News Forum - Thailand to remain neutral on Russia-Ukraine conflict

[Thaiger]

Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha says Thailand will keep a neutral stance toward the Russia-Ukraine conflict. Speaking to MPs during their cabinet meeting yesterday, Prayut said they must consider Thailand’s the long-standing relations with Russia and tread carefully, an unnamed government official told the Bangkok Post. “We need to be composed and make decisions carefully. Thailand must maintain a neutral stance and bring Thais in Ukraine back home quickly.” After yesterday’s cabinet meeting, Prayut told reporters that Thailand will stick with Asean’s stance on the conflict. The grouping of Southeast Asian nations has called for “dialogue” among all parties involved to […]

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[pascal]

lol.....why it s not a surprise

[Shade_Wilder]

I don't particularly like or agree with it, but I can understand an official neutrality stance on the part of Thailand; it has relations with both entities, it couldn't do much even if it wanted to, and is far away.

However, there is neutrality and there is neutrality.

I would advocate assistance to the Ukrainian people in Thailand in terms of automatic visa extensions, perhaps some assistance (official or crowd-funded; I will happily pitch-in) with housing/food if/as needed and the turning of a blind eye to small violations of illegal working or other small gestures to help them. One can be neutral and still have a heart.

To the Russians, I say put them all on a plane and make them return to Russia with a message; civilized people do not condone your behaviour, and if you ever want to re-join the group of civilized peoples, then get the hell out of your neighbour's/cousin's country. Now.

Right effing now.

 

Edited March 2, 2022 by Shade_Wilder
Bad grammar because I am angry

[Cabra]

Even the Swiss took a position. If you can't see the difference between right and wrong then you are forever lost. Suffering of the Ukraine people (regardless of provocative or justification from either side) is still suffering. Invading armies killing in the name of any justification is always wrong. 

[Stardust]

2 minutes ago, Cabra said:

Even the Swiss took a position. If you can't see the difference between right and wrong then you are forever lost. Suffering of the Ukraine people (regardless of provocative or justification from either side) is still suffering. Invading armies killing in the name of any justification is always wrong. 

If you watched the UN session where all UN members boycot the speech of the Russian foreign affairs minister and left the building. This the world never seen before how they all united and get up. So it will be almost impossible to stay neutral when the world showed up and who is the agressor and liar. The statements clearly said it is about the safety for all countries now in the world and their sovereignity. Thailand is not in any position to stay neutral in this, or would be in any way able to be isolated.

[TopDeadSenter]

Makes sense. It wasn't Thailand's fault Europe based it's energy policy on the words of an autistic teenager, which left Germany dependant on Russian oil and gas(although the Germans found it amusing when Trump pointed this out and mocked him - that ended well hey Germany !!). It wasn't Thailand's fault that NATO acted on its expansionary dreams effectively backing Putin into a corner. It wasn't Thailand's fault the left spent 3 years baselessly blaming Putin for colluding with Trump and breaking the US elections ratchetting up the pressure and smearing the Russian president thousands of times day in day out.

Both sides seem as bad as each other. Thailand did well to decide to wind their necks in and sit this one out.

[Maxellus]

Coward.  Singapore, an ASEAN nation, has just imposed sanctions on Russia. Thai nationals are in danger but their prime minister is ok with that.  The fact that the conflict is distant is even more reason to take a moral stance on the side of Ukraine. Not less.   I'm willing to bet that this decision is largely influenced by Thailand's association with China.

[Stardust]

10 minutes ago, Maxellus said:

Coward.  Singapore, an ASEAN nation, has just imposed sanctions on Russia. Thai nationals are in danger but their prime minister is ok with that.  The fact that the conflict is distant is even more reason to take a moral stance on the side of Ukraine. Not less.   I'm willing to bet that this decision is largely influenced by Thailand's association with China.

Japan even sanctioned now Belarus not only Russia.

[EdwardV]

Unfortunately this war is very likely to last some time, and pictures and video of bombed civilians are just now staring to come out. It’s going to get worse real fast. That’s not the optic you want to be on the wrong side of, and neutrals will be consider on the wrong side. Even the Swiss saw that real quick. Those who remain neutral will eventually have to pay a price for that privilege. 

[ThaiEyes]

 

Thailand to remain neutral on Russia-Ukraine conflict
 

Of course they won’t bite the hand that feeds or that is personally lucrative for members of the administration 

 

[Thommo]

1 hour ago, Thaiger said:

Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha says Thailand will keep a neutral stance toward the Russia-Ukraine conflict. Speaking to MPs during their cabinet meeting yesterday, Prayut said they must consider Thailand’s the long-standing relations with Russia and tread carefully, an unnamed government official told the Bangkok Post. “We need to be composed and make decisions carefully. Thailand must maintain a neutral stance and bring Thais in Ukraine back home quickly.” After yesterday’s cabinet meeting, Prayut told reporters that Thailand will stick with Asean’s stance on the conflict. The grouping of Southeast Asian nations has called for “dialogue” among all parties involved to […]

The story Thailand to remain neutral on Russia-Ukraine conflict as seen on Thaiger News.

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needs to grow some

[Noble_Design]

Calling Thailand coward for remaining neutral while oneself still buying Russian oil and gas.

Okay.jpeg

[Noble_Design]

4 minutes ago, Transam said:

Who is "oneself"...?

Europe

Quote

Europe relies on Russia for around 40% of its natural gas.

https://www.euronews.com/green/2022/02/24/what-happens-if-russia-shuts-off-gas-supplies-to-europe

[Noble_Design]

Just now, Transam said:

All part of war, our countrymen, women and children have all had to deal with that stuff in the past.

Beating the aggressors is paramount.... 

Agree that beating the aggressor is paramount but you can't do it in installments right?

It's like saying to Russia I'm going to beat you a little bit this month because my new oil & gas supply hasn't arrive, and then I'll beat you a little more next month and so on and so on until maybe next year when I have achieved energy independence from you then I only I will go all out.

[francoa]

This tells you everything you need to know about Thai government.

[Fundok]

Somehow not really surprising, sadly. Other countries in Asia have taken a firm stance. Maybe Thailand doesn't want to lose those Russian tourist $$$, but they will be lost anyway, at least to a large extent. With a dwindling Ruble and being cut-off from the international banking system (Russian banking/credit cards unlikely to work) it is not hard to predict that the flow of Russian tourists will decrease pretty much with immediate effect. So actually there isn't much to be gained for Thailand staying neutral, but it might backfire internationally.

[Fundok]

2 hours ago, Shade_Wilder said:

I don't particularly like or agree with it, but I can understand an official neutrality stance on the part of Thailand; it has relations with both entities, it couldn't do much even if it wanted to, and is far away.

However, there is neutrality and there is neutrality.

I would advocate assistance to the Ukrainian people in Thailand in terms of automatic visa extensions, perhaps some assistance (official or crowd-funded; I will happily pitch-in) with housing/food if/as needed and the turning of a blind eye to small violations of illegal working or other small gestures to help them. One can be neutral and still have a heart.

To the Russians, I say put them all on a plane and make them return to Russia with a message; civilized people do not condone your behaviour, and if you ever want to re-join the group of civilized peoples, then get the hell out of your neighbour's/cousin's country. Now.

Right effing now.

Sending all Russians back with the message you propose would be anything but neutral.

[TopDeadSenter]

1 hour ago, Transam said:

All part of war, our countrymen, women and children have all had to deal with that stuff in the past.

Beating the aggressors is paramount.... 

Can you beat the aggressors by buying $1 BILLION worth of their energy supplies each day? Do you think sanctions would have been more effective if the Russians were literally cut off from income? I can tell you $1 billion buys a lot of weaponry and lessens the effect other sanctions have. Are the Germans and NATO still laughing and mocking basic criticism of their decision to rely on Russia to keep their houses warm?

 The threat and possibility of nuclear war has been heightened immeasurably thanks to German and other European nations having gone down this insane path to reliance on Russia for energy. Even a child could have foreseen the problem(not a Swedish child maybe). And now without effective sanctions, what options are left, other than full scale war. 

Beating stupidity is paramount.

[Fundok]

1 hour ago, Noble_Design said:

Calling Thailand coward for remaining neutral while oneself still buying Russian oil and gas.

Okay.jpeg

Changing supply chains from one day to another is not an easy feat. Canada has announced it will not buy Russian oil anymore and Germany, unfortunately increasingly being depending on Russian gas for the last 40 yrs or so has now decided to stop this dependency and look for alternative sources. Will take some time, but this will heavily backfire on Russia. I also asume that the USA will stop importing oil from Russia, maybe even put a ban on those buying it (like what they did with Iranian oil). So I see a stringent plan of action here. Russia will pay dearly for loosing its energy export markets.

[Alavan]

Thailand at its best.

Allways neutral, like in WWII, when the Allied and Japanese fought

[Noble_Design]

11 minutes ago, Fundok said:

Changing supply chains from one day to another is not an easy feat. Canada has announced it will not buy Russian oil anymore and Germany, unfortunately increasingly being depending on Russian gas for the last 40 yrs or so has now decided to stop this dependency and look for alternative sources. Will take some time, but this will heavily backfire on Russia. I also asume that the USA will stop importing oil from Russia, maybe even put a ban on those buying it (like what they did with Iranian oil). So I see a stringent plan of action here. Russia will pay dearly for loosing its energy export markets.

Yes it is not an easy feat but if the West is serious about supporting Ukraine they should do more than just what conveniences them. Cut all oil and gas from Russia NOW, stop driving cars or heating home. Wear thicker jackets, walk or cycle. All these are just small sacrifices that the West must make if they want to stop the Russians. 

The West must also stop relying on the Russians to keep the International Space Station afloat. Don't depend on them to boost the ISS back to orbit or launch anymore supplies on the back of the Soyuz/Proton. 

I'm sure sacrificing some heating at home isn't such a big deal for the sake of the lives of Ukrainian children.

Edited March 2, 2022 by Noble_Design

[Fundok]

9 minutes ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Can you beat the aggressors by buying $1 BILLION worth of their energy supplies each day? Do you think sanctions would have been more effective if the Russians were literally cut off from income? I can tell you $1 billion buys a lot of weaponry and lessens the effect other sanctions have. Are the Germans and NATO still laughing and mocking basic criticism of their decision to rely on Russia to keep their houses warm?

 The threat and possibility of nuclear war has been heightened immeasurably thanks to German and other European nations having gone down this insane path to reliance on Russia for energy. Even a child could have foreseen the problem(not a Swedish child maybe). And now without effective sanctions, what options are left, other than full scale war. 

Beating stupidity is paramount.

Any evidence for the "1 bn per day"-quote (and in what currency?). According to one source (only in German, can't publish it here), in 2020 the total of all EU countries bought fossile energy (oil, gas, coal) in the vicinity of 67 bn €  frim Russia which is still a lot but far less than the figure you have stated.

[Shade_Wilder]

35 minutes ago, Fundok said:

Sending all Russians back with the message you propose would be anything but neutral.

 

Sigh... I wish that I could argue with your assessment of my post, but...

Honestly, I would LOVE to wake up tomorrow morning, turn on my computer, and read that they found Putin's bloated, bloody corpse hanging dead from a lamppost in Red Square.

However, as I noted, while I don't like it, I can see Thailand's decision. I would also add two more points; Thailand has never really had a Foreign Policy based on anything but self-interest, so why would anyone expect different now? The second point, as mentioned by a poster above, is that Thailand has allowed itself to become reliant on China, and China is neutral here. The cold hard Real Politic is that Thailand's tourism revival, and in many ways its entire economic revival, is based on getting the Chinese back and spending cash here. China has already demonstrated to the world that it will use its tourism numbers as a threat to get what it wants, and thus certainly would again; South Korea 2017 and the deployment of THAAD come to mind. Sorry Thailand; you messed up and now you pay the moral price for reliance.

Finally, as I am an eternal optimist, Thailand can always change its mind in the coming days if things become as ugly as I think they will. And, if things get as ugly as I think they might, we could actually see a change; Thais are good-hearted and if they see a slaughter on their televisions and phones, anything is possible.

"Neutral" has many meanings, and Thailand can be 'Neutral' to please the Chinese and Russians, but can also be 'Neutral' and help the Ukrainians too; look at Switzerland and Ireland in WW2.

 

[Fundok]

20 minutes ago, Noble_Design said:

Yes it is not an easy feat but if the West is serious about supporting Ukraine they should do more than just what conveniences them. Cut all oil and gas from Russia NOW, stop driving cars or heating home. Wear thicker jackets, walk or cycle. All these are just small sacrifices that the West must make if they want to stop the Russians. 

The West must also stop relying on the Russians to keep the International Space Station afloat. Don't depend on them to boost the ISS back to orbit or launch anymore supplies on the back of the Soyuz/Proton. 

I'm sure sacrificing some heating at home isn't such a big deal for the sake of the lives of Ukrainian children.

The times of burning fossile energy are coming to an end, irrespective of this war. We only have one planet Earth and everything we can do to preserve it as a habitat that our children and grandchildren can still live on must be done. This goes far beyond this war.

 

3 minutes ago, Noble_Design said:

Yes it is not an easy feat but if the West is serious about supporting Ukraine they should do more than just what conveniences them. Cut all oil and gas from Russia NOW, stop driving cars or heating home. Wear thicker jackets, walk or cycle. All these are just small sacrifices that the West must make if they want to stop the Russians. 

The West must also stop relying on the Russians to keep the International Space Station afloat. Don't depend on them to boost the ISS back to orbit or launch anymore supplies on the back of the Soyuz/Proton. 

I'm sure sacrificing some heating at home isn't such a big deal for the sake of the lives of Ukrainian children.

I tend to believe that there is some mockery over here. It's not about making everyone freeze (this will not save one single life) but to get Russia to stop its aggression asap.

[TopDeadSenter]

25 minutes ago, Fundok said:

Any evidence for the "1 bn per day"-quote (and in what currency?). According to one source (only in German, can't publish it here), in 2020 the total of all EU countries bought fossile energy (oil, gas, coal) in the vicinity of 67 bn €  frim Russia which is still a lot but far less than the figure you have stated.

"Russia exports between 150bn and 190bn cubic metres of gas to Europe each year, typically fulfilling 30-40% of demand across the continent."

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/feb/25/how-can-europe-wean-itself-off-russian-gas

"MOSCOW, December 21. /TASS/. The price of gas in Europe in the course of exchange trading continues to beat historical records and has already exceeded $ 2,100 per 1,000 cubic meters according to the data of the London stock exchange ICE on Tuesday afternoon." from 21st December 2021

https://tass.com/economy/1378817

SO it would be fair to say with recent prices pre conflict that 1 cubic meter of gas is priced somewhere around $2

And it would appear that Russia exports(average between the low and high figures in the Bloomberg article) 170bn cubic meters to Europe each year.

$2 x 170bn = 340 billion $

SO on a per day basis, just a tickle under 1 billion $ a day. Although those prices were from before the conflict started. I expect the daily amount now will be over $1bn. Happy to be corrected if my mathematic is wrong.

Edited March 2, 2022 by TopDeadSenter