News Forum - Police officer charged in fatal big bike collision with pedestrian enters monkhood

[PBS]

2 hours ago, Stonker said:

Totally, absolutely, 100% incorrect.

The decision to prosecute has absolutely nothing to do with the family and they have no say in it at all - it's entirely up to the police and the DPP.

While 'blood money' applies in some countries it doesn't here, and all paying compensation would affect would be damages.

Completely disagree, no matter what you have been told. To my knowledge negotiated compensation, rather than going though a Court precedure is commonplace in Thailand. A matter that has been discussed a number of times in Thai expat forums.

My Thai family experience, when a Westerner ran down and killed a family member police negotiated with the offender for cash compensation on behalf of the family. I personally met with the detecive who handled the matter. Offender and family were advised by police compensation is the end of the matter, no charges will be laid and family will be guranteed of compensation rather than going to Court with no gurantees. I recommended to the family they go to Court, but they refused due to concerns of corruption in the judicial system.

 

[poohy]

There's some strange Buddhist mumbo jumbo being quoted on here i had to check my watch to see if pubs were open

He killed somebody there dead he should be in prison not prancing around in an orange frock

luckily it seems even the orange frock bosses know they are on a hiding to nothing on this and have banned him

[Paulw]

Now I have read it all, why is he not locked up. A 21 year old policeman can afford a Ducati?? thats the first red flag!! Maybe he was receiving tuition from Joe Ferrari or the Red Bull heir!!

[Stonker]

3 hours ago, PBS said:

Completely disagree, no matter what you have been told. To my knowledge negotiated compensation, rather than going though a Court precedure is commonplace in Thailand. A matter that has been discussed a number of times in Thai expat forums.

My Thai family experience, when a Westerner ran down and killed a family member police negotiated with the offender for cash compensation on behalf of the family. I personally met with the detecive who handled the matter. Offender and family were advised by police compensation is the end of the matter, no charges will be laid and family will be guranteed of compensation rather than going to Court with no gurantees. I recommended to the family they go to Court, but they refused due to concerns of corruption in the judicial system.

It doesn't really matter whether you "disagree" or not or what you've read on "Thai expat forums".  There is no such 'blood money' system here to avoid criminal prosecution.

It simply doesn't exist.

If your family chose to take compensation rather than to give evidence against someone, and they were the key witnesses who were bought off as sometimes happens,  that's an entirely different matter but it doesn't apply here as there's no shortage of witnesses and possibly CCTV.

You're confusing witnesses being bought off so they don't give evidence with a 'blood money' system - they're two totally different things, and what you wrote was completely wrong.

[LoongFred]

It looks like they police asked him to disrobe and took him away in the police car. Thai news.

[PBS]

1 hour ago, Stonker said:

It doesn't really matter whether you "disagree" or not or what you've read on "Thai expat forums".  There is no such 'blood money' system here to avoid criminal prosecution.

It simply doesn't exist.

If your family chose to take compensation rather than to give evidence against someone, and they were the key witnesses who were bought off as sometimes happens,  that's an entirely different matter but it doesn't apply here as there's no shortage of witnesses and possibly CCTV.

You're confusing witnesses being bought off so they don't give evidence with a 'blood money' system - they're two totally different things, and what you wrote was completely wrong.

No, family were not witnesses.  From my personal experience, some Thais prefer receiving fiscal compensation rather than Western concept of judicial justice. You obviously haven't had the same exposure so kindly cease trying to tell me I'm incorrect. BTW it isn't 'blood money' which is primarily a M.E. cultural practice.

[Stonker]

6 hours ago, PBS said:

... police negotiated with the offender for cash compensation on behalf of the family. I personally met with the detecive who handled the matter. Offender and family were advised by police compensation is the end of the matter, no charges will be laid and family will be guranteed of compensation rather than going to Court with no gurantees.

I would have thought it was stating the blindingly obvious, but apparently not.

The "end of the matter" wasn't paying compensation to the family, it was paying off the police.

The first "negotiation" would have been between the offender and the local police over how much he would pay in order for them to hush it up so that no report was made incriminating him.

The second "negotiation" was between the police and the victim's family so that they'd agree to say nothing, making a show for you, leaving the major part paid for the police to divvy up.

That's how the system works here and always has, as long as it can be hushed up quietly.

Obviously, although you seem to have somehow overlooked it, that isn't possible in this case as it's already in the media and up to senior police level - just as it was with 'Boss' Red Bull, who could afford to pay compensation and to pay the police, etc, but it had just had too much publicity to be swept under the carpet.

52 minutes ago, PBS said:

No, family were not witnesses.  From my personal experience, some Thais prefer receiving fiscal compensation rather than Western concept of judicial justice. You obviously haven't had the same exposure so kindly cease trying to tell me I'm incorrect. BTW it isn't 'blood money' which is primarily a M.E. cultural practice.

Extraordinary that you still don't realise who was paid off.

It doesn't make a blind bit of difference if "some Thais prefer receiving fiscal compensation rather than Western concept of judicial justice" - it's simply not their decision to make over criminal charges.

If the police can hush it up in return for a sizeable 'fee' they all too frequently will, and they'll persuade the victim or their family to accept compensation and then the police will drop the charges / lose the paperwork.

In this case it obviously can't be hushed up so that isn't an option and there's no way charges can simply be dropped as you suggested as it's gone too far.

It's about police corruption, not about victim compensation - if you don't realise that, you evidently haven't had much "exposure" here

[Stonker]

2 hours ago, LoongFred said:

 Thai news.

Exactly - the cat's out of the bag, the genie's out of the  bottle, the whistle's been blown, Pandora's box has been opened, etc.

[RampantRabbit]

14 hours ago, Stonker said:

Etc, etc, etc.

Precisely why I didn't give you an answer before.

It doesn't matter what you believe - what matters is what she believed and her family believe.

They're the ones affected, not you.

If it helps her father come to terms with her death, then it helps.

That's "reality", regardless of your views on other people's beliefs.

Belief is  nothing 

[Stonker]

12 minutes ago, RampantRabbit said:

Belief is  nothing 

Nothing to you, evidently, but not everyone shares your view.

[Marc26]

8 hours ago, Stonker said:

It doesn't really matter whether you "disagree" or not or what you've read on "Thai expat forums".  There is no such 'blood money' system here to avoid criminal prosecution.

It simply doesn't exist.

If your family chose to take compensation rather than to give evidence against someone, and they were the key witnesses who were bought off as sometimes happens,  that's an entirely different matter but it doesn't apply here as there's no shortage of witnesses and possibly CCTV.

You're confusing witnesses being bought off so they don't give evidence with a 'blood money' system - they're two totally different things, and what you wrote was completely wrong.

I disagree with you 

My wife and I were just discussing this exact topic recently

Well actually an overall discussion on life being worth X amount in Thailand 

 

And she agreed that there is a "blood money" system

And often that assigns a value on a poorer person who was killed

 

They feel they can just pay money because the person's family is poor and they are lucky receiving that money

 

And the police are absolutely instrumental in pushing that system

 

My gf got hit by a drunk driver in Patong and her passenger, a 15yr old girl, got killed

The police gave out my address to the suspect's family so they could come and intimidate my gf 

The police harassed my gf to the point she had to leave Phuket 

 

It's all tied into the "blood money" system where they often assign a value to someone killed 

Often with the police collecting their commission 

[Vince]

16 hours ago, Guest1 said:

Very likely, mediating for the cut is in the BiB job description.

...

No doubt "corrupt, mercenary, and motivated by money" are all in the police job hiring ads, right?

Absolutely nothing done in Thailand is done by people who deserve any respect, have any family or honor, and so deserve only sneers and contempt.

Because they're racist. 

Or am I misreading your post?

 

[RampantRabbit]

4 hours ago, Stonker said:

Nothing to you, evidently, but not everyone shares your view.

You can believe anything you  want.many believe they can fly the reality though is  different. Reality dont  care  about beliefs being a monk shaving yer eyebrows aint going to do anything to bring back the doctor, maybe if they all  stopped  believeing  in Karma  would be a start.

[HiuMak]

16 hours ago, poohy said:

There's some strange Buddhist mumbo jumbo being quoted on here i had to check my watch to see if pubs were open

He killed somebody there dead he should be in prison not prancing around in an orange frock

luckily it seems even the orange frock bosses know they are on a hiding to nothing on this and have banned him

Monkhood is more torturous. At least they serve you food in Prison and give you shoes

[Fanta]

4 hours ago, Marc26 said:

It's all tied into the "blood money" system where they often assign a value to someone killed 

It’s called compensation and, of course, the victims family would employ the best negotiators available to them, the police. Normally the driver’s insurance company would pay part of the compensation money but as the rider in this case had no insurance that is not an option. The decision to press criminal charges is the responsibility of the police, not the family. Look at the Red Bull case - the guy allegedly ran over the cop and within 24 hours he and his mother were at the dead cops family home paying them money to not pursue civil damages however the criminal charges still went ahead because of the media uproar. Corruption exists and if police don’t press charges there is always the possibility that is the motivation. You cannot legally pay money to avoid a vehicular manslaughter charge. And about the monk business - the cop cannot avoid charges/prison because he tried to enter the monkhood. He went in there to earn brownie points FOR the deceased victim, not for himself. Whether some agree with that practice is irrelevant. 

[Fanta]

12 minutes ago, HiuMak said:

Monkhood is more torturous. At least they serve you food in Prison and give you shoes

The free food is fishheads or small portions of chicken, cabbage and lots of rice. The only time the food is changed to something vaguely edible in a Thai prison is when the relevant external authorities come to inspect the meals served one day a year and when the monks come a few times a year. Shoes are forbidden. Flip flops if you’re lucky. Monkhood would be comparative luxury unless nowadays monks are locked up in cells for 14 hours a day and treated like subservient shit. 

[PBS]

11 hours ago, Stonker said:

I would have thought it was stating the blindingly obvious, but apparently not.

The "end of the matter" wasn't paying compensation to the family, it was paying off the police.

The first "negotiation" would have been between the offender and the local police over how much he would pay in order for them to hush it up so that no report was made incriminating him.

The second "negotiation" was between the police and the victim's family so that they'd agree to say nothing, making a show for you, leaving the major part paid for the police to divvy up.

That's how the system works here and always has, as long as it can be hushed up quietly.

Obviously, although you seem to have somehow overlooked it, that isn't possible in this case as it's already in the media and up to senior police level - just as it was with 'Boss' Red Bull, who could afford to pay compensation and to pay the police, etc, but it had just had too much publicity to be swept under the carpet.

Extraordinary that you still don't realise who was paid off.

It doesn't make a blind bit of difference if "some Thais prefer receiving fiscal compensation rather than Western concept of judicial justice" - it's simply not their decision to make over criminal charges.

If the police can hush it up in return for a sizeable 'fee' they all too frequently will, and they'll persuade the victim or their family to accept compensation and then the police will drop the charges / lose the paperwork.

In this case it obviously can't be hushed up so that isn't an option and there's no way charges can simply be dropped as you suggested as it's gone too far.

It's about police corruption, not about victim compensation - if you don't realise that, you evidently haven't had much "exposure" here

Never claimed family experience wasn't about corruption. On the other hand it was clearly stated family had the choice to decline offer of compensation and go to Court. As already stated they were concerned regards judicial process and receive nothing. As an example the offender could have paid a bribe to police to have his passport returned and depart Thailand. 

To state the obvious, Thailand has endemic corruption and many resolve their issues outside of the legal processes by agreeing to compensation which is exactly what happened with my Thai family. To claim compensation is not a component of Thai culture and 'law enforcement' process is total BS.

[Marc26]

1 hour ago, Fanta said:

It’s called compensation and, of course, the victims family would employ the best negotiators available to them, the police. Normally the driver’s insurance company would pay part of the compensation money but as the rider in this case had no insurance that is not an option. The decision to press criminal charges is the responsibility of the police, not the family. Look at the Red Bull case - the guy allegedly ran over the cop and within 24 hours he and his mother were at the dead cops family home paying them money to not pursue civil damages however the criminal charges still went ahead because of the media uproar. Corruption exists and if police don’t press charges there is always the possibility that is the motivation. You cannot legally pay money to avoid a vehicular manslaughter charge. And about the monk business - the cop cannot avoid charges/prison because he tried to enter the monkhood. He went in there to earn brownie points FOR the deceased victim, not for himself. Whether some agree with that practice is irrelevant. 

Because of the media uproar

If there wasn't

 

For people saying there isn't a "blood money' system

 

I bet if we compared a sample of people being killed

The compensation would be closely commiserate with their financial/perceived status

 

That's putting a value on a human life, ie "blood money"

[Fanta]

1 hour ago, Marc26 said:

Because of the media uproar

If there wasn't

For people saying there isn't a "blood money' system

I bet if we compared a sample of people being killed

The compensation would be closely commiserate with their financial/perceived status

That's putting a value on a human life, ie "blood money"

sigh….. financial compensation is a civil matter. Call it blood money, call it what you want to stoke the outrage or try to prove your point. It is not a legal system although it may be systematic. Any legal acknowledgement of compensation paid is regarded as a show of remorse by the court. Criminal charges are unrelated to compensation for losses. Corruption is the reason many victim’s families accept an out of court settlement and also the reason some offenders are not criminally charged. In another world the police would charge all wrong doers regardless of perceived social or financial status. In this world life is neither fair, balanced nor equitable. 

[Marc26]

13 minutes ago, Fanta said:

sigh….. financial compensation is a civil matter. Call it blood money, call it what you want to stoke the outrage or try to prove your point. It is not a legal system although it may be systematic. Any legal acknowledgement of compensation paid is regarded as a show of remorse by the court. Criminal charges are unrelated to compensation for losses. Corruption is the reason many victim’s families accept an out of court settlement and also the reason some offenders are not criminally charged. In another world the police would charge all wrong doers regardless of perceived social or financial status. In this world life is neither fair, balanced nor equitable. 

Sigh.....you literally just described a "blood money" system 

 

Glad we can agree........

 

PS.....Did you think we thought a "blood money system " is the official system??  

[Stonker]

3 hours ago, PBS said:

On the other hand it was clearly stated family had the choice to decline offer of compensation and go to Court. As already stated they were concerned regards judicial process and receive nothing. 

Jesus H Christ.

They were given the choice by the local police because the police were i) corrupt and ii) in a position to be able to cover it up as there had been no publicity and they could 'lose' the paperwork and report an entirely different story - as happened initially with Joe Ferrari and in the 'Boss' case.

To return to your original point:

On 1/26/2022 at 9:07 AM, PBS said:

One can assume the family of the police guy will offer compensation to the Doctor's family; if accepted there will not be any prosecution.

Absolute bollox.

It can't be covered up as it's already in the media so that's not an option.

[Stonker]

1 hour ago, Marc26 said:

Sigh.....you literally just described a "blood money" system 

No, @Fanta did NOT "literally just describe a "blood money" system".

Blood money systems, which exist not only in parts of the Middle East but elsewhere, ARE "official", fully legal processes which are part of the judicial system.

Pay the blood money and the case is officially closed regardless of the evidence and the publicity - and the guilt.

That is NOT the system here, where it's it depends entirely on police corruption and the police being in a position to tamper with the evidence and avoid any publicity.

That obviously doesn't apply here as there has been far too much publicity, just as it clearly doesn't apply in the 'Boss' Red Bull and 'Joe Ferrari' cases.

1 hour ago, Marc26 said:

PS.....Did you think we thought a "blood money system " is the official system??  

Well, you and a couple of others here clearly don't know that blood money systems ARE official systems and that they're not dependent on police corruption and the evidence and the crime being concealed.

https://m.dw.com/en/pakistan-how-blood-money-laws-allow-murderers-to-be-pardoned/a-59173115

https://m.timesofindia.com/india/why-islamic-law-allows-blood-money-to-let-a-killer-go-free/articleshow/83464090.cms

https://www.jstor.org/stable/744600

[Marc26]

6 minutes ago, Stonker said:

No, @Fanta did NOT "literally just describe a "blood money" system".

Blood money systems, which exist not only in parts of the Middle East but elsewhere, ARE "official", fully legal processes which are part of the judicial system.

Pay the blood money and the case is officially closed regardless of the evidence and the publicity - and the guilt.

That is NOT the system here, where it's it depends entirely on police corruption and the police being in a position to tamper with the evidence and avoid any publicity.

That obviously doesn't apply here as there has been far too much publicity, just as it clearly doesn't apply in the 'Boss' Red Bull and 'Joe Ferrari' cases.

Well, you and a couple of others here clearly don't know that blood money systems ARE official systems and that they're not dependent on police corruption and the evidence and the crime being concealed.

https://m.dw.com/en/pakistan-how-blood-money-laws-allow-murderers-to-be-pardoned/a-59173115

Ok my bad

I did not realize there are official blood money systems

 

But I think it's fair to say Thailand has a robust non-official blood money system

[Stonker]

9 minutes ago, Marc26 said:

Ok my bad

I did not realize there are official blood money systems

But I think it's fair to say Thailand has a robust non-official blood money system

ONLY where police corruption can hide the evidence and the guilt.

That obviously isn't the case here, just as it isn't the case with 'Joe Ferrari' and 'Boss' Red Bull.

Thank you, though, for having the grace to say that you were mistaken.

It's a part of Sharia law, at least in some countries - it's not part of any legal system here, just a by-product of police corruption.

[oldschooler]

2 hours ago, Marc26 said:

Sigh.....you literally just described a "blood money" system 

Glad we can agree........

PS.....Did you think we thought a "blood money system " is the official system??  

The term “civil” implies courts so replace in prior post with “ cultural” to align all here ….