News Forum - Minimum daily wage in Thailand looks set to increase to 492 baht

[PRC]

Im nor against the idea but what people forget is that everybody who is on above the minimum salary like qualified carpenters who may be on 500 baht a day will now demand 600 a day to keep the parity which is completely  understandable  they should always be on a higher wage than laborers  but ultimately this rise will push up the price of everything 

[longwood50]

1 hour ago, Stardust said:

So you think to work under 300 baht the whole day ( mostly 12 hours) should be legal?

I don't believe it is the the governments or my business to determine what a willing person is willing to work for.  Would you say it is better that the person earn 300 baht for doing a job, versus not getting any job at all. 

Now, let me test you.  What if the person works selling pineapple, bananas, apples, Pad Thai etc in the market.  That person has to pay 300 baht a day to rent their spot plus spend the money to buy the products that he/she is selling.  What if they only earn 200 baht a day after expenses.   Minimum wage only provides for those who work for others, not for themselves. 

Also, the people like Makro, Tesco, Big C, etc would be impacted if they have workers earning less than minimum wage and would have to pass that additional expense on.  Now who buys their plastic bags, rice, plastic cutlery, meat, etc at those store.  The same vendors trying to make a living working long hours for themselves.  So you are helping one group by hurting another. 

It is total B**L that businesses don't pass those costs along.  Whether it is an increase in insurance, rent, utilities, taxes, and most importantly labor those all get passed on in the prices everyone working poor and wealthy alike pay for products.  Don't believe that.  Oil was $16 USD per gallon a little over a year ago now it approaches $90.  Did that cost get passed on to you with higher gas prices.  Look at beef, pork, milk eggs etc. all those went up in cost to the retailers.  Do you see them absorbing those additional costs or do you see the prices at the stores go up. 

Finally, have you done the person a favor when the person was earning 313 baht per day in a furniture manufacturing plant and the wage goes to 492 baht a 57% increase in pay and the owners of the plant no longer can compete with the cheaper factories in Cambodia, Vietnam, and the Philippines so the owners move their manufacturing to one of those countries and all the workers are unemployed. 

You seem to think there are no downsides or costs associated with raising the minimum wage.  I suggest this novel approach to someone who is at minimum wage.  GET A SKILL.  MAKE YOURSELF WORTH MORE.  Be a plumber, electrician, welder, etc don't depend on the government to mandate paying you more Give yourself a raise because you are worth more. 

[AussieBob]

8 hours ago, Stardust said:

But for sure in all other points I agree with you, also why they come up with that now. And there must be minimum wages for all including the migrants. Exploit the poor cannot be legal because otherwise they will also use child work or forced labour ( like in ccp China).

Thanks.  The whole system is corrupted in Thailand - fixing it to make it like in the west is not going to happen easily.  One day early on when we lived in Chiang Mai I observed a 'boss' forcing one of the workers to pay him money. My wife explained how many people have to pay part of what they get to their boss.  It looked like the bast^^^ took most of hers because he kept forcing her to hand over another note then another - when he stormed away she looked very upset.  After seeing that I walked past and slipped a 500 baht note to her quickly and walked on - she understood and quickly put it away and said nothing.  She was a toilet cleaner and obviously that is the exploitation that must somehow be stopped - pay her any more and she will just have to give it to the 'boss'.  Sad - but I now know it is a common thing in SEAsia. 

[Stardust]

5 hours ago, longwood50 said:

I don't believe it is the the governments or my business to determine what a willing person is willing to work for.  Would you say it is better that the person earn 300 baht for doing a job, versus not getting any job at all. 

Now, let me test you.  What if the person works selling pineapple, bananas, apples, Pad Thai etc in the market.  That person has to pay 300 baht a day to rent their spot plus spend the money to buy the products that he/she is selling.  What if they only earn 200 baht a day after expenses.   Minimum wage only provides for those who work for others, not for themselves. 

Also, the people like Makro, Tesco, Big C, etc would be impacted if they have workers earning less than minimum wage and would have to pass that additional expense on.  Now who buys their plastic bags, rice, plastic cutlery, meat, etc at those store.  The same vendors trying to make a living working long hours for themselves.  So you are helping one group by hurting another. 

It is total B**L that businesses don't pass those costs along.  Whether it is an increase in insurance, rent, utilities, taxes, and most importantly labor those all get passed on in the prices everyone working poor and wealthy alike pay for products.  Don't believe that.  Oil was $16 USD per gallon a little over a year ago now it approaches $90.  Did that cost get passed on to you with higher gas prices.  Look at beef, pork, milk eggs etc. all those went up in cost to the retailers.  Do you see them absorbing those additional costs or do you see the prices at the stores go up. 

Finally, have you done the person a favor when the person was earning 313 baht per day in a furniture manufacturing plant and the wage goes to 492 baht a 57% increase in pay and the owners of the plant no longer can compete with the cheaper factories in Cambodia, Vietnam, and the Philippines so the owners move their manufacturing to one of those countries and all the workers are unemployed. 

You seem to think there are no downsides or costs associated with raising the minimum wage.  I suggest this novel approach to someone who is at minimum wage.  GET A SKILL.  MAKE YOURSELF WORTH MORE.  Be a plumber, electrician, welder, etc don't depend on the government to mandate paying you more Give yourself a raise because you are worth more. 

If you cannot pay sombody 300 baht salary you should not make any business or have a company because you are not capable to manage it ! 

[longwood50]

23 minutes ago, Stardust said:

If you cannot pay sombody 300 baht salary you should not make any business or have a company because you are not capable to manage it ! 

It is obvious you have never owned a business.  It is neither my business, your business or the governments business to determine what a willing person is willing to work for and a willing employer is willing to pay. 

Again you miss the point that yes its great the low income worker gets a raise.  That is of course assuming the employer does not reduce their hours, eliminate them entirely, or move their operation to another country.   

Again, for every person you "help" you hurt someone else.  It is either the business owner who by the way may be that struggling pad thai vendor, or a motorcycle repair shop.   Even if it is Maakro or Tesco, those higher costs end up in the product.  So when the local Thai restaurant, or street vendor goes to those stores to buy their coffee, tea, plastic bags etc that are now all more expensive they have to either earn less or pass the cost along.  Guess what not everyone who shops at Maakro or Tesco makes the Forbes list of the wealthiest people.  Those making the least are hurt the most by price increases. 
 

If the person is willing to work for that amount of money then that is their personal decision.  If they feel they are worth more than prove it by going to another employer willing to pay them more.  Finally, if they have such meager skills that can only command 300 baht an hour don't blame the employer.  Blame them on the worker who should get a skill whether that is as an electrician, plumber, carpenter, brick layer, or welder so they can earn more. Stop injecting your "opinion' for what is fair for the person working who is willing to do so.  They obviously feel it is fair or they would not do it. 

[Stardust]

2 minutes ago, longwood50 said:

It is obvious you have never owned a business.  It is neither my business, your business or the governments business to determine what a willing person is willing to work for and a willing employer is willing to pay. 

Again you miss the point that yes its great the low income worker gets a raise.  That is of course assuming the employer does not reduce their hours, eliminate them entirely, or move their operation to another country.   

Again, for every person you "help" you hurt someone else.  It is either the business owner who by the way may be that struggling pad thai vendor, or a motorcycle repair shop.   Even if it is Maakro or Tesco, those higher costs end up in the product.  So when the local Thai restaurant, or street vendor goes to those stores to buy their coffee, tea, plastic bags etc that are now all more expensive they have to either earn less or pass the cost along.  Guess what not everyone who shops at Maakro or Tesco makes the Forbes list of the wealthiest people.  Those making the least are hurt the most by price increases. 
 

If the person is willing to work for that amount of money then that is their personal decision.  If they feel they are worth more than prove it by going to another employer willing to pay them more.  Finally, if they have such meager skills that can only command 300 baht an hour don't blame the employer.  Blame them on the worker who should get a skill whether that is as an electrician, plumber, carpenter, brick layer, or welder so they can earn more. Stop injecting your "opinion' for what is fair for the person working who is willing to do so.  They obviously feel it is fair or they would not do it. 

Sorry to tell you that my family has a company. And for sure if the company is not able to pay 300 baht salary the company is a failure! By the way in my education/ University was economy and management a part of it! And you learned exactly what?!

[Convert54]

On 2/9/2022 at 10:59 AM, KaptainRob said:

Not approved yet but if it gets the nod you can be sure Anutin will use it as vote-buying among lower paid Thai's. 

Can it be considered  anything but at this time? Not all get the last generous  increase !

[Faz]

An offensive post and replies have been removed.

[astro]

11 hours ago, longwood50 said:

 I suggest this novel approach to someone who is at minimum wage.  GET A SKILL.  MAKE YOURSELF WORTH MORE.  Be a plumber, electrician, welder, etc don't depend on the government to mandate paying you more Give yourself a raise because you are worth more. 

You keep repeating this unasked-for advice to the poor, yet I think you don't know how offensive this is.

More often than not, it's not that they haven't thought of that themselves, they just cannot afford expensive training while they struggle to put food on the table. Minimum wage has the effect of encouraging in-company training, businesses want to groom and keep workers they have to pay more for.

Also, your arguments completely ignore the disparity of power in negotiating wages - someone who struggles to survive will accept sub-sustenance pay, it's called "exploitation".

Edited February 10, 2022 by astro

[longwood50]

13 hours ago, Stardust said:

By the way in my education/ University was economy and management a part of it!

Well it is obvious by this statement it was not English Grammar.  

From Forbes:

Raising the minimum wage has a number of serious and negative unintended consequences. Employers, especially small family and midsize businesses, will be disproportionately hurt by the extra costs incurred. The local neighborhood stores and businesses with razor-thin profits will be forced to raise prices to make up for the addition labor costs. With the increased prices, customers may elect to take their business elsewhere. Losing customers means losing income, which could result in the business having to layoff workers.  

Large corporations with big budgets will weigh the increased labor costs and elect to invest in technology to displace workers. This trend will soon become prevalent in the food service industry, hospitality, retail, construction and manufacturing. Amazon recently opened up several prototype Amazon Go stores that are self described as “a new kind of store featuring the world's most advanced shopping technology. No lines, no checkout—just grab and go!” Fast food chains and large department stores will follow suit and implement self-service checkout to save costs. Corporate executives will recognize that the $15 per hour could be routinely raised. They will weigh the future unknown costs associated with additional increases, coupled with the ever-increasing insurance costs, plus the time-consuming task of finding employees, training them and dealing with turnover. It's easier and less expensive to have technology take over. The unintended consequence will be that there will be far fewer jobs available for those that need them most.

While some people may benefit with an increase in their hourly earnings, other employees will be let go to save costs. Employers may elect to cut hours across the board for everyone. Whichever way the employer goes, some of the workers will be in a worse situation. Seattle’s move to $15 an hour, a few years ago, resulted in workers given fewer hours and experiencing a net loss in pay.  


https://www.forbes.com/sites/jackkelly/2019/07/10/the-unintended-consequences-of-the-15-minimum-wage/?sh=500e6e26e4a7

[longwood50]

8 hours ago, astro said:

Also, your arguments completely ignore the disparity of power in negotiating wages - someone who struggles to survive will accept sub-sustenance pay, it's called "exploitation".

No each person has the ability to negotiate on his or her behalf.  Each person has the ability to seek out skills to improve their worth.  

When you sell your home you have the ability to state what price you find you are willing to sell it for.  If there are no willing buyers at that price you are too high and above the market rate.  Now you can scream that you have more invested in the property and it is worth more than that, but the marketplace is telling you that buyers can acquire properties equal to yours as prices lower than you are asking.  The MARKET determines what a fair price is and that includes labor. 

When you enter the job market you accept the highest price per hour paid by the employer willing to pay you that.  If you want a rate higher than that you must improve your value by having a skill set that is worth more.  If the most that any employer is willing to pay you is 392 baht per hour they are not exploiting you.  You are being paid the MARKET rate for people possessing skills similar to you. 

Not everyone in Thailand earns 336 baht per day.  A person seeking higher pay needs to look at what occupations pay more than the minimum wage and what they have to do to obtain the skills that pay those higher daily wages. 

As I have repeatedly said, I have compassion for those trying to live on 392 baht.  However raising the minimum wage to solve that is the wrong solution to address the problem.  It will hurt the very people it is intended to help.  Also as I have repeatedly said, the costs of raising the wages don't just suddenly get paid for out of thin air.  SOMEBODY PAYS FOR THOSE.  It is either the small shop owner already working on razor thin profits or it is customers of large and small businesses alike who pass the higher labor costs on.  Those higher costs are not just passed on to THOSE WHO CAN AFFORD THEM.  They are passed on to every customer rich and poor.  The poor being the ones who can least afford to pay more for their necessities. 

If there were no negatives to raising the minimum wage why stop at 492 baht.  Why not make it 5000 baht a day or 50,000 baht per day.  After all you believe that additional cost is someone magically paid for. 

 

[Pinetree]

We own and operate 3 separate farms. The family maintain them, but we need an additional 50 or so people to help at harvest times. We have always paid over the minimum wage for those workers, but the farms verge on the uneconomic. The government needs to be cognizant of the impact of a general rise, although i do support it. 

[Stardust]

2 hours ago, longwood50 said:

Well it is obvious by this statement it was not English Grammar.  

From Forbes:

Raising the minimum wage has a number of serious and negative unintended consequences. Employers, especially small family and midsize businesses, will be disproportionately hurt by the extra costs incurred. The local neighborhood stores and businesses with razor-thin profits will be forced to raise prices to make up for the addition labor costs. With the increased prices, customers may elect to take their business elsewhere. Losing customers means losing income, which could result in the business having to layoff workers.  

Large corporations with big budgets will weigh the increased labor costs and elect to invest in technology to displace workers. This trend will soon become prevalent in the food service industry, hospitality, retail, construction and manufacturing. Amazon recently opened up several prototype Amazon Go stores that are self described as “a new kind of store featuring the world's most advanced shopping technology. No lines, no checkout—just grab and go!” Fast food chains and large department stores will follow suit and implement self-service checkout to save costs. Corporate executives will recognize that the $15 per hour could be routinely raised. They will weigh the future unknown costs associated with additional increases, coupled with the ever-increasing insurance costs, plus the time-consuming task of finding employees, training them and dealing with turnover. It's easier and less expensive to have technology take over. The unintended consequence will be that there will be far fewer jobs available for those that need them most.

While some people may benefit with an increase in their hourly earnings, other employees will be let go to save costs. Employers may elect to cut hours across the board for everyone. Whichever way the employer goes, some of the workers will be in a worse situation. Seattle’s move to $15 an hour, a few years ago, resulted in workers given fewer hours and experiencing a net loss in pay.  


https://www.forbes.com/sites/jackkelly/2019/07/10/the-unintended-consequences-of-the-15-minimum-wage/?sh=500e6e26e4a7

I am not a native english speaker. You talking about exploitation and someone who cannot afford 300 baht salary has to work for himself and a business, enterprise or company who cannot afford it because it generate not enough benefit is a complete failure abd is not able to make any enterprise or manage a company or make a business. A business where the benefit is under 300 baht but need staff what it cannot afford is a failure and also the operator is absolut not qualified for any business, enterprise or company to manage it. And that are economy fundamentals! If your business only make a few hundred baht you have to work for yourself it is just simple like that. And this gives the question about your education level and who would make such a business?!

[astro]

6 hours ago, longwood50 said:

No each person has the ability to negotiate on his or her behalf.  Each person has the ability to seek out skills to improve their worth. 

Once again, you completely ignore the disparity of negotiating power and access to resources for training.

Quote

If there were no negatives to raising the minimum wage why stop at 492 baht.  Why not make it 5000 baht a day or 50,000 baht per day.  After all you believe that additional cost is someone magically paid for. 

That's a strawman argument.

Nobody has claimed there are no negative side effects, nor that there is 'magic' involved.

The rationale behind minimum wage is that workers can sustain their lifelyhood without having to rely on charity and state handouts.

If all costs and wages were increased, your argument that there won't be an improvement in spending power, would hold water, but raising the earnings of a proportion of workers alone will not have that effect.

[longwood50]

45 minutes ago, astro said:

The rationale behind minimum wage is that workers can sustain their lifelyhood without having to rely on charity and state handouts

That is not a strawman argument.  Studies have shown that the well intended but misguided notion of raising the minimum wage hurt those making minimum wage more than it helps. 

The notion that you or the government ' KNOWS BEST' is the height of arrogance.  You have a worker willing to work and an employer willing to pay.   As mentioned you neglect the fact that the majority of employers are small employers who earn meager profits from their businesses.  So you transfer the misery of not earning enough from the worker to the employer.  Now when that worker is fired because the store owner can not afford it, are you going to be the one to "assist them further" 

When the factory finds it can hire workers in Cambodia, Vietnam or Laos for less than the new minimum wage and the factory relocates, are you the one inviting those people 'you helped" into your home. 

Finally, wages are the single biggest expense for most businesses.  Those costs will be passed along.  What is being proposed is a 46% increase.  That shows up in food, clothing, rent, gas, and any other business that uses minimum wage employees.  That means the "working poor" will pay more for their necessities.  So congratulations you just spread the misery from the minimum wage worker to the other working poor. 

If you want to help those making minimum wage start by food, rent, and utility subsidies direct from the government. Start schools that train these people at government expense for better paying jobs.  Stop this ludicrous notion that somehow prosperity for the low income group can be shoved on the employers who somehow magically pay for the additional expense with no impact on others. 

[longwood50]

5 hours ago, Stardust said:

And this gives the question about your education level and who would make such a business?!

I have my undergraduate degree in Advertising and Business from Michigan State University and my MBA Masters of Busienss Administration from Western Michigan University.  I was a Senior Officer Managing a trust division for a one of the largest banks in the USA.  I owned and operated 4 businesses.  

You have this well intentioned but misguided notion that the employer through a minimum wage hike will solve the problem with the working poor.  You probably believe in the tooth fairy, Santa Claus and getting three wishes from Aladdin's Lamp.  Costs imposed on businesses do not just get imposed and then magically disappear.  The studies show when minimum wage is increased the ones hurt the most are those earning minimum wage who find their jobs are eliminated or their hours cut. So don't wait for any thank you letters from them if I were you. 

If you have empathy for them, it should be the government providing food, clothing, rent, and utility assistance.  That way they don't lose their jobs.  The government if it really cared about these people would start training programs where the unskilled can learn a trade and earn a living wage.  I can guarantee you impose a 46% increase on business in labor expense for those earning minimum wage and business will find a way to reduce and/or eliminate them.  Also the additional costs end up in the groceries, rent, gas, clothing, and utility expense that the other working poor also pay for.  Inflation is running rampant making it already difficult to pay for daily necessities for these people and you think it is a good idea that they chip in a little more.   Sorry, you failed economics.  If you really had empathy then suggest a path to getting them trained for a higher paying profession don't think you can just waive a magic wand with a minimum wage increase and think you have solved anything.  

[Poolie]

Oh well. You're obviously too intelligent for us lesser beings here, aren't you?

And you answered the question why everybody hates Americans. For that I thank you.

[astro]

All I can agree on, is that the 46% increase is far too much and will have a devastating effect.

As for Longwood's other arguments, I will not respond any more, since they only get repeated without acknowledging the points made by others.

[Benroon]

On 2/10/2022 at 11:24 AM, AussieBob said:

Simplistic ideology that has always eventually failed - socialism.  Appeals particularly to the young and naïve.  

Dont get me wrong, I agree that Thai employers should not be getting away with as much as they do with the low pay and poor conditions they provide  (including kickbacks and payments). But the answer is not to implement a 'western' style solution in the Thai 'system'. Those same Thai employers will just remove the Thai staff and employ imported workers who dont get social welfare - the system is not like in the west.  But definitely dont change it to the west - that is why everything costs so much in the west - the total costs of workers (not just the high salaries - it is all the other additional costs). The Unions are always complaining about Aussies not being employed in industries that are dominated by backpackers and other imported workers - but who can afford to pay someone $40,000+ a year (plus all the other costs) for someone to pick bananas or serve beers. 

I don’t see a difference in the basic principles regardless of geographical location. If they are importing cheaper labour thats usually an offence so employers will only do this with known risks attached  (story on here right now if a large labour bust in Kanchan). Once a few heavy sentences get handed down it should fade. 

 However everything  above- all of which they said in the U.K. when the minimum wage was introduced - it didn’t happen. 

Every time it goes up in the U.K. there are howls of protest across industry that it will lead to employment Armageddon - never happens (or mass import of labour apart from in areas where the Brits can’t be arsed to get out of bed in the cold) and despite the recent rise, the largest ever, the U.K. now has more in employment since records began. 

There are only benefits to ‘levelling up’ and taking the poorer members in society with you without the need to rock too many boats. 

Oh and for context I am probably very slight right of centre and a confirmed capitalist. 

[Benroon]

On 2/11/2022 at 6:30 PM, longwood50 said:

The studies show when minimum wage is increased the ones hurt the most are those earning minimum wage who find their jobs are eliminated or their hours cut. So don't wait for any thank you letters from them if I were you. 

If you have empathy for them, it should be the government providing food, clothing, rent, and utility assistance.  

Do they ? - not in the 5th largest economy in the world they don’t.  The minimum wage in the U.K. just took a large rise and the U.K. employment levels are at record highs. So your studies are simply wrong. Or only sent to business owners and let’s face it that’s turkeys voting for Christmas. 

Giving a helping hand via a minimum wage (which also goes someway to removing exploitation or face the consequences) is a small token which society as a whole who ‘benefit’ from it owes to their less fortunate fellow man) and allows those people to stand on their own two feet - full blown giving away food, clothing, housing etc is nanny state communism which DIScourages anyone to progress isn’t  it ? 
 

 

[AussieBob]

23 minutes ago, Benroon said:

I don’t see a difference in the basic principles regardless of geographical location. If they are importing cheaper labour thats usually an offence so employers will only do this with known risks attached  (story on here right now if a large labour bust in Kanchan). Once a few heavy sentences get handed down it should fade. 

 However everything  above- all of which they said in the U.K. when the minimum wage was introduced - it didn’t happen. 

Every time it goes up in the U.K. there are howls of protest across industry that it will lead to employment Armageddon - never happens (or mass import of labour apart from in areas where the Brits can’t be arsed to get out of bed in the cold) and despite the recent rise, the largest ever, the U.K. now has more in employment since records began. 

There are only benefits to ‘levelling up’ and taking the poorer members in society with you without the need to rock too many boats. 

Oh and for context I am probably very slight right of centre and a confirmed capitalist. 

I hear you and mostly agree. There definitely needs to be enforcement of the laws regarding illegal workers so easily being employed in Thailand - but we both know why that is not being done. I would say there are more illegal workers and visitors walking across the borders from neighbouring countries that tourists - and I reckon that if they were all tested the positive rate for Covid would be very high. 

But I dont agree about the massive minimum wage increases for many reasons. Example - ever been in a public toilet in the west - they are filthy and stink - and there are not a lot of them (removed) - why. Because unlike in Thailand, someone cannot survive in the west on the level of salary needed to be paid - those massive pay rises mean there are no toilet workers/cleaners in the west.  If somehow that balance between salaries and workers being employed can be maintained - then you are right.  Unemployment numbers are 'clouded' in the west for political purposes to say the least - many people are on welfare because why would they take up a job paying less or equal to that.  When I was in India we passed a road working site every day for 2 weeks - one day a bloke said he would have finished that work in 2 days back in Aust.  The 'guide' politely pointed out that it was not about doing it quickly or efficiently in India, it was about giving the men a job so they could buy food etc. for their families - the longer it took the better. 

[Fluke]

13 minutes ago, AussieBob said:

I hear you and mostly agree. There definitely needs to be enforcement of the laws regarding illegal workers so easily being employed in Thailand - but we both know why that is not being done. I would say there are more illegal workers and visitors walking across the borders from neighbouring countries that tourists - and I reckon that if they were all tested the positive rate for Covid would be very high. 

But I dont agree about the massive minimum wage increases for many reasons. Example - ever been in a public toilet in the west - they are filthy and stink - and there are not a lot of them (removed) - why. Because unlike in Thailand, someone cannot survive in the west on the level of salary needed to be paid - those massive pay rises mean there are no toilet workers/cleaners in the west.  If somehow that balance between salaries and workers being employed can be maintained - then you are right.  Unemployment numbers are 'clouded' in the west for political purposes to say the least - many people are on welfare because why would they take up a job paying less or equal to that.  When I was in India we passed a road working site every day for 2 weeks - one day a bloke said he would have finished that work in 2 days back in Aust.  The 'guide' politely pointed out that it was not about doing it quickly or efficiently in India, it was about giving the men a job so they could buy food etc. for their families - the longer it took the better. 

Yes, I recall being told in India that you should throw your rubbish on the floor and not put it in rubbish bins , because its someone's job to pick the litter up and putting rubbish in bins would make someone unemployed 

[Stardust]

I forgot to mention there is no succesfull economy in the worlds top listing without a minimum wage including the USA and also that a succesfull economy is messured by per capita gdp/ income! 

Edited February 14, 2022 by Faz
quote

[Marc26]

1 minute ago, Stardust said:

I forgot to mention there is no succesfull economy in the worlds top listing without a minimum wage including the USA and also that a succesfull economy is messured by per capita gdp/ income! 

 But I think the point all along is those economies can absorb the higher prices they come with raising the min wage

 

It becomes much harder in a country like Thailand 

Edited February 13, 2022 by Marc26

[Stardust]

On 2/11/2022 at 6:30 PM, longwood50 said:

I have my undergraduate degree in Advertising and Business from Michigan State University and my MBA Masters of Busienss Administration from Western Michigan University.  I was a Senior Officer Managing a trust division for a one of the largest banks in the USA.  I owned and operated 4 businesses.  

You have this well intentioned but misguided notion that the employer through a minimum wage hike will solve the problem with the working poor.  You probably believe in the tooth fairy, Santa Claus and getting three wishes from Aladdin's Lamp.  Costs imposed on businesses do not just get imposed and then magically disappear.  The studies show when minimum wage is increased the ones hurt the most are those earning minimum wage who find their jobs are eliminated or their hours cut. So don't wait for any thank you letters from them if I were you. 

If you have empathy for them, it should be the government providing food, clothing, rent, and utility assistance.  That way they don't lose their jobs.  The government if it really cared about these people would start training programs where the unskilled can learn a trade and earn a living wage.  I can guarantee you impose a 46% increase on business in labor expense for those earning minimum wage and business will find a way to reduce and/or eliminate them.  Also the additional costs end up in the groceries, rent, gas, clothing, and utility expense that the other working poor also pay for.  Inflation is running rampant making it already difficult to pay for daily necessities for these people and you think it is a good idea that they chip in a little more.   Sorry, you failed economics.  If you really had empathy then suggest a path to getting them trained for a higher paying profession don't think you can just waive a magic wand with a minimum wage increase and think you have solved anything.  

If sombody who even doesn't know something about economic fundamentals what is fundamental in every qualyfied school, university and no top economist ever would agree in any developed and economic succesfull country around the world, for sure I will doubt any of his claims or reports. Do you ever understand what are the messures of a succesfull economy?! Maybe google can help you what are the messures of a succesfull economy and the top ten listing of the most developed/ strongest economy countries.