agreement, they want it. Not the same thing. 

[Fanta]

And don’t forget those underwater nuclear drones! Radioactive man made tsunamis! Who the hell thought of that and approved their commission. Those people are freaking nutcases. Someone needs to take their toys away or get them to chill out. 

https://hindustannewshub.com/world-news/poseidon-drone-how-dangerous-is-russias-underwater-nuclear-drone-poseidon-threatening-to-remove-britain-from-the-map/?amp=1

[Fanta]

18 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

So the country that called up its reserves a day before the invasion, mined its waters well in advance? Ok if you say so. 

Oh come on… as if the Ukrainians couldn’t see it coming. In 2014 Russia sunk 75% of the Ukrainian Navy. Ukraine would have been negligent in the extreme not to have expected Russia to control access to the ports. At worst they get some Russian minesweepers to come in nice and close and they can throw some Harpoons at them.

Russian agreement is clearly needed otherwise it will be no coincidence that Odessa’s ports are attacked the same day transport ships move in to load grain. Russia may or may not want Odessa’s ports however if it is a choice between choking Ukrainian exports or firing in some “Don’t go there” missiles we know which one the Russians will choose.

What’s the big deal anyway? I would have mined the heck out of the area in advance knowing full well that the sea was soon to be a no go zone.

[EdwardV]

41 minutes ago, Fanta said:

Russian agreement is clearly needed otherwise it will be no coincidence that Odessa’s ports are attacked the same day transport ships move in to load grain.

If they knew it was coming, why did they wait till the day before to call up reserves? It really is that simple.

Grab up 2-3 grain ships, put them under the UN flag. Fill them up with media, and do gooders. Make sure everyone knows it’s grain to feed poor starving kids, and sail them right on in. Carry it on live TV, how much fun would that be? 
 

Oh wait there is the problem of those pesky mines again. You know the ones Ukraine set without any ships to do so, to keep out who again? Oh that’s right the cargo ships they need for their economy to function. 

[EdwardV]

Russian tyrant Vladimir Putin has lost 42 of his colonels to the war in Ukraine, with one being killed every two days. Col Denis Kozlov, 40, was killed in the besieged country and had replaced Colonel Sergei Porokhnya, 45, who died on March 14. Local media in Russia confirmed the colonel “heroically died on May 11 when guiding a pontoon ferry to make a further advance of the troops." Kozlov was the second commander of the 12th Separate Guards Engineers of Keningsbersko-Gorodokskaya Red Banner Brigade to have been killed since the start of the invasion.

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/world-news/putins-invasion-sees-42-russian-26995191

 

Ukrainian forces blew up a Russian armored train that they said was carrying personnel in the occupied city of Melitopol on Wednesday, according to Ukrainian officials.The day before, guerrillas in Melitopol claimed they "eliminated high-ranking Russian servicemen," according to Ukraine's Zaporizhia Regional Military Administration. The administration, which shared the findings in a Telegram post on Tuesday, did not specify how and how many of the Russian servicemen were purportedly killed. It also did not identify any of the servicemen by name.

https://www.newsweek.com/russian-train-explosion-high-ranking-soldiers-killed-ukraine-reports-1707970?amp=1
 

I prefer the term “partisan” 

 

[Fanta]

26 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

Oh wait there is the problem of those pesky mines again. You know the ones Ukraine set without any ships to do so, to keep out who again? Oh that’s right the cargo ships they need for their economy to function

imo, Ukraine set the mines before the war started to slow or stop a Russian naval invasion. You believe Russia did it AFTER they already controlled the Azov Sea and they also risked enemy fire to lay some close to shore at Odessa. For what?  Even the TAT of Ukraine wouldn’t be bold enough to add in Black Sea cruises to their estimated tourism totals. If you are not Russian authorized to be in the Black Sea you’ll be swimming home.
Forget the mines, how are any transport ships even supposed to get through a Russian sea blockade to  access the ports let alone ship goods out ?
imo, believing that Ukraine didn’t deploy the sea mines is the same as saying they don’t use land mines - great for the “nice guys don’t use mines” story that any Princess Di fan holds dear to their heart but not based in the realities of wartime defense. I’d be sowing those things like Ukrainian corn seeds if it was my port. 

Russia bad, Ukraine good - we can agree on that. 

[Fanta]

13 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

I prefer the term “partisan” 

Good word. And might explain why some male civilians are being found shot dead.

/cue the war crime wailers… 

[EdwardV]

8 minutes ago, Fanta said:

Good word. And might explain why some male civilians are being found shot dead.

Nothing proves your claim of liberating a city quite like shooting dead its inhabitants. 
 

There is no better way to generate a robust insurgency than to brutalizing a country’s citizens. There is an amazing level of irony in the fact that particular lesson is lost on Russians. 
 

I couldn’t choose which one I liked better so I used both hahaha 

[oldschooler]

10 hours ago, billywillyjones said:

Lol you really don't have  clue what you are talking about.  Old schooler needs to go back to school lol.

I recognize & call out vague, naive “ why can’t we all live in peace” gibberish when I see it. Seems you never left behind school- level politics.

What I understand is that types like you think like that, in defiance of reason, history, facts, achievements of West, due to a sense of entitlement, inferiority complex and being unable to function properly in a liberal capitalist society, which requires strength to defend it. 

[oldschooler]

9 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

Nothing proves your claim of liberating a city quite like shooting dead its inhabitants. 
 

There is no better way to generate a robust insurgency than to brutalizing a country’s citizens. There is an amazing level of irony in the fact that particular lesson is lost on Russians. 
 

I couldn’t choose which one I liked better so I used both hahaha 

Yes. Seems he believes civilians don’t have the right to take up arms to fight the cruel invader ….. and actually deserve to be shot for fighting back to defend homes, family, land. Shame on them for “ prolonging” the war& upsetting Putin. Just rollover and accept that Putin is justified !

Russians understand their actions are generating further resistance but it’s simply their nature …..they just can’t help their criminal actions…..ingrained culture & custom.

[oldschooler]

41 minutes ago, Transam said:

Stay under the bed chap.......

Communistic Term “ stooges” gives away the comrades’ loyalty…..applied to “ counter- revolutionaries”, i,e.  those rounded up at 3am to receive a neck bullet at the Lubyanka …….and unmarked mass grave. 

[EdwardV]

5 minutes ago, oldschooler said:

Russians understand their actions are generating further resistance but it’s simply their nature …..they just can’t help their criminal actions…..ingrained culture & custom.

Interesting you say that: 

The U.S. has gathered intelligence that shows some Russian officials have become concerned that Russian forces in the ravaged port city of Mariupol are carrying out grievous abuses, a U.S official familiar with the findings said Wednesday. The Russian officials are concerned that the abuses will backfire and further inspire Mariupol residents to resist the Russian occupation. The U.S. official, who was not authorized to comment publicly and spoke on the condition of anonymity, said that the Russians, who were not identified, also feared that the abuses will undercut Russia's claim that they've liberated the Russian-speaking city.

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/russia-fears-mariupol-ukraine-abuse-will-backfire-us-intelligence/

I agree, I don’t think they can help themselves. It’s just second nature for them.