Question about household notification (TM30) law

[Isaac]

I have a few questions about the new TM30 law. Does anyone know how they interpret it? It says:

"2.2 After a householder, owner or possessor of dwelling place or hotel manager already made a notification according to 2.1, then the alien goes to occasionally stay somewhere else and return to stay at the original place within the notified period of stay tahat has not yet ended, such householder, owner or possessor of dwelling place or hotel manager is not required to make a notification again."

So you also have to file a TM30 at the somewhere else you occasionally stay, right?

When you go back to where you already made a notification, you don't have to file again, according to this, but from what I have read here and experienced, if you want to do your 90 day report, in practice you do have to.

If you go again to the somewhere else you occasionally stay, do you have to file again? Like if you have two houses and go back and forth, it sounds like you would have to file just once at each place and then you could go back and forth without filing. It that actually true?

[Faz]

If you live in Nakhon Nowhere and you filed a TM30 at that local office, then they approve any 90 day reports.
If you go to temporary stay elsewhere, there is no requirement to file a further TM30, but you must continue to submit your 90 day reports where your registered at Nakhon Nowhere.

If you wish to file 90 day reports at a different office to the one where your registered, then you must file a new TM30 at the Immigration office in that different Province to change your address.

By 'temporary', they mean for short periods.
You can submit 90 day reports online regardless of where you stay without Immigration being any the wiser.

[Isaac]

Hi Faz,

Thanks a lot. That makes sense: The TM30 reflects where you permanently (or mostly) live. I suppose 'short periods' is a matter of judgement on the part of the official? Longer than 24 hours is ok but 6 months would probably not be acceptable?

And how does extending fit in here? Do you have to file for an extension in the same place you are currently registered with the TM30?

Sorry for the complicated questions but I do quite a lot of traveling and my situation is really kind of like this...

Thanks again for your help,

Isaac

[Saltire]

3 hours ago, Isaac said:

I have a few questions about the new TM30 law.

Has something changed?

I think I have the only IO that still insists on a new TM30 on my return if I stay somewhere out of my province. I haven't been out of province in a year so it would be good to know if it's a change.

I do 90 day online with no techie problems so that's not an issue for me.

Every time I ask the IO if I go to Pattaya for example, do I need to do a new TM30 on my return within 24 hours, they insist I do.

I am tempted to not report after my next trip and see what happens, but it feels like i'd be tempting fate.

 

[Isaac]

Hi Saltire,

The law is from 2020, but I just found out about it recently. There's a pdf of it on the post listing laws and regulations. I suspect not all the IOs know about it, or at least they don't all follow it. I try to avoid tempting fate and just do what they say if possible!

Maybe one of the more knowledgeable folks here can give you a better answer.

Best of luck.

 

[Pinetree]

3 hours ago, Isaac said:

Thanks a lot. That makes sense: The TM30 reflects where you permanently (or mostly) liv

And the province of your yearly extension of stay.  I have three properties around Thailand and I regularly move between each, but my TM30 is for my primary residence in Sattahip.   

[Faz]

2 hours ago, Isaac said:

And how does extending fit in here? Do you have to file for an extension in the same place you are currently registered with the TM30?

That's correct, you can only file for extensions at the Immigration office within the Province your registered as 'staying' on the TM30. Same with 90 day reports.

You can only file one place of 'permanent' residence.

[Faz]

1 hour ago, Saltire said:

Has something changed?

I think I have the only IO that still insists on a new TM30 on my return if I stay somewhere out of my province. I haven't been out of province in a year so it would be good to know if it's a change.

I do 90 day online with no techie problems so that's not an issue for me.

Every time I ask the IO if I go to Pattaya for example, do I need to do a new TM30 on my return within 24 hours, they insist I do.

I am tempted to not report after my next trip and see what happens, but it feels like i'd be tempting fate.

Download PDF here: Immigration application forms for download. - > Visas, Long Stay, Extensions, Re-entry Permit - Thaiger Talk (thethaiger.com)

 

 

Change in TM30 filing regs. Change in TM30 filing Regs..pdf 

 

[Isaac]

1 hour ago, Pinetree said:

And the province of your yearly extension of stay.  I have three properties around Thailand and I regularly move between each, but my TM30 is for my primary residence in Sattahip.   

Thanks Pine tree and Faz.

Does there seem to be any maximum length of time you can stay at your other two properties? Or do you just use the online system and report using the Sattahip address?

[Pinetree]

28 minutes ago, Isaac said:

Thanks Pine tree and Faz.

Does there seem to be any maximum length of time you can stay at your other two properties? Or do you just use the online system and report using the Sattahip address?

I believe that the rules state more than 48 hours, but I am not sure, but that is never enforced. I move freely between the three, sometimes spending up to 4 weeks in one or the other.  Two of my friends also move between their properties around me and their Island houses. This is common practice.   I don't tell, immigration and as far as I can tell, they are not at all interested, so long as your primary residence remains your declared TM30 property and you make your 90 day reports to the appropriate office accordingly .  

[Isaac]

Thanks, Pinetree. That's good to hear.

[Saltire]

16 hours ago, Faz said:

Download PDF here: Immigration application forms for download. - > Visas, Long Stay, Extensions, Re-entry Permit - Thaiger Talk (thethaiger.com)

Change in TM30 filing regs. Change in TM30 filing Regs..pdf 

Thanks  a lot, i've printed it off for now.

What would be really useful would be the original notice in Thai.

If I try to convince them next time with a 2 page English document I know the likely response.

If it's in Thai they may actually read it.

Thanks

[Faz]

15 minutes ago, Saltire said:

What would be really useful would be the original notice in Thai.

Ask and thee shall receive.

Change in TM30 reporting regs (Thai).pdf 

 

[Saltire]

2 hours ago, Faz said:

Ask and thee shall receive.

Change in TM30 reporting regs (Thai).pdf 1.14 MB · 0 downloads  

Thanks!

[Isaac]

Hi Faz,

I don't suppose you know where I could find information (ideally the actual law or police order) on the stipulations of the non-ED visa?

Thanks.

[Isaac]

Hi again,

Here are some more OCD thoughts on the immigration rules, for anyone interested:

I had a look at the documents about reporting change of address and found this:

In the regulation dated 14 Jan 2020, concerning the alien reporting himself (TM27, Section 37) it says:

6. Notifications for 2.2 (notification of moving residence within 24 hours) and 2.3 (notifying local police within 48 hours if traveling to a different province for more than 24 hours) do not apply to an alien permitted to temporarily stay in the Kingdom for the purposes as follows:

6.1 Diplomatic or consular mission ...

6.10 Study and observation ...

6.16 Alien, who ia a parent, spouse, or child ... etc. (I.e. non-imm visas or longer-term)

Then in the regulation dated June 5 2020, concerning the house owner reporting (TM30, Section 38) it has this:

2.2 After a householder, owner or possessor of dwelling place or hotel manager already made a notification according to 2.1 (Notify a competent official at an Immigration office located in a locality in which the house, dwelling place or hotel is located within twenty four hours from the time an alien has taken residence.), then the alien goes to occasionally stay somewhere else and return to stay at the original place within the notified period of stay tahat has not yet ended, such householder, owner or possessor of dwelling place or hotel manager is not required to make a notification again.

So does this mean if you travel temporarily you don't have to file a TM27, which means you don't change your residence, and so don't count as having 'taken residence' here? And therefore the host doesn't have to file a TM30 for you?

And as reporting under section 37 doesn't apply at all for those with long-term visas, then if these two regulations are meant to go together, it sounds like as long as you get back to your official place of residence 'within the notified period that has not ended', you're OK.

Any thoughts???

Best wishes all,

Isaac

[Faz]

4 hours ago, Isaac said:

I had a look at the documents about reporting change of address and found this:

In the regulation dated 14 Jan 2020, concerning the alien reporting himself (TM27, Section 37) it says:

There are lots of regulations, without linking to it, it's like looking for a needle in a haystack.

Many of the regulations are never changed they are amended by further regulations. If you haven't been in Thailand when such amendments are made it rather confusing to follow.

Foreigners used to advise change of address using a TM28 which was 'shelved'. The TM27 is only if you change the address you original notified as staying when you entered Thailand - again mute.
The TM30 covers any change it 'permanent' residency.

[Faz]

On 3/18/2022 at 1:05 PM, Isaac said:

I don't suppose you know where I could find information (ideally the actual law or police order) on the stipulations of the non-ED visa?

All Immigration Orders are listed here;

 

[Isaac]

Thanks. 

Here's the pdf:

Repeal section 37 of the Immigration Act.pdf

I was informed on another forum that it refers just to TM28. Maybe this is the order that shelved it.

Thanks for the links. I'll check them out.

[Faz]

That repealed the requirement for a foreigner to file a TM28.
Originally if a foreigner moved to a new permanent place of residence, the house master filed a TM30 and the foreigner filed a TM28. The repeal ended filing the TM28 under section 38 of the Immigration Act, only the TM30 under section 38 is now required.
Immigration Act B.E. 2522 (1979) ENG.pdf

They introduced the TM27 TM 27 Notification of change of Address if different than TM6..pdf 
This is only used if when entering Thailand you state a place of stay on the TM6 arrival card, but then change your mind after entering and stay elsewhere other than that originally stated.