News Forum - Travel in 2022 – how Russia is reshaping the world’s travel industry

[Thaiger]

Russians were the most visible travellers heading to Thailand post February 1, 2022, when the Thailand Pass Test & Go option was rebooted. Even with its 2 days of pre-booked SHA+ quarantine and PCR tests, along with US$50,000 Covid insurance (which has since been reduced to $20,000), the Russian travellers were delighted to jump on a plane and take the long trip to the much warmer Land of Smiles.  That situation has now radically changed and the world is reverberating to the full impact of Russia’s aggression and the invasion of Ukraine. Now there’s a mere trickle of daily flights […]

The story Travel in 2022 – how Russia is reshaping the world’s travel industry as seen on Thaiger News.

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[vvdb.fr]

personally I would like Thailand to go further and ask tourists in addition to vaccination against COVID, that of the flu, measles...

It is not because you have the money to travel that you have to do it ignoring the local populations...

Edited March 5, 2022 by vvdb.fr
English

[Shade_Wilder]

 

"The loss of the Russian travellers underscores a critical need for the Thai government to quickly modify the Thailand Pass, or scrap it completely. With so many other factors now making international travel difficult, Thailand will have to rethink their short to medium term tourism strategies to retain its share of the international travel market."

 

Interesting article.

 

I see three major issues coming up for Thailand, and I wonder if they have the capacity/capability to address them adequately.

 

First, the ThaiPass. Many have written on this, so I won't bother adding much. However, I think that there is one very key point; the ThaiPass essentially takes power away from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and gives it to the Security Services to screen visitors. My question is will Thailand return the granting of visas to Embassies and consulates, or will it retain a centralized system where approval is given in Bangkok (yes, once again "The Kingdom of Bangkok and Surroundings" rears its head). If the power stays in Bangkok, it'll annoy people and they won't come. If it is returned to the Embassies and Consulates, Thailand will get more people. 

 

So, Thailand, which is it? Security or a Tourism business?

 

Second, how much of an effort is Thailand going to put in to bolster and grow the Western market? And, in tandem, how much of an effort is Thailand going to put in to bolster and grow the Chinese market? The logical, simple answer is to do both, but they are at times contradictory and mutually exclusive. Any hotel that does a buffet breakfast for Chinese tourists will see Westerners leave ASAP. Any shop that welcomes buses full of Chinese tourists will not see Western browsers/shoppers. These are issues that must be considered and thought through. Finally, in the same light, the question must be asked; how reliant does Thailand want to become on the Chinese tourism numbers? I like the Chinese (in small groups), but if you base your tourism economy on them, and they decide to punish you for some reason, you are screwed (South Korea and the THAAD deployment, 2017, comes to mind).

 

So Thailand, Western or Chinese? If you decide on both, exactly how are you going to do that?

 

Finally, tourism will change post-Covid, and I think a key element in future tourism is going to be ex-pats on social media. Currently, we see the power of social media in the Ukraine slaughter, and I think that we are still seeing its nascent power. Future tourism marketing will, in my view, have to focus on ex-pats as much as external media to attract customers, and this phenomenon will only grow. Don't believe me? How many reading this would consider a trip to a foreign land without trying to contact someone, directly or indirectly, to get a local take? 20 years ago, I would not have considered it, now it is unimaginable to NOT do it. In line with this, Thailand is going to have to treat its ex-pats better if they want favourable reviews. Can they do it? Don't know.

 

Circumstances, post-Covid, have changed and countries/tourism industries will need to change with the times. Can Thailand change with the times? Not sure, to be honest.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

[Grumpish]

33 minutes ago, vvdb.fr said:

personally I would like Thailand to go further and ask tourists in addition to vaccination against COVID, that of the flu, measles...

It is not because you have the money to travel that you have to do it ignoring the local populations...

Off topic - but given that measles has historically decimated indigenous populations, and still kills over 100,000 people every year, maybe measles vaccinations should be required in for visitors to some countries.

[EdwardV]

29 minutes ago, Shade_Wilder said:

So Thailand, Western or Chinese? If you decide on both, exactly how are you going to do that?

I don’t think Thailand needs to worry about Chinese tourists for now. It’s not likely they can come until the fall at the earliest. If they can’t get past the zero covid policy, it’s more like next year. It will be interesting to see what kind of numbers they will travel once they can again. 

[HiuMak]

Russian tourist in Thailand will be carrying lots of gold with them

[AdvocatusDiaboli]

1 hour ago, Shade_Wilder said:

So, Thailand, which is it? Security or a Tourism business?

Or why not both ….

News Forum - Bangkok officials install more than 62,000 security cameras around the capital

News Forum - TAT launches “Holideals” travel promotions with digital tokens as payment

[Somchai]

I was in the Dominican Rep in the Caribbean in January, and the vast majority of tourists were Russians there. Then I came to Phuket in February, and the majority of tourists were Russians there. My friend was in Mombasa, Kenya, and he says most tourists were Russians there.

So, this Ukrain war will have a disastrous effect on many tropical vacation destinations, from Asia to Africa and the Caribbean as Russians used to be the major source of tourism revenue in most of these countries.

Edited March 5, 2022 by Somchai

[Pinetree]

For Russians it is being reshaped, for the rest of us, it will make little to no difference, apart from ticket costs rising. .   

[Pinetree]

2 minutes ago, Somchai said:

Russians used to be the major source of tourism revenue in most of these countries.

This is a relatively modern phenomena, from after the fall of the USSR. Most Russians do not travel internationally and have little impact on world tourism, so says Expedia.

[DoUKnowWhoIAm]

1 hour ago, HiuMak said:

Russian tourist in Thailand will be carrying lots of gold with them

Or oil barrels

[Vigo]

A reduction in the number of Russia sourced tourists may be one of the best things that can happen for Thailand tourism.  The tourist visitors most likely to test positive for Covid19 upon arrival were Russian. This was one of the worst kept secrets and eventually leaked. 

https://thethaiger.com/news/national/most-phuket-tourists-infected-with-covid-travelled-from-russia-and-kazakhstan

There was a reason why the Russians were infected despite the clean Russian test results, and the reasons are already discussed online if one looks.  Had it not been for the Russian demographic, the  visitor data would have strongly supported a loosening of the test and go requirements especially for vaccinated visitors from western countries and Taiwan, Korea and Japan.  IMO, Thailand punished these tourists  because it did not wish to acknowledge that one of its promoted markets was tainted.

[Chatogaster]

3 hours ago, Shade_Wilder said:

"The loss of the Russian travellers underscores a critical need for the Thai government to quickly modify the Thailand Pass, or scrap it completely. With so many other factors now making international travel difficult, Thailand will have to rethink their short to medium term tourism strategies to retain its share of the international travel market."

 

Interesting article.

 

I see three major issues coming up for Thailand, and I wonder if they have the capacity/capability to address them adequately.

 

First, the ThaiPass. Many have written on this, so I won't bother adding much. However, I think that there is one very key point; the ThaiPass essentially takes power away from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and gives it to the Security Services to screen visitors. My question is will Thailand return the granting of visas to Embassies and consulates, or will it retain a centralized system where approval is given in Bangkok (yes, once again "The Kingdom of Bangkok and Surroundings" rears its head). If the power stays in Bangkok, it'll annoy people and they won't come. If it is returned to the Embassies and Consulates, Thailand will get more people. 

 

So, Thailand, which is it? Security or a Tourism business?

 

Second, how much of an effort is Thailand going to put in to bolster and grow the Western market? And, in tandem, how much of an effort is Thailand going to put in to bolster and grow the Chinese market? The logical, simple answer is to do both, but they are at times contradictory and mutually exclusive. Any hotel that does a buffet breakfast for Chinese tourists will see Westerners leave ASAP. Any shop that welcomes buses full of Chinese tourists will not see Western browsers/shoppers. These are issues that must be considered and thought through. Finally, in the same light, the question must be asked; how reliant does Thailand want to become on the Chinese tourism numbers? I like the Chinese (in small groups), but if you base your tourism economy on them, and they decide to punish you for some reason, you are screwed (South Korea and the THAAD deployment, 2017, comes to mind).

 

So Thailand, Western or Chinese? If you decide on both, exactly how are you going to do that?

 

Finally, tourism will change post-Covid, and I think a key element in future tourism is going to be ex-pats on social media. Currently, we see the power of social media in the Ukraine slaughter, and I think that we are still seeing its nascent power. Future tourism marketing will, in my view, have to focus on ex-pats as much as external media to attract customers, and this phenomenon will only grow. Don't believe me? How many reading this would consider a trip to a foreign land without trying to contact someone, directly or indirectly, to get a local take? 20 years ago, I would not have considered it, now it is unimaginable to NOT do it. In line with this, Thailand is going to have to treat its ex-pats better if they want favourable reviews. Can they do it? Don't know.

 

Circumstances, post-Covid, have changed and countries/tourism industries will need to change with the times. Can Thailand change with the times? Not sure, to be honest.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

Some first thoughts:

1. It wasn't uncommon for different embassies to apply different and badly documented rules for granting certain visas. Having that streamlined into a single, online point of access can also be considered a convenience (I'm not referring to the long list of current criteria or the deficiencies of its current implementation, just the principle of how & where to apply).
    
2. Covid and Ukraine are clear reminders that it is unwise to focus on a single source of tourists, so targeting a variety of sources is a must. When it comes to westerner versus Chinese tourists, I doubt they are mutually exclusive targets. In 2010 - 2020, the number of Chinese visitors was steadily increasing. If that was as off-putting to westerners as you suggested, you'd expect the number of western visitors to have declined throughout the decade. Instead, it has remained rather steady.
    
3. How/why would Thailand invest in expats to get more tourists? Things that would be appreciated by us (e.g. related to TM30, TM7, ownership) are irrelevant to ordinary tourists. I wouldn't be inclined to give a more favorable review about e.g. a beach just because I got a present from Thailand. Come to think of it, a more sensible approach to freedom of speech (like being able to give a fair but negative review) or double-pricing would be major things though.

 

Edited March 5, 2022 by Chatogaster
added double-pricing

[Convert54]

9 hours ago, Shade_Wilder said:

"The loss of the Russian travellers underscores a critical need for the Thai government to quickly modify the Thailand Pass, or scrap it completely. With so many other factors now making international travel difficult, Thailand will have to rethink their short to medium term tourism strategies to retain its share of the international travel market."

 

Interesting article.

 

I see three major issues coming up for Thailand, and I wonder if they have the capacity/capability to address them adequately.

 

First, the ThaiPass. Many have written on this, so I won't bother adding much. However, I think that there is one very key point; the ThaiPass essentially takes power away from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and gives it to the Security Services to screen visitors. My question is will Thailand return the granting of visas to Embassies and consulates, or will it retain a centralized system where approval is given in Bangkok (yes, once again "The Kingdom of Bangkok and Surroundings" rears its head). If the power stays in Bangkok, it'll annoy people and they won't come. If it is returned to the Embassies and Consulates, Thailand will get more people. 

 

So, Thailand, which is it? Security or a Tourism business?

 

Second, how much of an effort is Thailand going to put in to bolster and grow the Western market? And, in tandem, how much of an effort is Thailand going to put in to bolster and grow the Chinese market? The logical, simple answer is to do both, but they are at times contradictory and mutually exclusive. Any hotel that does a buffet breakfast for Chinese tourists will see Westerners leave ASAP. Any shop that welcomes buses full of Chinese tourists will not see Western browsers/shoppers. These are issues that must be considered and thought through. Finally, in the same light, the question must be asked; how reliant does Thailand want to become on the Chinese tourism numbers? I like the Chinese (in small groups), but if you base your tourism economy on them, and they decide to punish you for some reason, you are screwed (South Korea and the THAAD deployment, 2017, comes to mind).

 

So Thailand, Western or Chinese? If you decide on both, exactly how are you going to do that?

 

Finally, tourism will change post-Covid, and I think a key element in future tourism is going to be ex-pats on social media. Currently, we see the power of social media in the Ukraine slaughter, and I think that we are still seeing its nascent power. Future tourism marketing will, in my view, have to focus on ex-pats as much as external media to attract customers, and this phenomenon will only grow. Don't believe me? How many reading this would consider a trip to a foreign land without trying to contact someone, directly or indirectly, to get a local take? 20 years ago, I would not have considered it, now it is unimaginable to NOT do it. In line with this, Thailand is going to have to treat its ex-pats better if they want favourable reviews. Can they do it? Don't know.

 

Circumstances, post-Covid, have changed and countries/tourism industries will need to change with the times. Can Thailand change with the times? Not sure, to be honest.

 

Thoughts?

 

Very interesting topic. I will dive into the melee of opinion by firstly stating some (IMO) facts.

Tourism has  already been grossly impacted by covid-19 and although for some trains of thought that "post" Covid  it will re assume the previous normality of hordes of people re-distributing screeds of national currencies based on whatever/whichever aspect of appeal until next planned excursion into a global industry supportive of millions.

Gone. Gone  Gone.

Not only gone but unlikely to ever be "permitted" on such scale again or at least for the dubiously predictable  future.

Within the next decade (maximum) global movement of people will be regulated, administered,permitted on demonstrable records  of adherence to a consensus to a jurisdiction that is unlikely to be known to the global population should they be audacious enough to actually attempt to identify !

There will be an atmosphere that in effect will mimic the current perception of such as the Northern Korean reality but will be stupidly endorsed as installing global "democratic success" .

The sad harsh truth is that all it will do is indemnify  all and any that have and will continue to consider and treat humanity in general as stupid slaves.

Wealth buys weak Royals and  has ever been so!

 

[TheDirtyDurian]

8 hours ago, Somchai said:

I was in the Dominican Rep in the Caribbean in January, and the vast majority of tourists were Russians there. Then I came to Phuket in February, and the majority of tourists were Russians there. My friend was in Mombasa, Kenya, and he says most tourists were Russians there.

So, this Ukrain war will have a disastrous effect on many tropical vacation destinations, from Asia to Africa and the Caribbean as Russians used to be the major source of tourism revenue in most of these countries.

Zanzibar also full of Russians. 

[Stardust]

Aerflot : no more flights from Russia to any country in the world starting coming tuesday. All spareparts supply to all Russian Airlines are cut. This is a small time window for all Russians around the world.

[yselmike]

24 minutes ago, Stardust said:

Aerflot : no more flights from Russia to any country in the world starting coming tuesday. All spareparts supply to all Russian Airlines are cut. This is a small time window for all Russians around the world.

China? still flying to Turkey.The British government has warned their citizens to leave Russia.

[Dialemco]

Flights from Russia or not do not believe the Russian Government will allow its citizens to travel outside the Russian Federation.

[Cabra]

What I find most humorous about this opinion piece (from a Thai media outlet, of course) is that a war gets turned into a discussion about how it's going to affect tourism. Thailand has no tourism industry at the moment. It's anemic at best. Russian tourist were neither going to revive or destroy what is already on life support. People are suffering (being killed) in Ukraine and you worry about the ability of one nations ability to book a holiday Truth is if the world had moved more quickly to limit the  consumption of fossil fuels, relegating Russia to the dust bin would have had the same affect as closing all the neighborhood petrol stations.

[Artemis080]

26 minutes ago, Cabra said:

Russian tourist were neither going to revive or destroy what is already on life support.

Russian tourists were that life support. They have been the top arrivals in Phuket by far, twice as many as the next group (Germany), so it's going to impact the local economy starting this week.

We are witnessing the west trying to collapse the Russian economy, and quite rightly so. But to think there are not going to be repercussions for the entire world that will touch us all is naive.

Things can change very quickly as we've seen daily. I am left wondering who on earth even thinks this is a great time for a long haul two-week break.

[JoJoTexas]

Why would Thailand want Russians to come to their country?  Russian are committing genocide in Ukraine.

[EdwardV]

14 minutes ago, Artemis080 said:

But to think there are not going to be repercussions for the entire world that will touch us all is naive.

The worse repercussions will not be coming from the west trying (and likely to succeed) in collapsing the Russian economy. It’s going to come from what Russia has done. First you have the number 1 exporter of wheat attacking the number 4 exporter. Neither are shipping wheat. 80-90% of all agricultural from Russia ships out of the Black Sea. All of that is off line right now. It’s almost guaranteed Ukraine won’t be planting wheat this spring. The entire continent of Africa relies on that wheat (along with many other countries). Last time there was a cut in supply lead to the Arab Spring. This will be so much worse. Second Russia and Ukraine combined are the largest exporter of Pot Ash fertilizer. That’s now off line. The number one exporter of phosphate fertilizer is China and they have banned exports for internal reasons. Nitrate based fertilizer is four times more expensive than it was just a few months ago (it’s made with natural gas)  and will only get more expensive. Large portions of the world will be tying to grow this year without fertilizer. Even if the west didn’t sanction Russia, thing were going to get really bad. 

[Pinetree]

22 hours ago, Vigo said:

There was a reason why the Russians were infected despite the clean Russian test results, and the reasons are already discussed online if one looks. 

Russia is a criminal Nation, run by Mafia thugs with no regard for their people, or for the World community. Corruption there makes Thailand look like a model of honesty.   It has been like that for hundreds of years. Why anyone believes anything that comes out of Moscow, bar corruption and wanton criminality, is beyond me.  Wise Russians emigrate, as did my paternal Grandparents 105 years ago. 

[Scotty]

 

It's a loaded article. Tourism in Thailand isn't just bars, restaurants and cheap hotels. It consists of many niches, medical, wellness, fitness, adventure travel, students, tourists etc. I can personally say wellness and medical is going very well. So is a lot of fitness travel. The drunken girlie bars might be suffering, but they can't account for 'tourism' as a whole.

The Russians will hardly make a dent, especially once the travel bubble with India and China start soon...

Why were there more tourists from Russia than usual? Because they knew this would be their last vacation for a while. 

Do you believe Russians know what's going on ;-) They don't have a clue. They want to get on with their lives, but they have a dictator with low self-esteem and a huge ego pulling the strings, and they have to go alone to get alone or else...

 

[Donald]

17 hours ago, Convert54 said:

Very interesting topic. I will dive into the melee of opinion by firstly stating some (IMO) facts.

Tourism has  already been grossly impacted by covid-19 and although for some trains of thought that "post" Covid  it will re assume the previous normality of hordes of people re-distributing screeds of national currencies based on whatever/whichever aspect of appeal until next planned excursion into a global industry supportive of millions.

Gone. Gone  Gone.

Not only gone but unlikely to ever be "permitted" on such scale again or at least for the dubiously predictable  future.

Within the next decade (maximum) global movement of people will be regulated, administered,permitted on demonstrable records  of adherence to a consensus to a jurisdiction that is unlikely to be known to the global population should they be audacious enough to actually attempt to identify !

There will be an atmosphere that in effect will mimic the current perception of such as the Northern Korean reality but will be stupidly endorsed as installing global "democratic success" .

The sad harsh truth is that all it will do is indemnify  all and any that have and will continue to consider and treat humanity in general as stupid slaves.

Wealth buys weak Royals and  has ever been so!

Wise words, but I doubt that the average commentator here will see this. The greatly exaggerated Covid 19 threat has opened up the road to the great reset.